I would like to attempt Lebanon Bologna recipe concerns

[slavikborisov]

Few questions for anyone that's attempted Lebanon bologna or any suggestions and i think through my process.

Side Note : i will be purchasing Marianski book on fermented sausages to gain more knowledge. BUT in the meantime I'm just looking at stuff that doesn't require a curing chamber.

2 guys a cooler recipe calls for 28g/kg of salt and 30g/kg of sugar..... im used to 15g/kg or 17g/kg am i missing something here? i know the sugar will offset the saltiness but i feel like that's little much?

I've never fermented any sausage yet, but from my understanding as long as i hit target PH is the time frame I'm alright. Target would be 4.8 in this recipe. As long as i can maintain the 75F to 90F range wrapped in cling film check with my pH meter im alright.

My other concern is the texture and look of this bologna in his video compared to store bought store bought looks alittle drier. I don't have a curing chamber so drying it is really and option as i cant control humidity. ive seen people talk about the brown paper bag in the refrigerator for a week im wondering if that would help little bit.


i was going to do a regular version (2 guys and cooler) and a sweet version (len poli)

Lebanon Bologna – 2 Guys & A Cooler

twoguysandacooler.com

http://lpoli.50webs.com/index_files/Bologna-Lebanon-sweet.pdf

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Made the Poli few times. Follow it to the "T"

 

[zwiller]

I am no authority on making it but have had plenty being here in Ohio. Like you posted, almost all places here carry 2 kinds, sweet and plain. I do not care for the sweet myself. 99% sure both here gets cooked. Not sure if in smoker or SV or poach. Both variations here use liquid smoke and have a pronounced smokey flavor, even more than summer sausage. Poli recipe gets my vote but I would omit the brown sugar and then finish in SV but that's me.

I've watched enough of your posts slavikborisov you got this. You will likely be like me and wonder why you put off fermenting like you did. So worth it and TASTY. Big fan of FRM52 but you need dextrose/corn sugar for that. No chamber here either. I do as you say, cling wrap. Heads up there is no obvious signs of fermentation. I expected something. Only a very slight smell.

 

[Dave in AZ]

I've never fermented any sausage yet, but from my understanding as long as i hit target PH is the time frame I'm alright

No... in fermented sausage, the pH below 5.3 alone IS NOT enough to protect meat. ALL the pathogen risk mitigation steps are needed! And the first, #1 step, is salt must be at least 2.5%.

If you are making classic, uncooked, fermented Lebanon bologna, you need at least 2.5% salt as specified.

I looked at Seltzers, Boars Head, and Oscar Mayer, all had over 2.5% salt.

HOWEVER... if you are doing an innoculated fast ferment, say with FLC or LHP at 100f, and THEN you are cooking it using a pathogen lethality heat treatment immediately upon reaching pH in a day or so, then you could probably go 2% salt since pathogen risk is hugely reduced.

 

[slavikborisov]

I am no authority on making it but have had plenty being here in Ohio. Like you posted, almost all places here carry 2 kinds, sweet and plain. I do not care for the sweet myself. 99% sure both here gets cooked. Not sure if in smoker or SV or poach. Both variations here use liquid smoke and have a pronounced smokey flavor, even more than summer sausage. Poli recipe gets my vote but I would omit the brown sugar and then finish in SV but that's me.

I've watched enough of your posts slavikborisov you got this. You will likely be like me and wonder why you put off fermenting like you did. So worth it and TASTY. Big fan of FRM52 but you need dextrose/corn sugar for that. No chamber here either. I do as you say, cling wrap. Heads up there is no obvious signs of fermentation. I expected something. Only a very slight smell.

i do have dextrose i use it extensively. and yes the brown sugar in Len's recipe is pretty high but i figured i would try. Yeah ive been on the fence about it and i figured its time to try.

i watched a video once on seltzers process and it seemed as though they woodsmoked it in really ol school smokehouses with high humidity for a day or two. im just curious as two how the flavor/texture varies if it get a heat treatment or not as im shooting for the same profile as seltzers as i eat plenty of it!

 

[slavikborisov]

No... in fermented sausage, the pH below 5.3 alone IS NOT enough to protect meat. ALL the pathogen risk mitigation steps are needed! And the first, #1 step, is salt must be at least 2.5%.

If you are making classic, uncooked, fermented Lebanon bologna, you need at least 2.5% salt as specified.

I looked at Seltzers, Boars Head, and Oscar Mayer, all had over 2.5% salt.

HOWEVER... if you are doing an innoculated fast ferment, say with FLC or LHP at 100f, and THEN you are cooking it using a pathogen lethality heat treatment immediately upon reaching pH in a day or so, then you could probably go 2% salt since pathogen risk is hugely reduced.

appreciate the info dave!! i just started the first couple page in mariniski book so that will probably come up

 

[slavikborisov]

No... in fermented sausage, the pH below 5.3 alone IS NOT enough to protect meat. ALL the pathogen risk mitigation steps are needed! And the first, #1 step, is salt must be at least 2.5%.

If you are making classic, uncooked, fermented Lebanon bologna, you need at least 2.5% salt as specified.

I looked at Seltzers, Boars Head, and Oscar Mayer, all had over 2.5% salt.

HOWEVER... if you are doing an innoculated fast ferment, say with FLC or LHP at 100f, and THEN you are cooking it using a pathogen lethality heat treatment immediately upon reaching pH in a day or so, then you could probably go 2% salt since pathogen risk is hugely reduced.

pg 85 there it is LOL

Salt
When making fermented sausages use between 2.5-3.3% salt. This salt
combined with sodium nitrite (cure #1) is your first line of defense against
undesirable bacteria. Almost all regular sausage recipes (fresh, smoked,
cooked) contain 1.5-2 % of salt which is added to obtain good flavor. These
amounts are not high enough to provide safety against bacteria in uncooked
fermented products and there is no room for a compromise.

 

[zwiller]

i do have dextrose i use it extensively. and yes the brown sugar in Len's recipe is pretty high but i figured i would try. Yeah ive been on the fence about it and i figured its time to try.

i watched a video once on seltzers process and it seemed as though they woodsmoked it in really ol school smokehouses with high humidity for a day or two. im just curious as two how the flavor/texture varies if it get a heat treatment or not as im shooting for the same profile as seltzers as i eat plenty of it!

First time I tried "sweet" I was convinced it would not be that sweet but was I WRONG. Not for me but can imagine some would like. With you on the heat. No idea. They are local to you so try giving them a message or call to confirm semi dry or cooked. I've had it and tasted just like the stuff I get here so would say it's cooked. You could always give as you say the paper bag/butcher paper drying treatment after cooking. I bet that the pros do it sorta like that but have a chamber or sorts to do it. My experiments with it were not good. My stuff (kabanosy) picked up some fridge flavors and lost too much smoke. UMAI bag maybe?

Anyone know how to definitively tell whether a product is semi dried or cooked?

 

[slavikborisov]

First time I tried "sweet" I was convinced it would not be that sweet but was I WRONG. Not for me but can imagine some would like. With you on the heat. No idea. They are local to you so try giving them a message or call to confirm semi dry or cooked. I've had it and tasted just like the stuff I get here so would say it's cooked. You could always give as you say the paper bag/butcher paper drying treatment after cooking. I bet that the pros do it sorta like that but have a chamber or sorts to do it. My experiments with it were not good. My stuff (kabanosy) picked up some fridge flavors and lost too much smoke. UMAI bag maybe?

Anyone know how to definitively tell whether a product is semi dried or cooked?

yeah im struggling to figure out weather i should just ferment to 4.8 - 4.9.... smoke to 140F internal then try to make it lose some weight in the fridge?? for like a week or two in the brown paperbag.... marinksi recipe is also different but one does call out heat treatment ... see below my problem is the study called out potassium nitrate (ill stick with cure 1) and 3.5% salt lol which i wont be doing since if im going to cook it


beef, 5.0 kg (11.0 lb)
Ingredients per 5 kg (11 lb) of meat
salt, 2.5%, 115 g
cure #1, 12 g
dextrose 1%, 50 g
sugar, 3%, 150 g
black pepper, 15 g
allspice, 7.5 g
cinnamon, 10 g
cloves, (ground), 7.5 g
ginger, 10 g
T-SPX culture, 0.6 g (¼ tsp)
1. Grind beef through 1/8 - 3/16” (3-5 mm) plate.
2. Mix ground beef with all ingredients, including starter culture.
3. Stuff sausage mix into 40-120 mm casings.
4. Ferment at 24º C (75º F) for 72 hours, 90-85% humidity.
5. Cold smoke for 2 days at < 22º C 72º F, 85% humidity.
6. For a drier sausage: dry at 16-12º C (60-54º F), 85-80% humidity.
7. Store sausages at 10-15º C (50-59º F), 75% humidity.
Final pH around 4.6, water activity 0.93-0.96, it is a moist sausage but
extremely stable due to its low final pH. The sausage is often left for 3 days
at 4-6º C (40-43º F) for additional ripening.
If no cold smoke is available, smoke with hot smoke for 6 hours. Start at 110º
F (43º C), then gradually increase temperature and smoke at 120º F (49º C)
for 3-4 hours.



Traditionally made Lebanon Bologna is not cooked. To comply with
increasingly tougher government regulations for preventing the growth of E.
coli 0157:H7 most manufacturers subject this sausage to a heat treatment:
Lebanon Bologna - according to compliance guidelines for fermented
products. Instructions are listed for the purpose of stressing the importance
of the control of some of the pathogenic bacteria, in this case E.coli 0157:H7
which creates a safety hazard in products made with beef. This is how the
commercial producer will make the sausage in order to be on the safe side.
Process to achieve a 7-log10 reduction of Salmonella and E.coli 0157:H7.
Ingredients:
boneless lean beef - 10% fat
salt - 3.5%
potassium nitrate - 12 ppm
sodium nitrite - 200 ppm
Fermentation:
12 hrs at 80º F, then at 100º F until pH of 4.7 or 5.2 is reached
Heat:
110º F (44º C) for 20 hrs, OR
115º F (47º C) for 10 hrs, OR
120º F (49º C) for 3 hrs
Reference: Ellajosyula, K.E., S. Doores, E.W. Mills, R.A. Wilson, R.C.
Anantheswaran, and S.J. Knabel. 1998. Destruction of Escherichia coli
0157:H7 and Salmonella typhimurium in Lebanon Bologna by interaction of
fermentation, pH, heating temperature, and time. J. Food Prot. 61(2):152-7.