Need help with MES

[BarbecueFAQ]

yeah. Makes sense for Cheese. I'm more interested in Sausage making. Wondering if it's worth the bother or not.

So this is purely anecdotal and you'd have to do it for yourself but I find:

1. Traditional temp settings for smoking sausage don't result in worthwhile smoke flavor. IE. If you're smoking at 180>275F, it's not enough time to get any worthwhile smoke on the sausage before it hits 160F internal.

At 250F it's going to take like 30 minutes or something to get to 160F? That's barely enough time to get even a kiss of smoke.

Most of my sausage is cured and cold smoked because I actually want to taste smoke.

2. I often find that the cold smoking process - when done for an extended period of time - you form more of a "pellicle." Often it's drier and the "snap" factor is enhanced.

3. Better color.

You may deem these trivial but try both ways and see what you think.

 

[GatorAGR]

So this is purely anecdotal and you'd have to do it for yourself but I find:

1. Traditional temp settings for smoking sausage don't result in worthwhile smoke flavor. IE. If you're smoking at 180>275F, it's not enough time to get any worthwhile smoke on the sausage before it hits 160F internal.

At 250F it's going to take like 30 minutes or something to get to 160F? That's barely enough time to get even a kiss of smoke.

Most of my sausage is cured and cold smoked because I actually want to taste smoke.

2. I often find that the cold smoking process - when done for an extended period of time - you form more of a "pellicle." Often it's drier and the "snap" factor is enhanced.

3. Better color.

You may deem these trivial but try both ways and see what you think.

Great answers. Makes total sense. Looks like I need to figure out a way to cold smoke. I was really hoping it would be as easy as putting one of the pellet tubes in the bottom and letting it go. So the reason for the mailbox mod is purely to get cleaner smoke? Hate that I have to do all of these modifications. PID controller, mailbox mod, fan, etc.

 

[BarbecueFAQ]

Great answers. Makes total sense. Looks like I need to figure out a way to cold smoke. I was really hoping it would be as easy as putting one of the pellet tubes in the bottom and letting it go. So the reason for the mailbox mod is purely to get cleaner smoke? Hate that I have to do all of these modifications. PID controller, mailbox mod, fan, etc.

So i've personally never done the mailbox setup but it often has to do with two things:

1. The movement of the smoke within the chamber.
2. The maze and tube both generate heat - which people are trying to avoid.

What can happen in the MES is "stale smoke" meaning no air movement - this ends up in a more bitter-tasting smoke flavor and in some cases you're cold smoking device may entirely go out.

You also risk having grease drip onto your cold smoking device - which would could result in a grease fire of sorts.

The external mailbox houses your cold smoking device (tube or maze) and the external mailbox helps create more of a draft - you'd also combine this with opening your exhaust vent completely.

So you're externally pulling cold smoke over/around your meat - without the potential for heating up your smoke chamber.

--

If you're not looking to do the above, try doing stuff like:

1. Using lots of ice in ice pans. Have these functions as a barrier for whatever you're smoking.

(Couple that with smoking in the winter. I basically cold smoke cheese solely in the winter for this reason alone.)

2. Even consider elevating or hanging whatever you're cold smoking above an ice pan to catch drippings and then have the cold smoking device set below this.

3. Use sawdust in a maze as apposed to pellets. I often find the sawdust stays lit far better - especially in an environment that has minimal draft.

 

[tallbm]

What is the benefit of cold smoking anyway? Is it worth the risks compared to just using the chips and setting the temp low?

As mentioned there are items like cheese that can't take heat or it melts so gotta cold smoke it.
Also dishes like salmon lox and other cured and/or cold smoke fish and products.

Lots of people only do cold smoked bacon and it only gets heat or cooked when it hits the skillet.

So basically a mailbox mod allows you to separate smoke generation from the MES heat generate and have greater control overall. Additionally if using the A-Maze-N Pellet Smoker (AMNPS) tray you can get up to 12 hours of perfect Thin Blue Smoke (TBS) without having to do much fiddling or baby sitting. So, greater control and smoke production with little to no babysitting effort.

With a mailbox mod you also don't have to open the door if wanting to use the AMNPS tray or a tube you just pop it into the mailbox mod and if there are any pellet flame up situations (this will happen on occasion, usually wind gusts or windy days) then the flaming up is contained separate from the MES and food. Easier management of all kinds of things.
Additionally with the mailbox mod you aren't generating as much heat in the MES box because there is distance between the burning pellets and the food so helps with maintaining cold smoke temperatures, which can be a problem in hot climate areas like TX, AZ, FL, etc.

Cold smoking can give excellent flavor to dishes but it's something you have to be prepared for and want to take on. I personally have only cold smoked fish and if I wasn't so lactose intolerant I would cold smoke some cheeses. I hot smoke my bacon to 145F (safe to eat temp) using the sausage smoking process to avoid melting out fat. I do this because I love eating the pork belly as I'm slicing it and honestly I eat like 90% of it like it's a bacon Cold Cut, sooooo good!

Anyhow, as you can see there are many possibilities here but I hope this helps answer some questions about cold smoking and usefulness of a mailbox mod with burning pellets in an AMNPS tray or tube :D

 

[GatorAGR]

Is there any advantage of the mailbox mod to the Masterbuilt Cold Smoke attachment other than a few bucks?

 

[tallbm]

Is there any advantage of the mailbox mod to the Masterbuilt Cold Smoke attachment other than a few bucks?

Cleaner to Perfect smoke with mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube.
Longer unattended smoke production with mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube (1-12 hours of smoke depending item and how many pellets you want so you can adjust this easily).
No need for electricity for mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube.
I believe pellets are more cost effective than chips and pellets/dust (or dust made from pellets) are used with the AMNPS tray or tube and mailbox mod.
Mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube are way less likely to malfunction or break down leaving you without smoke generation. No mechanical feeding issues (gravity feed design with chips for MB generator?) or electrical based issues with mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube

Those are the clear ones off the top of the head.

To be clear I'm not anti-Masterbuilt Cold Smoke generater at all.
There are just so many more benefits to the Mailbox mod and AMNPS tray or tube used with it.

 

[dr k]

Mailbox mod was cheap < $30 since I already had a tube and maze for a year. With the Mes 40 on the leg kit I made a stand from a tomato cage and bolt cutters to raise the vent hole on the top rear of the mailbox to the same height as the chip loader 3" hole and secured with a shoe lace and spring clip A $3 section of 3" dia.X24" alum snap together vent pipe. Putting zip lock bags of ice on the mailbox and rigid duct (if using it vs flex alum vent duct) takes heat out at the source vs in the product chamber. Make it as short with a coupling or an long as you want connecting pieces. I mostly just stick the mailbox right in the side with no lengths of vent pipe hot or cold smoking.

 

[GatorAGR]

so basically you take out the chip tube, insert aluminum pipe which is then attached to a mailbox. Put your pellet tray or tube in the mailbox. This creates better flow of smoke and reduces heat which produces clean smoke without heat. Correct?

 

[dr k]

so basically you take out the chip tube, insert aluminum pipe which is then attached to a mailbox. Put your pellet tray or tube in the mailbox. This creates better flow of smoke and reduces heat which produces clean smoke without heat. Correct?

Yes. I took out everything around the element and flipped the element (optional) for more even heating in the Mes 40. Not necessary in the Mes 30. Put a disposable alum baking sheet pan from the dollar tree on the bottom rack for a drip pan. Sealed all mounting holes in the bottom of the mailbox and rear corners except the two pencil sized holes closest to the door hinge with cut pieces of fridge magnets and goop rubbery glue. I made a pencil hole in the middle between the two so all air comes in the hinge and those 3 holes at each row of the maze and passes the elevated maze above and below it (made a rack to let air encompass the maze) to the back upper mailbox hole to the Mes. Some people put binder clips at the bottom maze strut corners or weld bolts for feet at the corners to elevate maze (important for good burning pellets to ash.)






Sealed $15 tent fan 4-D batteries upside down on a 6 inch PVC coupling to draft cold smoke. I've used it years since the motor and batteries are seal with a screw on cap. Neoprene fan blades. Set on low and change batteries yearly or longer depending on use . Low fan speed is perfect.

 

[dsk]

I run a Masterbuilt cold smoker. If there is any moisture in the chips it will drool yucky black water out the bottom. I now have a small stainless sheet pan I set under it. Also, you need to scrape out the tower every couple of smokes or the chips will not feed down to the heating element.

 

[tallbm]

so basically you take out the chip tube, insert aluminum pipe which is then attached to a mailbox. Put your pellet tray or tube in the mailbox. This creates better flow of smoke and reduces heat which produces clean smoke without heat. Correct?

That's the gist of it.
You may have to tweak your mailbox mod with adding holes or covering up existing holes, etc. but that stuff is simple and is honestly just part of tweaking your BBQ setup/system to work for you and your situation.
For instance I have my MES and mailbox mod in a plastic resin lawnmower shed thingy that opens up so I don't get much bother from wind blowing into the mailbox mod so my hole placement and number of holes may differ. I also used a different type of mailbox for my mod (wall hang rectangular one) vs the standard round long ones.
So you just whip it into shape (doesn't take too much tinkering) and boom you are set!

Also, I made mine so it is all 1 compact piece that I can pull off the smoker with 1 hand (usually covered in an oven mit). This has helped me a number of times when a strong gust of wind or some error on my end has lead to pellets flaming back up and burning over. My wireless thermemter goes off saying smoker temp is really hot and I know pellets flamed up.
I put on an oven met and run out and pull the whole contraption off the smoker and to the center of the porch and put out the flame and get it whipped into shape with more pellets or whatever so I can continue smoking. All 1 compact easy unit for me to fool with.
This is probably overkill for most but you get the idea that my mailbox mod is built to fit my setup/system, needs, and desires :D

 

[GatorAGR]

Thanks guys. I'm opting for the simplest method for sure. Seems that a longer dryer vent hose might help alleviate higher temps if I get flare ups?

 

[cmayna]

But are you still considering using the Masterbuilt cold smoker but with a longer exhaust vent tube? Per tallbm's replies, so much easier and most importantly cooler using a mailbox setup with a AMNPS tray.

 

[GatorAGR]

But are you still considering using the Masterbuilt cold smoker but with a longer exhaust vent tube? Per tallbm's replies, so much easier and most importantly cooler using a mailbox setup with a AMNPS tray.

No. I'm jumping on the mailbox bandwagon. :)

 

[GatorAGR]

Any preference between the a-maze-n tray vs. tube?

 

[Steve H]

Any preference between the a-maze-n tray vs. tube?

I use the tray in my mailbox.

 

[tallbm]

Thanks guys. I'm opting for the simplest method for sure. Seems that a longer dryer vent hose might help alleviate higher temps if I get flare ups?

The tray is the way to go. It can do as little or as much time as the tube BUT give you up to 12 hours. Some report getting 4 hours on the tube, but almost all report the tube putting out heavier smoke.
No need to limit yourself by going tube only when the tray can do anything the tube can do and it produces cleaner smoke.

Also, if you provide a longer hose you will get "cleaner" smoke in the fact that as the smoke travels creosote will deposited along the hose before it can get to the meat. This means even better cleaner tasting smoke flavor. Not that I've ever had a creosote deposit or flavor problem but cleaner and better is well... cleaner and better lol.
Yeah it will also help from adding as much heat on cold smokes since the air can cool some as it travels the hose.

Finally, flare ups will happen so just get a vent hose can withstand some flame, so not the soft foil ones. The chip loader hole in your MES is a 3 inch hole so a 3 inch vent hose and joints should do the trick :)

 

[Culinary Otter]

The tray is the way to go. It can do as little or as much time as the tube BUT give you up to 12 hours. Some report getting 4 hours on the tube, but almost all report the tube putting out heavier smoke.

One thing I'll note, (after almost throwing my tube and tray into a field), it depends on temperature and altitude.

At 0C/32f and 800m/2400ft I can't keep a tray lit for more than 20 minutes. Thankfully after deep-diving into this forum I discovered the idea of using pellet dust in a tube. Saved my last cold smoke, and honestly kept me trying again. I would have given up if I hadn't gained that info here.

Not sure where you are but something to consider in the tray vs tube debate.

 

[GatorAGR]

As mentioned there are items like cheese that can't take heat or it melts so gotta cold smoke it.
Also dishes like salmon lox and other cured and/or cold smoke fish and products.

Lots of people only do cold smoked bacon and it only gets heat or cooked when it hits the skillet.

So basically a mailbox mod allows you to separate smoke generation from the MES heat generate and have greater control overall. Additionally if using the A-Maze-N Pellet Smoker (AMNPS) tray you can get up to 12 hours of perfect Thin Blue Smoke (TBS) without having to do much fiddling or baby sitting. So, greater control and smoke production with little to no babysitting effort.

With a mailbox mod you also don't have to open the door if wanting to use the AMNPS tray or a tube you just pop it into the mailbox mod and if there are any pellet flame up situations (this will happen on occasion, usually wind gusts or windy days) then the flaming up is contained separate from the MES and food. Easier management of all kinds of things.
Additionally with the mailbox mod you aren't generating as much heat in the MES box because there is distance between the burning pellets and the food so helps with maintaining cold smoke temperatures, which can be a problem in hot climate areas like TX, AZ, FL, etc.

Cold smoking can give excellent flavor to dishes but it's something you have to be prepared for and want to take on. I personally have only cold smoked fish and if I wasn't so lactose intolerant I would cold smoke some cheeses. I hot smoke my bacon to 145F (safe to eat temp) using the sausage smoking process to avoid melting out fat. I do this because I love eating the pork belly as I'm slicing it and honestly I eat like 90% of it like it's a bacon Cold Cut, sooooo good!

Anyhow, as you can see there are many possibilities here but I hope this helps answer some questions about cold smoking and usefulness of a mailbox mod with burning pellets in an AMNPS tray or tube :D

How do you smoke your sausage? You mention the "sausage smoking process".

 

[tallbm]

How do you smoke your sausage? You mention the "sausage smoking process".

There is a specific process that MUST be followed when smoking CURED sausage (as well as hot smoking bacon). Why? So that you do NOT melt out the fat from the sausage leaving a dry crumbly product that will break your heart after all the effort put in. If temps get too hot too fast the fat will melt and this whole bad situation is known as "fat out". So this processes is needed.

Because this takes so much time (often may hours) at such low temps, cure#1 is needed to keep things safe and avoid bacteria going wild and then getting you sick.

If doing fresh/uncured sausages you want to smoke and cook them to safe internal temperatures (165F Internal Temp [IT] ) within 4 hours. This is not so common of a practice but some will almost cold smoke the sausage for a bit and then throw it on a grill to actually cook the sausage and all of this happens in under a 4 hour period so no food safety issues to be had.

Sausage Smoking Process

• Hour 1: Start with sausage in your smoker at 100F smoker temp for 1 hour, WITHOUT applying smoke. This should let the sausages dry a bit
• Hour 2: Bump your smoker temp up like 10-20F degrees or so (this range can vary but don't bump too high). Start applying smoke. Let roll at this temp and with smoke for 1hour.
• Hour 3: Bump up smoker temp again 10-20F degrees. Keep rolling smoke if that's what your sausage calls for or cut it off, it's all sausage dependent. Hot dogs only need like 30-45 min of smoke where other sausage may roll with hours of smoke.
• Hour 4: Bump up the temp again 10-20F
• Next Hours: Bump temp up every hour like you have been doing until the smoker temp is like 165-170F. You don't really want to go over that temp max temp range and let it go until your sausage hits the desired Interal Temp (IT) of meat of 150-155F or so. I shoot for like 152F but some sausage is higher or just a hair lower, it's all good.
• When sausage hits the IT you soak it in an ice water bath to immediately stop the cooking and cool the sausage down. This will also keep the casing/skin from getting wrinkly having some other issues
• Once sausage has cooled, dry it off and set it out to "bloom" (change color) for a while. These times vary, 1hr or more usually. Some people don't bloom sausages at all, it's mostly a cosmetic thing so up to you.
• Vac seal and freeze/put in fridge to eat that weak/start eating on some, etc.

I hot smoke my bacon to a fully cooked 145F IT and follow this same process so I don't get fat out on my bacon :)

Let me know if this all makes sense and if you have any questions :D