An interesting thread. I still pop in here from time to time however I now run a similar meat smoking forum based in the UK.
Quite a lot of confusing advice in this thread and also some misleading comments
The amount of cure, whether #1 or #2, depends on the length of time the meat is susceptible to botulism...
Dried meats are susceptible, while they are hanging for months, due to other bacteria consuming the oxygen... The outside of the meat slows, reduces or eliminates oxygen permeation into the meat...
Friendly bacteria will still multiply and convert the nitrate to nitrite to continue protection...
Cure#1 can be added in stages... 150 Ppm now, add more in a week and again later....
As I understand, the 625ppm is safe for dried sausage because,,,, nitrite converts to nitric oxide. That’s how the curing takes place. It’s the nitric oxide that cures the meat and kills botulism. So when using nitrate in dried sausage and salumi, over time the nitrate converts to nitrite, then to nitric oxide, as such continued botulism control is maintained through out the drying process. At the end of that long process, most of the nitrite has converted to NO (nitric oxide) and is safe to consume.
The same thing is happening in brine with maximum levels of nitrite. Brine time is shorter, uptake is less than the brine, and by the time the product is processed and the consumer takes it home, sufficient nitrite (NO2) has converted to nitric oxide (NO) and is safe to consume. Nitrite uptake (NO2) safety levels are set at 200 ppm in the food, but again as I understand, those levels in the meat will continue to drop over time, plus cooking above 130* further breaks down the nitrite.
The ongoing control of microorganisms in air dried meat and sausage is not all about the presence of Nitrite. Once cured, the ongoing protection is achieved through a combination of the removal of water (dehydration) and the binding of remaining water using the salts and sugars in the cure (reducing the water activity - aw). I know that you have a particular sensitivity when it comes to discussing botulinum toxin Dave, however when curing and air drying meat and dry sausage, once you have taken the aw below 0.965 the botulinum spores remain dormant and are unable to produce toxin. The acidity of the meat also plays a major role in managing the Botulinum toxin production as the Botulinum toxin is also inhibited when the pH of the sausage falls below 5.6 - as many dried sausage recipes produce - especially the fermented sausage.
Either alone, or in combination, the reduced water activity and the acidity of the sausage provide the same protection as does the application of nitrate/nitrite during the initial period of curing/drying.
When talking about sausage though it is important to differentiate between the "wet" sausages (e.g. frankfurters) which would have a final aw above 0.965 and the "dry" sausage (e.g. salamis) that will have an aw comfortably below this level. Air dried whole meat products (e.g. Parma ham) will be below this aw level too.
A couple of interesting articles:
The combined effect of water activity (aw) and pH on growth and toxin production by Clostridium botulinum type G strain 89 was investigated. The minimum aw at which growth and toxin formation occurred was 0.965, for media in which the pH was adjusted ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
There is a difference in regulations for sausage and whole muscle meat....
You CAN'T add more cure to a sausage... It is already mixed into the meat...
It's whole muscle that needs subsequent additions....
From the FSIS handbook...
https://www.aamp.com/foodsafety/documents/Directive7620-3.pdf
NITRITE USED IN CURED, DRY PRODUCTS
Introduction
The amount of ingoing nitrite used in dry cured products, such as country ham, country style pork shoulder, prosciutto, etc., is based on the green weight of the meat or poultry in the product formulation. These products are prepared from a single intact piece of meat or poultry that has had the curing ingredients directly applied to the surface, and has been dried for a specified period of time. For large pieces of meat, the curing ingredients must be rubbed on the surface several times during the curing period. The rubbed meat or poultry cuts are placed on racks or in boxes and allowed to cure. Nitrite is applied to the surface of the meat or poultry as part of a cure mixture.
I am not quite sure that I understand the purpose of this information in the context of this post Dave. This thread is about the amounts of cure in sausage/salami but you seem to have added some confusion by going into some depth about the different topic of curing larger pieces of air dried meat. Also in your first post in this thread you appear to be recommending that
indaswamp
should apply progressive amounts of cure when making his smoked sausage but later you emphasise that this should definitely not be done when making sausage (?).
As your quote from the FSA Handbook says, "For large pieces of meat, the curing ingredients must be rubbed on the surface several times
during the curing period". My understand is that this is more to reduce the maximum concentration of salt and nitrite/nitrate that any part of the meat is exposed to at any given time as this can adversely affect the structure of the meat. The total cure is therefore achieved by applying the cure in stages and as it is absorbed into the meat mass the concentration at the surface reduces, so more of the cure can then be applied. Once the curing period has completed no more cure is then added. During subsequent storage/maturation the bacterial control is maintained initially by the breakdown of the Nitrate to Nitrite and later through the the resulting low water activity within the meat.
Understood.
Pops has talked about, at some length, how his dad‘s cure was weaker, took longer to cure, but that imparted more flavor and tenderness to the product. NYS tested his brine monthly and found it to be on the low end, but acceptable cure levels.
Additionally, member here by the name of Wade, had some independent lab test ran on full strength brine vs. Pops brine, and in fact the stronger brine imparted a vast amount more nitrite uptake than the weaker brine.
I understand total weight to cure. That’s just not how most people apply brine. Pops as a good example. I have never seen a specified meat weight to the 1gallon of brine. Just what it will cover, and if it’s short, simply cut the recipe in half, make another half gallon and cover it. That method is widely accepted here on SMF and is more cavalier than hard numbers.
I tend to prefer the EQ method where salt, sugar and cure are applied per total weight of product + Brine weight.
I know of Wade's test... The thing he didn't understand is "take up" described by the FSIS is..... take up = quantity injected.... not natural "suck up" as different cuts of meat adsorb liquid at different rates and quantities.... "take up" is a weighed amount measured by the processors after injection by their needle injectors.... His tests show the different amounts per muscle group... I know of that as I worked for a meat processor for a period of time.....
I know that we had some interesting debate on this at the time Dave - and you know well that this had nothing to do with any confusion between the definition of take up or pumping
The thread was initially designed to test the methodology that was being suggested by another forum member at that time - who was recommending that an immersion brine should be made up at 10x strength (as you would do with an injection brine) and then used as an immersion cure. His method relied on the assumed that as the meat would take up approximately 10% of its own weight in brine that the resulting nitrite in the meat would only be 10% of the brine strength.
In addition there was some discussion at the time in the forum as to the perceived relative low cure concentration present in Pops brine.
The experiment and lab testing confirmed the following.
Although we talk about "ingoing" nitrite in mg/Kg, it is expected that the residual nitrite in the meat will actually be less than this - as not all will be absorbed and some will be broken down. With the 10x brine being used for immersion the residual Nitrite in both types of meat ended up over 4x that of the permitted ingoing amounts - which invalidated that particular method.
It also showed that we should also not take everything we read as gospel - even government publications. The experiment (posted in a separate thread as I recall) also showed that the skin also took up / absorbed cure during immersion curing - in contradiction with what was stated in the Handbook. I took this up directly up with the FSIS at the time and was told that they are not surprised by my findings. It appears that the Handbook was pieced together from the best information available at the time, however the origins of much of its contents have been lost to history. He confirmed that much of the background work for this book is now unverifiable and, the fact that the latest revision of it was in 1995 means that it is not a publication that is regularly reviewed. If I recall Dave, I passed you the contact details of the FSIS inspector at the time so that you could confirm this for yourself.
