Potato Vs. Corn Starch

[cptnding]

I have not tried this but remembered seeing the video:

 

[SmokinEdge]

Maybe going off topic but is there a tutorial for sharpening grinder blades some where?

Here is one, simple process from crankybuzzard

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/sharpen-your-grinder-blade-and-true-the-plates.175359/

 

[DougE]

All that said, in some sausages I find the gel from potato starch a nice texture addition, it’s subtle but it’s nice

That's where I stand. I can get a good bind through protein extraction without the use of binders, but they have a place in a few of my recipes.

 

[indaswamp]

IMO, phosphates are a real game changer.....

 

[SmokinEdge]

IMO, phosphates are a real game changer.....

Agree, and much more effective in sausage made right. Phosphate brings the receipts. But you first must make the sausage right in terms of process.

 

[KBFlyer]

Always on hand in my house

 

[SmokinEdge]

Always on hand in my house
View attachment 687414

Staples for me as well, although I have yet to use the actual AMESPHOS, it’s a pain to get from where I source my regular ingredients, so I buy other varieties and they work great.

 

[KBFlyer]

Staples for me as well, although I have yet to use the actual AMESPHOS, it’s a pain to get from where I source my regular ingredients, so I buy other varieties and they work great.

One of the older forums I belonged to, one of the moderators could not get it in the US where he lived. I sent him a good sized zip lck bag of mine. Not one thank you or any more conversation from him. I left that forum behind. That stuff is not cheap and not cheap to ship from Canada to the USA.

 

[SmokinEdge]

One of the older forums I belonged to, one of the moderators could not get it in the US where he lived. I sent him a good sized zip lck bag of mine. Not one thank you or any more conversation from him. I left that forum behind. That stuff is not cheap and not cheap to ship from Canada to the USA.

The 450 super phosphate from Butcher and Packer is good stuff. It’s a Tri-Poly phosphate. The stuff from Waltons works but I don’t like it as well, but works.

 

[Fueling Around]

This is a great thread. A lot of valuable information sharing that needs to be a sticky somewhere.

Staples for me as well, although I have yet to use the actual AMESPHOS, it’s a pain to get from where I source my regular ingredients, so I buy other varieties and they work great.

The Amesphos brand changed from the original source. I don't know the reason.
You can get the resurrected on Amazon
Make it Meaty
They also carry disodium Inosinate and Guanylate (I+G) for a reasonable price.

 

[zachyweezer]

Just to be clear. No “binder” is absolutely necessary in a sausage that is, ground right, processed right and handled right, no matter the fat percentage from 10% to 30%.

”Binder” has some confusion around it in sausage. I think that’s because of the English language and it’s ability to have multiple meanings for some words.

When we “bind“ a sausage, we are gluing it together or making it bind together (not crumbling) this is the batter or the mince as a whole.

However, ”binding” in sausage does also mean to bind water or moisture so the sausage is juicy.

”Binding” moisture is not a big deal so long as the fat content is there and of a quality fat. (Hard fat, not soft fat)

””Binding” the batter, mince, or the sausage mass is done through proper protein extraction.

What most generally causes a sausage to be crumbly or have a bad texture, is poor technique or process. And it most always stems from the fat being the culprit.

If the fat is not good hard fat it will melt at a lower temp and cause fat-out, if the fat is ground through a knife and plate that are dull the fat will smear, if the grinding process has the meat to warm it most certainly will smear even with a sharp knife and plate. If we do everything correct through the grinding phase and then allow the meat to warm above about 35*F while mixing the fat will melt just a little, this melting creates oil. In the mixing process we are trying to make a good protein extraction, this process creates a web of protein strings that “bind“ our mixture together, meat and fat, but if the fat is coated with a thin layer of oil from being a tad to warm then the bind is weak and the end result is a sausage with poor texture and mouth feel.

Now is when “binders” come in. When used they will save a sausage that was processed in a sub standard way, well, up to a point. They will add extra protein or a gel to help hold everything together even if the fat was just a little warm. These proteins or gel help to bind the fat to the meat, increasing the texture of the sausage, kind of a crutch if you will. Follow proper procedure and no kind of “binder” is strictly necessary. All that said, in some sausages I find the gel from potato starch a nice texture addition, it’s subtle but it’s nice just the same, I have almost no use for milk powder.

Excellent response. Thank you. I learn so much from you guys.

 

[zachyweezer]

Maybe going off topic but is there a tutorial for sharpening grinder blades some where?

I'm a little intimidated by this, honestly. My plates are stainless steel, and the tutorials I've seen are sharpening carbon.

 

[DougE]

I'm a little intimidated by this, honestly. My plates are stainless steel, and the tutorials I've seen are sharpening carbon.

I don't think it really matters. All you're doing is truing up the plate with fine grit paper on a flat surface.

 

[SmokinEdge]

The Amesphos brand changed from the original source. I don't know the reason.

There was discussion about that here a couple years ago, I’d have to find that, but if I recall correctly, someone maybe passed away or sold or something like that at the original AmesPhos, then it was reconstructed by someone else, it was very popular so there was already demand.

 

[SmokinEdge]

I'm a little intimidated by this, honestly. My plates are stainless steel, and the tutorials I've seen are sharpening carbon.

Honestly, don’t be. The process is straightforward and same for all grinder plates.

 

[zachyweezer]

Honestly, don’t be. The process is straightforward and same for all grinder plates.

Just thinking back to when I was sharpening kitchen blades pretty frequently. I'd pick up old knives from various places and give them a new edge. The SS ones were far more labor intensive than carbon. I didn't know if grinding plates were comparable.

 

[SmokinEdge]

Just thinking back to when I was sharpening kitchen blades pretty frequently. I'd pick up old knives from various places and give them a new edge. The SS ones were far more labor intensive than carbon. I didn't know if grinding plates were comparable.

When sharpening a knife blade there are two angles to match. With plates and grinder knives it’s just using a flat surface, it’s just grinding flat on one side. Much more simple.

 

[d-mac]

Maybe going off topic but is there a tutorial for sharpening grinder blades some where?

search Youtube for @2guysandacooler
"Two guys and a cooler on Youtube."

 

[KBFlyer]

search Youtube for @2guysandacooler
"Two guys and a cooler on Youtube."

Ya I watched that the other day. I have flat stones for sharpening that does the trick.

 

[SmokinEdge]

Ya I watched that the other day. I have flat stones for sharpening that does the trick.

Just to reply, nothing wrong with the stones, but if you also use those stones for say knife sharpening or tool sharpening, weather they are natural or composite stones they will in time take on a wear pattern that is not exactly flat.

This is why a flat hard surface with Emery paper is best. This process will always be flat. The diamond stones will stay fairly flat but are limited in size. A full sheet of emery is a much better work surface.