Sous Vide for fermented sausage?

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buzzy

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Looking for the thoughts & opinion of those that are more knowledgeable than me on making fast fermented sausages. If I make a batch of summer sausage with the proper amount of Bactoferm F-LC, dextrose & cure. Then stuff & vacuum seal. From there put in sous vide at 100 degrees for 24 hrs. Pull out of bags & hang to dry before heading to smoker. I figure the moisture from meat would give good humidity. Does this sound good or am I missing something? Would end product be just as good as using fermentation chamber?
Thanks for all thoughts & opinions in advance.
 

conradjw

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I am waiting to hear some feedback on this process myself. I make a lot of salami, polish sausage and many other cured/smoked products.

I usually spend many worrisome hours tending to the smoker to not over cook, or get the sausage to hot and end up cooking the fat out.

I always wondered if I could just put the sausage in the smoker just to get my smoke taken care of. Then remove the sausage bag it then put in the Sous Vide bath to bring it up to the 152 degree temperature and finish it? Once the Sous Vide brings it to the correct temperature then cool it down quickly for the bloom?

Buzzy, great post!
 

tropics

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I am waiting to hear some feedback on this process myself. I make a lot of salami, polish sausage and many other cured/smoked products.

I usually spend many worrisome hours tending to the smoker to not over cook, or get the sausage to hot and end up cooking the fat out.

I always wondered if I could just put the sausage in the smoker just to get my smoke taken care of. Then remove the sausage bag it then put in the Sous Vide bath to bring it up to the 152 degree temperature and finish it? Once the Sous Vide brings it to the correct temperature then cool it down quickly for the bloom?

Buzzy, great post!
conradjw You can do that it is the same as finishing in a water bath.
 

pc farmer

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Looking for the thoughts & opinion of those that are more knowledgeable than me on making fast fermented sausages. If I make a batch of summer sausage with the proper amount of Bactoferm F-LC, dextrose & cure. Then stuff & vacuum seal. From there put in sous vide at 100 degrees for 24 hrs. Pull out of bags & hang to dry before heading to smoker. I figure the moisture from meat would give good humidity. Does this sound good or am I missing something? Would end product be just as good as using fermentation chamber?
Thanks for all thoughts & opinions in advance.


Pretty sure you need oxygen for fermenting to happen.
 
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SmokyMose

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I've done the sous vide finish thing with NON fermented sausage, but like noted above, fermented sausage is a whole different animal. It takes time and drying to lose weight.
What's the hurry?
 

daveomak

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Buzzy....... Please get Marianski's book....

Marianski 1.jpg
 
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buzzy

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NO !!! Fermenting is a science.... Oxygen and evaporation of internal moisture is necessary for the ferment to properly happen....
That method encourages any botulism bacteria to flourish.....
do not mess with food science...
Again thanks everybody. Oxygen is what I overlooked but yet you want no oxygen to ferment vegetables. HUH !!I’ve been doing a lot of online reading which is confusing me. Some are talking about long low temp fermenting others about higher temp fast fermenting. I’d like to dabble ( for lack of a better word. Not going to go into this half ass) fermented meat.

dave I do not want to mess with food science but want to know how to ferment meat. Thanks for the book advice. That could put me on the right path. This is very confusing for a newbie.
 
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BGKYSmoker

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The heat you mentioned will kill the bactoferm agent.
"Then stuff & vacuum seal. From there put in sous vide at 100 degrees for 24 hrs"

Dont rush the fermentation process. You need controlled heat from 70-88* and a slight air flow.
 
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indaswamp

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Buzzy, Here is some of what I have been studying as I have been researching on meatsandsausages.com as I wait for my Marianski books to arrive....there are basically 3 types of fermented sausages, fast, medium and traditional slow fermented. Most all American types are fast fermented with a high pH. drop into the 4.6-5 range. Summer sausages fall into this category. The fast pH. drop creates inhospitable conditions for Staphylococcus aureus which is one little bug that can tolerate high salt concentrations and low moisture levels. It's weakness is acid sensitivity.

Good read:
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage-types/fermented-sausage/standards
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage-types/fermented-sausage/traditional
 
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indaswamp

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Another great resource...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdnBWzYQfkql-o460NTL1Tw

This guy Eric uses fast fermentation and checks the pH drop with a pH meter as is ferments.
He likes slow fermentation products, but loves the fast fermentation for quick acid production as a safety measure to prevent the growth of bad bacteria. So, when the pH drops below 5.3 and above 5.1; then he pulls the salami from fermentation and moves them to drying chamber to dry as a slow fermented salami.
If you forgo the pH. testing with a meter, it is difficult to know the exact time to stop fermentation and you will end up with a fast fermentation product with a pH in the 4.8 range.

Why does the pH matter?
Well because the staph bacteria in the culture are what convert nitrate to nitrite and also contribute to flavor in the slow fermented salamis.......and they stop these processes when the pH drops that low.
 
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zwiller

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Gonna bring this one up again. Can anyone please post specifics that this is bad? There are A LOT of people doing this now. Search and you will see. Pretty sure this is how Slim Jims and storebought SS like Hickory Farms are made.
 

SmokinEdge

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Search and you will see. Pretty sure this is how Slim Jims and storebought SS like Hickory Farms are made.
Products like Slim Jim and Hickory Farms products, I’m pretty sure are not fermented in the traditional sense, rather they lower PH (increase acidity) of the meat by adding a product called GDL (glucono-delta-lactone) and or citric acid. This, along with thermal processing makes the meats shelf stable and safe.
 
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zwiller

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Products like Slim Jim and Hickory Farms products, I’m pretty sure are not fermented in the traditional sense, rather they lower PH (increase acidity) of the meat by adding a product called GDL (glucono-delta-lactone) and or citric acid. This, along with thermal processing makes the meats shelf stable and safe.
Both show lactic acid cultures and dextrose in their ingredients but agree with you on thermal processing after the ferment. SJ shows citric acid but HF shows neither GDL or citric acid.
 

jkc64

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I'm interested in the SV fermenting also. I've read a few articles on the net about it but don't trust posts from sources outside of somewhere like this. In the years I've been here if someone posts a questionable method it gets called out real quick.
 

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