dry aged salmon has anyone done it

[slavikborisov]

has anyone ever dry aged salmon? like without fully cooking it. its a common item in European grocery stores where you get salted(cured in some fashion) smoked and dried (i believe dry cured) because there is still some moisture in it fish. its is delicious if you never tried it i recommend it highly

I am trying to replicate it but im trying to figure out the safety hurdles. I've seen recipe for lox which doesn't give the finish texture I'm looking for. from what i can tell the fish is not brought up to a fully cooked temp. I'm just struggling to figure out the safety hurdles. a few thing i found on line said cure with salt for a few days, apply liquid smoke and then dry age at 33F and 85% RH for 12 days. curious if anyone has tried it and the process.

Since it is not cooked. I've seen people on here say add cure #1 and other says no need. what is the recommend amount of weight loss that actually makes its safe i cant find any reliable source?? all the recipes i see with a cure just add a shitload of salt and majority of people complain its too salty. would a equilibrium dry brine work to draw enough water out and then smoking and dry cure at low temps deem it safe?

thanks

Cold Smoked Salmon Recipe - The Original Dry Bag Steak

This recipe for Cold Smoked Salmon uses 2-3 lb filet fresh salmon with skin on, and a speciality spice blend.

drybagsteak.com

Dry Aged Fish (Salmon)

The industry-leading provider of commercial smokehouses and electric home smokers.

pro-smoker.com

 

[tallbm]

has anyone ever dry aged salmon? like without fully cooking it. its a common item in European grocery stores where you get salted(cured in some fashion) smoked and dried (i believe dry cured) because there is still some moisture in it fish. its is delicious if you never tried it i recommend it highly

I am trying to replicate it but im trying to figure out the safety hurdles. I've seen recipe for lox which doesn't give the finish texture I'm looking for. from what i can tell the fish is not brought up to a fully cooked temp. I'm just struggling to figure out the safety hurdles. a few thing i found on line said cure with salt for a few days, apply liquid smoke and then dry age at 33F and 85% RH for 12 days. curious if anyone has tried it and the process.

Since it is not cooked. I've seen people on here say add cure #1 and other says no need. what is the recommend amount of weight loss that actually makes its safe i cant find any reliable source?? all the recipes i see with a cure just add a shitload of salt and majority of people complain its too salty. would a equilibrium dry brine work to draw enough water out and then smoking and dry cure at low temps deem it safe?

thanks

Cold Smoked Salmon Recipe - The Original Dry Bag Steak

This recipe for Cold Smoked Salmon uses 2-3 lb filet fresh salmon with skin on, and a speciality spice blend.

drybagsteak.com

Dry Aged Fish (Salmon)

The industry-leading provider of commercial smokehouses and electric home smokers.

pro-smoker.com

I cured salmon and then cut into strips.
Then smoked and dehydrated in the smoker at like 165F = 73/74C.

I just run it like jerky until I get the desired textures. Mine are a little soft on the inside but nice and dry on the outside so not a full jerky.

I dry cure this. For amounts of measure out salt at 1.65% of the meat weight and sugar/sweetener at 1% of the meat weight.

So in short. I basically follow my Salmon Lox curing approach and then apply my jerky smoking and dehydration approach in my MES until I get the desired texture. It's very good!!!

 

[slavikborisov]

I cured salmon and then cut into strips.
Then smoked and dehydrated in the smoker at like 165F = 73/74C.

I just run it like jerky until I get the desired textures. Mine are a little soft on the inside but nice and dry on the outside so not a full jerky.

I dry cure this. For amounts of measure out salt at 1.65% of the meat weight and sugar/sweetener at 1% of the meat weight.

So in short. I basically follow my Salmon Lox curing approach and then apply my jerky smoking and dehydration approach in my MES until I get the desired texture. It's very good!!!

i have whole salmon cut in three pieces just gutted sitting it the same dry cure currently. they arent filleted so the thickness is over 2 inches so im letting it sit for a few day to make sure the cure 1 has time to work although i know it was over kill as i plan i taking it above 145F internal. i did 1.8% salt and 1.0% sugar and .25 % cure 1. I will try the jerky method as well till i get my desired profile. i guess my hesitancy was getting the flaky white texture from fully cooking salmon.

 

[indaswamp]

I know it CAN be done...but I have never done it. Don't know what the process is or any special precautions....I do know that the high end Stagionello Drying chambers have a fish setting for dry aging fish.

 

[tallbm]

i have whole salmon cut in three pieces just gutted sitting it the same dry cure currently. they arent filleted so the thickness is over 2 inches so im letting it sit for a few day to make sure the cure 1 has time to work although i know it was over kill as i plan i taking it above 145F internal. i did 1.8% salt and 1.0% sugar and .25 % cure 1. I will try the jerky method as well till i get my desired profile. i guess my hesitancy was getting the flaky white texture from fully cooking salmon.

You will get it sorted out. Here is a post where it is doing basically what we are talking about though i don't know if they mention the smoking temperature:

Yes,,,more Salmon nuggets

It’s been 9 months since I smoked Salmon nuggets, so I thought it was time for more especially since I had no more to eat. So here ya go. Brined in a Salt/Sugar mix for 4 hours. Rinsed and dried for 2 hours. smoked from 125 to 145 degrees over a 3.5 hour span. And yes, this is Salmon which the...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

As long as the temperature isn't too high you won't end up with flakey, if so you just keep dehydrating. You could turn it all into jerky if you let it go long enough hahaha

 

[slavikborisov]

You will get it sorted out. Here is a post where it is doing basically what we are talking about though i don't know if they mention the smoking temperature:

Yes,,,more Salmon nuggets

It’s been 9 months since I smoked Salmon nuggets, so I thought it was time for more especially since I had no more to eat. So here ya go. Brined in a Salt/Sugar mix for 4 hours. Rinsed and dried for 2 hours. smoked from 125 to 145 degrees over a 3.5 hour span. And yes, this is Salmon which the...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

As long as the temperature isn't too high you won't end up with flakey, if so you just keep dehydrating. You could turn it all into jerky if you let it go long enough hahaha

yeah im going to smoke this batch with the equilibrium cure and just try to dry it out at 145F for extended period of time and see how that goes...then i will try the lox method with some fillets of cold smoking and drying in the fridge

 

[tallbm]

yeah im going to smoke this batch with the equilibrium cure and just try to dry it out at 145F for extended period of time and see how that goes...then i will try the lox method with some fillets of cold smoking and drying in the fridge

You have some fun and tasty adventures coming.
I think you will find it is not very difficult to do both methods. It just takes a little trying and doing to see what works the best and then you will get it perfectly done going forward :D

 

[slavikborisov]

You have some fun and tasty adventures coming.
I think you will find it is not very difficult to do both methods. It just takes a little trying and doing to see what works the best and then you will get it perfectly done going forward :D

I guess my other question is …. Is doing 1.8% salt/ 1.0 sugar vs a bulk 50/50 1cup salt 1 cup sugar which one is “safer” or is going to draw out more water in a refrigerated environment?

 

[tallbm]

I guess my other question is …. Is doing 1.8% salt/ 1.0 sugar vs a bulk 50/50 1cup salt 1 cup sugar which one is “safer” or is going to draw out more water in a refrigerated environment?

Safer is whichever one gives you more BUT if you have too much salt it will be horrible.

Too be safe I think you need at least 1.3% salt along with the proper amount of curing salt.

I do 1.65% salt so it isn't too salty. With fish you could probably go a little less than 1.65% salt. I find fish picks up a lot of salt versus other meats.


If you go with the % approach and you don't pick too high of a percent you can ensure both safety and never getting too salty.
If you go bulk 50/50 and it's way over the % you will end up with a very salty meat that you would then have to soak in cold water to draw salt out.

Getting everything measured and nailed upfront makes life so much easier. This is why I prefer measured equilibrium cures and brines. You can also just leave it and not worry about it if you have to run long as well. Another benefit of the measured equilibrium cures and brines :D

 

[slavikborisov]

Safer is whichever one gives you more BUT if you have too much salt it will be horrible.

Too be safe I think you need at least 1.3% salt along with the proper amount of curing salt.

I do 1.65% salt so it isn't too salty. With fish you could probably go a little less than 1.65% salt. I find fish picks up a lot of salt versus other meats.


If you go with the % approach and you don't pick too high of a percent you can ensure both safety and never getting too salty.
If you go bulk 50/50 and it's way over the % you will end up with a very salty meat that you would then have to soak in cold water to draw salt out.

Getting everything measured and nailed upfront makes life so much easier. This is why I prefer measured equilibrium cures and brines. You can also just leave it and not worry about it if you have to run long as well. Another benefit of the measured equilibrium cures and brines :D

I’m curious as to how much weight loss you’d get between the two methods …. I’m with you on the equilibrium I like knowing that no matter what it’s not going to be over salty…. And having to go through a bunch of steps of soaking in water to try to make it palatable … seems like a lot of commercial producers do it that way in the videos I’ve seen…

I just bought to to large fillets of salmon so I will be doing an experiment on different method of drying and salting….

Is there any literature stating the recommended target weight loss to make cold smoke salmon safe to eat…. I know with red meats it’s like 35-40% is that hold true with fish???

 

[tallbm]

I’m curious as to how much weight loss you’d get between the two methods …. I’m with you on the equilibrium I like knowing that no matter what it’s not going to be over salty…. And having to go through a bunch of steps of soaking in water to try to make it palatable … seems like a lot of commercial producers do it that way in the videos I’ve seen…

I just bought to to large fillets of salmon so I will be doing an experiment on different method of drying and salting….

Is there any literature stating the recommended target weight loss to make cold smoke salmon safe to eat…. I know with red meats it’s like 35-40% is that hold true with fish???

With your salmon as long as it was previously frozen at the cold enough temps (kills potential parasites) then it's my understanding that you can cure and smoke with no heat and eat. This is how my Salmon Lox is done, it is safe to eat and has lost no weight. It was never cooked to begin with. So basically sushi.

As for drying I think it will come down to your texture preference at that point.

For safety the cure and salt help with that, then refrigerating after the fact.

For really stable tried meat it has a moisture content of 22-24% and low water activity according to page 7 of this documentation from the USDA: https://www.fsis.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media_file/2021-02/33_IM_RTE_SS_Process.pdf

I think for long dry cure (cure #2 not cure #1) people shoot for that 35%'ish weight/moisture loss but that is still not 100% shelf stable and should be refrigerated.

That document I linked too mentions "dried meat snacks" and does not directly state what kind of meat in that line though the article talks a lot about beef jerky.

No matter what you make, cold smoked salmon lox or dehydrated salmon, you should refrigerate it, freeze what you are not going to be eating, and eat with in 2 weeks anything you open and start eating on.

I vac seal my salmon lox and it is good to go.
My dried salmon strips and chunks don't make it past 1 week and I keep it refrigerated during that time while eating it lol. Again my dehydrated salmon isn't exactly jerky, it is somewhere in between jerky and cooked salmon but feels more like jerk then a cooked piece of salmon. It's sooo good! :D

 

[slavikborisov]

With your salmon as long as it was previously frozen at the cold enough temps (kills potential parasites) then it's my understanding that you can cure and smoke with no heat and eat. This is how my Salmon Lox is done, it is safe to eat and has lost no weight. It was never cooked to begin with. So basically sushi.

As for drying I think it will come down to your texture preference at that point.

For safety the cure and salt help with that, then refrigerating after the fact.

For really stable tried meat it has a moisture content of 22-24% and low water activity according to page 7 of this documentation from the USDA: https://www.fsis.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media_file/2021-02/33_IM_RTE_SS_Process.pdf

I think for long dry cure (cure #2 not cure #1) people shoot for that 35%'ish weight/moisture loss but that is still not 100% shelf stable and should be refrigerated.

That document I linked too mentions "dried meat snacks" and does not directly state what kind of meat in that line though the article talks a lot about beef jerky.

No matter what you make, cold smoked salmon lox or dehydrated salmon, you should refrigerate it, freeze what you are not going to be eating, and eat with in 2 weeks anything you open and start eating on.

I vac seal my salmon lox and it is good to go.
My dried salmon strips and chunks don't make it past 1 week and I keep it refrigerated during that time while eating it lol. Again my dehydrated salmon isn't exactly jerky, it is somewhere in between jerky and cooked salmon but feels more like jerk then a cooked piece of salmon. It's sooo good! :D

Appreciate the information!
So I got two slabs of salmon one im
Doing the equilibrium method the other im
Using thirdeye method and see what happens
After I smoke it I will freeze to make sure I end the life of any possible parasites.

I added dill and BP to the rub along with cure and cure accelerator…. Currently in the wet brine phase of thirdeyes recipe and the dry brine I just drained the liquid as I see it … I will cold smoke it in a day or two

 

[tallbm]

Appreciate the information!
So I got two slabs of salmon one im
Doing the equilibrium method the other im
Using thirdeye method and see what happens
After I smoke it I will freeze to make sure I end the life of any possible parasites.

I added dill and BP to the rub along with cure and cure accelerator…. Currently in the wet brine phase of thirdeyes recipe and the dry brine I just drained the liquid as I see it … I will cold smoke it in a day or two



View attachment 705049View attachment 705050View attachment 705051View attachment 705052View attachment 705053View attachment 705054

Things are lookin good!!!

If cold smoking, you can easily get some bad stale smoke flavor if the smoke is not flowing through your smoker with some kind of draft.
I built a little fan device to stuck air/smoke up from my MES vent to keep the cold smoke air circulating and flowing because no heat = no draft = stale smoke.


Others seem to have had success putting a little fan blowing horizontally over the vent cause a cross wind that creates a draft pulling the air and smoke out of their smokers and keeping the smoke and air flow fresh. So please learn from our issues with this in the past so you don't have to correct issues from stale smoke.

If your smoke is making heat hotter than the ambient temp then you will naturally have draft. I'm in Texas and this will never happen for me when cold smoking because it's always hotter outside the smoker than inside the smoker IF the smoker is not heating itself hahaha :D

 

[slavikborisov]

Things are lookin good!!!

If cold smoking, you can easily get some bad stale smoke flavor if the smoke is not flowing through your smoker with some kind of draft.
I built a little fan device to stuck air/smoke up from my MES vent to keep the cold smoke air circulating and flowing because no heat = no draft = stale smoke.


Others seem to have had success putting a little fan blowing horizontally over the vent cause a cross wind that creates a draft pulling the air and smoke out of their smokers and keeping the smoke and air flow fresh. So please learn from our issues with this in the past so you don't have to correct issues from stale smoke.

If your smoke is making heat hotter than the ambient temp then you will naturally have draft. I'm in Texas and this will never happen for me when cold smoking because it's always hotter outside the smoker than inside the smoker IF the smoker is not heating itself hahaha :D

I have a Bella cold smoke generator and I’m installing a circulation fan on top of my smoke that I’ve have sitting around for a while that needs installed appreciate the heads up! …. My other thought was my smoke daddy pellet hopper I have has a standby setting that just runs the fan I thought that might work but I wasn’t sure if they would shut off after a while

 

[slavikborisov]

Things are lookin good!!!

If cold smoking, you can easily get some bad stale smoke flavor if the smoke is not flowing through your smoker with some kind of draft.
I built a little fan device to stuck air/smoke up from my MES vent to keep the cold smoke air circulating and flowing because no heat = no draft = stale smoke.


Others seem to have had success putting a little fan blowing horizontally over the vent cause a cross wind that creates a draft pulling the air and smoke out of their smokers and keeping the smoke and air flow fresh. So please learn from our issues with this in the past so you don't have to correct issues from stale smoke.

If your smoke is making heat hotter than the ambient temp then you will naturally have draft. I'm in Texas and this will never happen for me when cold smoking because it's always hotter outside the smoker than inside the smoker IF the smoker is not heating itself hahaha :D

Here’s the pieces of lake trout I had equilibrium curing for a few days trying different method of tying it up vs fillets vs leaving it open or I can’t put toothpicks in it to open it really just trying to nail a texture down but I’m thinking it a dried and cold smoked texture that we get at the grocery store

 

[slavikborisov]

Here’s the pieces of lake trout I had equilibrium curing for a few days trying different method of tying it up vs fillets vs leaving it open or I can’t put toothpicks in it to open it really just trying to nail a texture down but I’m thinking it a dried and cold smoked texture that we get at the grocery store

 

[tallbm]

Here’s the pieces of lake trout I had equilibrium curing for a few days trying different method of tying it up vs fillets vs leaving it open or I can’t put toothpicks in it to open it really just trying to nail a texture down but I’m thinking it a dried and cold smoked texture that we get at the grocery store

Wow that fish is looking awesome!!!

You have the cold smoke generation and a fan to keep circulation going. I think you will get everything figured out so you make the fish exactly how you want it.

I'm looking forward to seeing how it is going to come out and what you end up with :D

 

[slavikborisov]

.

 

[slavikborisov]

Idk what happend when I tried to attach those photos they ended up
In your reply somehow

 

[tallbm]

.

Wow that all looks amazing!!!

How did the flavor turn out?
Also were you able to get the textures you were looking for?

I feel like you made some very good fish to eat there and I love the thin sliced pictures.