Dave in AZ Hotdogs

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Dave in AZ

Smoking Fanatic
Original poster
Oct 2, 2022
350
419
Phx, AZ
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I put this recipe together after a good bit of research. First, I read every post here and on Meatgistics that came up with “hotdog”, “frankfurter”, or “weiner”, looking for recipes and notes on recipes. Actual info was very sparse, almost everything pointed towards Marianski recipes.

I made a chart with spices etc for Marianski’s recipes for weiner, frankfurter, hotdog, and coney Island hotdog. I also added TX beef sausages, Czech TX sausage, TX hot links. I also compared all these to bologna.
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The recipes are almost identical, but Vienna sausage “weiner” had the coriander and mace I like, I added the garlic from US hotdogs, and then several thought celery seed powder was a critical flavor, so I added that. However, having all the recipes lined up let me be sure I was using correct amounts for the right flavor profile.

I bought and tasted the following, and analyzed their nutrition labels for listed spices, salt, etc:
Oscar Meyer regular
OM all beef
Ball Park
Bar S
Gwaltney
Morrell
Johnsonville cheesy sausages
Hebrew National 100% beef
Nathans

It turns out I like a pork and beef mix, better than 100% beef. This is probably because I expect that pork flavor, having rarely had 100% beef growing up.

I tweaked recipe to increase flavor after test patty.

Recipe for 1000g meatblock
62% pork butt, 15% fat
18.5% brisket, 15% fat
19.5% pork fat from shoulder butts
(Total fat was calculated 31.5%)
Salt 1.8% 18g
Cure1 0.25%, 2.5g
Paprika 0.2% 2g
White pepper 0.2% 2g
Coriander 0.2% 2g
Mace 0.5%, 0.5g
Onion powder 0.1% 1g
Garlic, granul. 0.3% 3g
Celery seed powder 0.05% 0.5g
Water 15%, 150ml
Binder, SureGel, 1% 10g

Optional Accelerators, let you stuff/smoke/cook in 1 day, increase color:
Sodium Erythorbate 0.5g, < 547ppm
Ascorbic Acid, vitaminC, 0.4g
Optional to skip smoking, direct to sous vide:
Hickory smoke powder 1.25g

Grind: I did a 3mm grind on mostly frozen meat, refroze and did a 2nd 3mm grind.
Mix: 25 lb manual mixer, hard fast mix 7 minutes with 2 people. Looked darn close to food processor emulsified, difficult to pull meat apart.
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Stuff: I didn’t have the 26mm cellulose “black stripe” casing that I planned on using. These are non-edible tough plastic that strips off at end. However, I did have the 26mm “Clear Collagen”, which is also extremely tough, and falls off brats often… so I used that. Each strand in the 3pack is supposed to hold 16.7 lbs, and I had 15 lbs. Seems accurate as I had about 1" from a strand unused at end.
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Linking: These clear collagen cases, IMO are really ONLY usable for hotdogs. I tried them for brats, EXTREMELY TOUGH, everyone just removed the casing they were so tough. Also, they are IMPOSSIBLE to link via a twist! All twists will just undo themselves. So it is pretty much mandatory that you use the triple-link method, which keeps the links from unraveling, or you have to tie each one with twine. The casing is tough enough to do this without bursting, but you must stuff them QUITE LOOSE, looser than snacksticks using same type casing.
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Cooking: I planned on smoking these, but wasn’t sure how these clear collagen would do smoking/drying for several hours, then into water to finish. So I elected to instead go straight to sous vide, cooking at 167f. A 26mm sausage should cook through in 30 min at 167f. I did 1 hr, IT was 160f. Excellent bind, no fat out or in water.
To still get correct flavor, I used Hickory Smoke Powder at 0.125% or 1.25g per kg, which gives an excellent smoke flavor, MUCH better than liquid smoke.
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I had a sizeable patty left unstuffed, so fried it up thin almost like Taylor Pork Roll, a similar flavor profile but fermented.

Stripping cases: popped right off

Looks: not as much color as I expected, greyish pink out of sous vide. But upon frying up hotdog, got good pink color. The exterior browning from smoke was missing, browned in pan. Texture, these look like a normal fully emulsified hotdog, mouthfeel is same.
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Taste: tastes like a great hotdog, just like I expected. After test patty, I boosted salt to 1.8% up from 1.6%, was trying to be healthy but more salt is better in hotdog.
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Recommendations:
-If possible, a straight smoke with no sous vide will give better color and probably keep flavors more concentrated. Will smoke next time.
-If you like TX beef sausage or coney island dogs, add 1.0g of cayenne.
-Would be great with mostly beef, will try 50% beef next.
-Most commercial top brands like OM and Costco Kirkland are 2.5% salt. This recipe gives 2.0% when cure1 salt is accounted for... bumping salt up would definitely add flavor! I think trying to reduce salt in custom artisan sausages is the wrong place to modify salt for diet, and will probably bump up to 2.3% added salt for 2.5% total, next time.
 
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Nice work there Dave. Those look great.

Let them rest 24 hours before cooking will balance the flavor better. Smoking them does bring its own flavor too, but you know that. Over all nice work and your recipe is very close to my own. They are delicious.
 
A job very well done! Super write-up Dave, thanks for sharing. I'm sure a lot of people will benefit from it. And, by the way, they look fantastic!
 
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Nice work there Dave. Those look great.

Let them rest 24 hours before cooking will balance the flavor better. Smoking them does bring its own flavor too, but you know that. Over all nice work and your recipe is very close to my own. They are delicious.
Thx! You're right, I just had one after 24hr and surprised the flavor was better. I will look at your recipe, your posts are always valuable resources! Your answer to someone today about mace was what made me decide to take time to post ;)

I also agree with 0.5g per kg, 0.05%, for mace, and mace over nutmeg. Nutmeg always makes things taste like a WI brat to me, want my dogs to be different from brats.

I actually decided to include the Onion powder, which Marianski has only for Weiners, because of how good the onion was in recent SantaRosano sausage!

I hate to say, As these are very good tasting hotdogs, but I'm really more of a "smoked sausage" guy. By Smoked Sausage, I mean those 30mm Johnsonville Cheesy ones, or the ones you get on rollers at a gas station sitting NEXT to the hotdogs. Given the choice, I would almost always take the AmericanGasStation SmokedSausage lol. So when I try to flavor match a good hotdog, I start tweaking it towards TX BBQ or Czech hot links... salt, black pepper, paprika, mustard, onion, garlic.

All that to say, I would like these better with 2g cayenne, 2g dry mustard, but I don't know that "hotdog" would be a correct name by then.
 
Thx! You're right, I just had one after 24hr and surprised the flavor was better. I will look at your recipe, your posts are always valuable resources! Your answer to someone today about mace was what made me decide to take time to post ;)

I also agree with 0.5g per kg, 0.05%, for mace, and mace over nutmeg. Nutmeg always makes things taste like a WI brat to me, want my dogs to be different from brats.

I actually decided to include the Onion powder, which Marianski has only for Weiners, because of how good the onion was in recent SantaRosano sausage!

I hate to say, As these are very good tasting hotdogs, but I'm really more of a "smoked sausage" guy. By Smoked Sausage, I mean those 30mm Johnsonville Cheesy ones, or the ones you get on rollers at a gas station sitting NEXT to the hotdogs. Given the choice, I would almost always take the AmericanGasStation SmokedSausage lol. So when I try to flavor match a good hotdog, I start tweaking it towards TX BBQ or Czech hot links... salt, black pepper, paprika, mustard, onion, garlic.

All that to say, I would like these better with 2g cayenne, 2g dry mustard, but I don't know that "hotdog" would be a correct name by then.
Yup, flavors are all subjective. But I’m glad you had some success here. They are delicious.
 
Timely post Dave.
My short list list is to copy a pork hot dog they serve at Disney World.
This recipe is a good start. I'm a low salt guy so 1% total is my starting point.
I agree that either removing the nutmeg or a touch of mace makes a hotdog versus a brat.
 
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Great looking dogs Dave, you did a lot of work for the final product.
Good on you for all that work and a well deserved ride on the Carousal

I also like the Pork/Beef dogs as that was the flavour we had growing up.

David
 
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Made this “chicago style” hot dog for my kids today, they had never heard of Chicago Style. Guess I’m not taking them to the Home Depot Hotdog cart enough! These are my homemade hotdogs. The dash of celery salt on top made them the perfect saltiness!
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