Pastrami attempt

[bigbuck]

I see pastrami recipes posted all over here so i know i know do a search lol, well ive been looking and need good recipe for a first timer, I've been seeing alot about pops brine bu cannot seem to find it (I'll keep looking in the meantime) have a couple of briskets that need used so heck why not give pastrami a go, any guidance will be much appreciated!!

 

[SmokinAl]

Here you go:

Pops6927's Wet Curing Brine

real simple curing brine: for every 1 gallon of water, add: 1/3 - 1 cup sea salt (depending if you're on a lo-salt diet) 1 cup granulated sugar or Splenda174 1 cup brown sugar or Splenda174 brown sugar mix 1 tbsp cure no. 1 pink salt stir thoroughly until clear amber color, pour over...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

Al

 

[thirdeye]

I sort of merged my corned beef brine with Pop's brine. HERE is a link to my article explaining how I use Pop's Brine and what I did for the corning brine. You will see that my salt amount in the corning brine is less than the amount I use in my version of Pop's brine, that is because the Old Bay contains some salt.

A side note.... I have added AmesPhos to the corning brine that gets injected for more moisture retention. If you have a phosphate product, and want to use it, let me know. The calculation is very simple.

 

[bigbuck]

Will it be safe to mix up pops brine and put say two 8 or 10 lb briskets in a sealed bucket and keep in fridge for 10-20 days? And im guessing that you need to remove fat from briskets? Thanks

 

[thirdeye]

Will it be safe to mix up pops brine and put say two 8 or 10 lb briskets in a sealed bucket and keep in fridge for 10-20 days? And im guessing that you need to remove fat from briskets? Thanks

Depending on what size buckets you have, it may be possible. I think I would use separate buckets.

I trim most of the slick fat, then trim down the fat on the outside face to 1/4" thick, and I a remove a lot of the kernel of fat where the point overlaps the flat.

 

[thirdeye]

Here is how I trim out that kernel of fat. Or you could separate the flat and point.

 

[bigbuck]

Depending on what size buckets you have, it may be possible. I think I would use separate buckets.

I trim most of the slick fat, then trim down the fat on the outside face to 1/4" thick, and I a remove a lot of the kernel of fat where the point overlaps the flat.

Ok i have a couple 2.5 gallon buckets with lids and will do them separate, next question is can yo brine them to long? Im gonna ask alot of questions about this lol

 

[thirdeye]

Ok i have a couple 2.5 gallon buckets with lids and will do them separate, next question is can yo brine them to long? Im gonna ask alot of questions about this lol

Yes, you can brine them too long, but I recall that timeframe is something like 30 to 40 days and the result is a mushy product.

 

[G8trwood]

After just making pastrami out of two grocery bought corned beaf packages… and being greatly disappointed. And then reading a few of the long curing threads… I am hesitant to ask a question, but,
The only things I have “cured” so far was a salt/sugar cure of 10 hours on Tasso followed immediately by a hot smoke. No #1 used. Product frozen for use as needed.

For the pastrami and your pops modified brine, is injecting necessary and the #1 is needed not only for the meat but also to keep bacteria in the water down? Followed by a 200+ degree smoke.
Sorry for the hijack, but this is inline with what I was reading today.

 

[bigbuck]

After just making pastrami out of two grocery bought corned beaf packages… and being greatly disappointed. And then reading a few of the long curing threads… I am hesitant to ask a question, but,
The only things I have “cured” so far was a salt/sugar cure of 10 hours on Tasso followed immediately by a hot smoke. No #1 used. Product frozen for use as needed.

For the pastrami and your pops modified brine, is injecting necessary and the #1 is needed not only for the meat but also to keep bacteria in the water down? Followed by a 200+ degree smoke.
Sorry for the hijack, but this is inline with what I was reading today.

All good bub, i want to learn it just as you do! Keep posting progress if you attempt!!

 

[thirdeye]

After just making pastrami out of two grocery bought corned beaf packages… and being greatly disappointed. And then reading a few of the long curing threads… I am hesitant to ask a question, but,
The only things I have “cured” so far was a salt/sugar cure of 10 hours on Tasso followed immediately by a hot smoke. No #1 used. Product frozen for use as needed.

For the pastrami and your pops modified brine, is injecting necessary and the #1 is needed not only for the meat but also to keep bacteria in the water down? Followed by a 200+ degree smoke.
Sorry for the hijack, but this is inline with what I was reading today.

Yes. In curing circles it's known as a 'combination curing' method. Injecting your brine (10% to 12% of the meat weight) , then covering the meat with brine allows for curing from the outside in, and the inside out.

Cure #1 has a number of functions. It provides the 'cured' flavor (think roast pork verses ham), it provides for the pink color of pastrami (or corned beef), and it provides a level of food safety during the long curing times, and if you used low smoking temps.... Cure #1 would add a safety net there too.

There are two approaches to pastrami. You can cure a brisket flat (salt, sugar, Cure #1), then season and smoke to make pastrami. Or.... you can corn your brisket flat (salt, sugar, Cure #1, and aromatics) then season and smoke to make pastrami. I like the back-flavor of corning using all the aromatics, and then making pastrami. But both approaches make wonderful pastrami because the pastrami rub (pepper, coriander, garlic) form the base of a pastrami flavor.

I'm curious why your store-bought corned beef disappointed you when you made pastrami? If it was the 'corned flavor' you might be better off with a home cured brisket rather than a home corned brisket as your stating point for pastrami.

 

[bigbuck]

Can you use the same curing method for buck board bacon? And im not totally sure what cut of meat to use for buck board bacon honestly but it also looks fantastic

 

[bigbuck]

I can smoke the hell outa pork but never ventured into curing

 

[TNJAKE]

Can you use the same curing method for buck board bacon? And im not totally sure what cut of meat to use for buck board bacon honestly but it also looks fantastic

You can do the same for buckboard or you can dry cure it depending on thickness. BBB comes from a deboned pork butt usually

 

[thirdeye]

Can you use the same curing method for buck board bacon? And im not totally sure what cut of meat to use for buck board bacon honestly but it also looks fantastic

Well, 'Buckboard' or 'Buckboarding' is one of the many terms that can mean something different to many people. My introduction to the term was when Hi Mountain Seasonings marketed their dry cure that was called Buckboard Bacon Cure. They took a method for making 'pioneer bacon' from a pork butt instead of a rear leg ham to market their curing mixture. In short order, people figured out you could buckboard a loin, or even pork chops with their curing mixture.

The bottom line was, in the days before refrigeration, you either killed a hog and ate it, or you did some sort of cure to preserve the various cuts.

I think Buckboard actually refers to a dry cure, but using a wet curing method accomplishes a similar end result. You are taking a butt, picnic, or loin and after it's cured it's a cross between ham and Canadian bacon. For many folks, using the Buckboard method is their introduction into a cured pork product. HERE is a long article where I detailed my Buckboard adventures.

 

[G8trwood]

Yes. In curing circles it's known as a 'combination curing' method. Injecting your brine (10% to 12% of the meat weight) , then covering the meat with brine allows for curing from the outside in, and the inside out.

Cure #1 has a number of functions. It provides the 'cured' flavor (think roast pork verses ham), it provides for the pink color of pastrami (or corned beef), and it provides a level of food safety during the long curing times, and if you used low smoking temps.... Cure #1 would add a safety net there too.

There are two approaches to pastrami. You can cure a brisket flat (salt, sugar, Cure #1), then season and smoke to make pastrami. Or.... you can corn your brisket flat (salt, sugar, Cure #1, and aromatics) then season and smoke to make pastrami. I like the back-flavor of corning using all the aromatics, and then making pastrami. But both approaches make wonderful pastrami because the pastrami rub (pepper, coriander, garlic) form the base of a pastrami flavor.

I'm curious why your store-bought corned beef disappointed you when you made pastrami? If it was the 'corned flavor' you might be better off with a home cured brisket rather than a home corned brisket as your stating point for pastrami.

Think it was a combo of things on meat, maybe less quality cut, lot of salt to soak out, not quite enough smoke.. typical Monday. Now my wife really liked it, maybe that is the better data point as I am looking for a new smoker ;)
I do like pastrami better than corned beef, but not sure I can answer that question as I haven’t had a home cure brisket. How would that process differ? As an aside, can a dry rub have similar results with say a thinner flat?

Thank you for all your help.

 

[SmokinEdge]

I do like pastrami better than corned beef, but not sure I can answer that question as I haven’t had a home cure brisket. How would that process differ? As an aside, can a dry rub have similar results with say a thinner flat?

Home cured means you have more control over the taste of the final product. You make the flavor instead of trying to deal with a mass produced product flavor. They make those corned beef in one day. Yes you read that right. The process of curing just takes time to taste right. Big meat companies have so much product to move they need to cut time everywhere they can, but flavor suffers.

Dry cure is my preferred method with a steam finish after smoke. People can’t get enough of it. Both dry cure and Corning are great methods.

 

[G8trwood]

Home cured means you have more control over the taste of the final product. You make the flavor instead of trying to deal with a mass produced product flavor. They make those corned beef in one day. Yes you read that right. The process of curing just takes time to taste right. Big meat companies have so much product to move they need to cut time everywhere they can, but flavor suffers.

Dry cure is my preferred method with a steam finish after smoke. People can’t get enough of it. Both dry cure and Corning are great methods.

Thanks, and yes on home cure with more control of flavors I like. , I just read a dry brine summation on the virtual weber, of course your lite apple juice brine has me thinking about the holidays. Do you have a dry brine link that describes your process. Your previous links to your articles was quite informative. Oops replying to different folks. Old timers is real.

 

[SmokinEdge]

Thanks, and yes on home cure with more control of flavors I like. , I just read a dry brine summation on the virtual weber, of course your lite apple juice brine has me thinking about the holidays. Do you have a dry brine link that describes your process. Your previous links to your articles was quite informative. Oops replying to different folks. Old timers is real.

No worries. Lol.
dry brine/rub is simple. Use between 1.5% and 2% salt to meat weight. Cure #1 at .25% of meat weight and a range of .5 to 2% sugar. This is a base cure. My favorite is 1.5% salt, .25% cure #1, and .75% sugar by meat weight. Things like granulated garlic and onion powder or ground pickling spice, and black or white pepper can be added for your flavor preference. Rub the meat with the cure mixture and spices then place in a ziploc bag and refrigerate for about 14 days turning the bag every other day. Then rinse in cold water, pat dry. Apply a thin coat of mustard, ground coriander, black pepper and gran garlic. Smoke around 140* for about 5 hours then place in a steamer and finish to soft probe for tender usually around 205* internal temperature.

 

[bigbuck]

Curing salt arrived today, gonna get brisket thawed out and go for it! Bring on the pastrami rubs! Gonna try pops brine, rub and smoke! See what happens