Always that one cold spot

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BXMurphy

Meat Mopper
Original poster
★ Lifetime Premier ★
Jan 12, 2022
213
224
Methuen, Massachusetts
There's always that one cold spot In a cut of meat when I'm probing for doneness with a thermometer. It drives me nuts, especially with chicken. (I'm in a full hazmat suit with chicken.)

What do you do; cook out the cold spot or pray that carry-over finishes that last spot? If the latter, how far away from final IT will you pull the cut?

Thanks,
Murph
 
I pound chicken breast to a uniform thickness to avoid the under and overcooked sides.
Overcooked breast isn't forgiving, so stay at the 160° mark.
Thigh I take to full temp or 180° at the thick piece.
 
Poultry is one meat that I won't screw around with undercooked temps, so I tend to err on the high side and cook until the deepest part of the chicken is at the target temp. And I usually don't expect to get a carry over in poultry of more than about 5*...

Red
 
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Poultry is one meat that I won't screw around with undercooked temps, so I tend to err on the high side and cook until the deepest part of the chicken is at the target temp. And I usually don't expect to get a carry over in poultry of more than about 5*...

Red
I AGREE!!! I don't mess with that either! Mrs. Murphy thinks I'm out of my mind but I don't care. I'm Mr. Probe with chicken.

Thanks, seen red.

B
 
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I pound chicken breast to a uniform thickness to avoid the under and overcooked sides.
Overcooked breast isn't forgiving, so stay at the 160° mark.
Thigh I take to full temp or 180° at the thick piece.

Yep, a buck eighty. Even if it says safe at 165° F. In getting it up there.

Murph
 
I pound chicken breast to a uniform thickness to avoid the under and overcooked sides.
Overcooked breast isn't forgiving, so stay at the 160° mark.
Thigh I take to full temp or 180° at the thick piece.
I'm going to have to try the pounding thing. I usually cook chicken breast as a menu filler. Sandwiches and salads mainly.

Murph
 
To help you feel better do a little research on the new temp/time and Bactria kill charts.

Ie chicken breast cooked and held @ 145 for about 9 mins kills that same bacteria as 165 for about 10 seconds. It’s 3 min at a INT of 150. The FDA recommends 165 for at least 30 seconds. The food regs in my state allows poultry to be served starting @ 145 and above if it is held for the appropriate time to equate to the 165. I will note that if it is cooked under an oven temp of 250 down to 225 then cook need to have a hour of high humidity (around 90%) at the exit. If the oven temp is under 225 it needs to be vac sealed in a food center and cooked at 100% humidity, ie in the bag…..

So with all that stuff, Personally, my min limit is 155 for 5 min and then it’s good to go…..I will add my cooker temp is always 265 or higher. If smoking at 225 then 160 for 5 min is my limit…….any ground would be 165 for me…..

Oh I should add that my limit for legs and thighs is 165 but always take them to at least 170 for taste….

Last thing is I only trust my thermapens in birds….
 
To help you feel better do a little research on the new temp/time and Bactria kill charts.

Ie chicken breast cooked and held @ 145 for about 9 mins kills that same bacteria as 165 for about 10 seconds. It’s 3 min at a INT of 150. The FDA recommends 165 for at least 30 seconds. The food regs in my state allows poultry to be served starting @ 145 and above if it is held for the appropriate time to equate to the 165. I will note that if it is cooked under an oven temp of 250 down to 225 then cook need to have a hour of high humidity (around 90%) at the exit. If the oven temp is under 225 it needs to be vac sealed in a food center and cooked at 100% humidity, ie in the bag…..

So with all that stuff, Personally, my min limit is 155 for 5 min and then it’s good to go…..I will add my cooker temp is always 265 or higher. If smoking at 225 then 160 for 5 min is my limit…….any ground would be 165 for me…..

Oh I should add that my limit for legs and thighs is 165 but always take them to at least 170 for taste….

Last thing is I only trust my thermapens in birds….

I must say.. that does make me feel better. Can you share who makes that claim? Please say it's not "not some guy named Bob." :emoji_astonished:

Now, I got you at hold at 165° F for 30 seconds and you're good. That makes sense to me. But what's this about serving at 145 if it's there long enough to equal 165. I don't get it.

And then adding humidity if cooked at 225-250. Yeeks! :emoji_cold_sweat: I'm lost!

I just recently followed SmokingAl's simple instructions of roasting at 225° F to an internal temperature of 165° and just ate the best chicken breast of my life! No humidity needed.

I probably shouldn't hit "send" on this because I'm afraid you'll take offense where none is intended. Please forgive me. I've honestly never heard of the new temp/time and bacteria kill charts. Do you meann sous vide cooking or maybe (likely) this pasteurization table mentioned here?: Thread 'PASTEURIZATION TABLE... or.. how to safely cook your food to a lower internal temperature..' https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t...-food-to-a-lower-internal-temperature.261182/

Thank you for your patience with me. I'm eager to learn more as this is new to me.

Respectfully yours,
Murph
 
I must say.. that does make me feel better. Can you share who makes that claim? Please say it's not "not some guy named Bob." :emoji_astonished:

Now, I got you at hold at 165° F for 30 seconds and you're good. That makes sense to me. But what's this about serving at 145 if it's there long enough to equal 165. I don't get it.

And then adding humidity if cooked at 225-250. Yeeks! :emoji_cold_sweat: I'm lost!

I just recently followed SmokingAl's simple instructions of roasting at 225° F to an internal temperature of 165° and just ate the best chicken breast of my life! No humidity needed.

I probably shouldn't hit "send" on this because I'm afraid you'll take offense where none is intended. Please forgive me. I've honestly never heard of the new temp/time and bacteria kill charts. Do you meann sous vide cooking or maybe (likely) this pasteurization table mentioned here?: Thread 'PASTEURIZATION TABLE... or.. how to safely cook your food to a lower internal temperature..' https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t...-food-to-a-lower-internal-temperature.261182/

Thank you for your patience with me. I'm eager to learn more as this is new to me.

Respectfully yours,
Murph

Edit second paragraph: "...serving at 145 if it's there long enough to equal 145." to "...enough to equal 165."
 
Below is the section of the code that defines the oven temp, humidly level, and holding at temp times. The times below are for everything but poultry and yes this is the pasteurization temps and times. Any Sous Vide chart will show the time for chicken that is under 165. I will point out though that every table has a "you should cook your chicken to 165" disclaimer due to tort liability and the FDA min temps.... 145 is the min for beef, for the FDA but there are "exclusions" for how its cooked (see below) and for intact muscle seared on a grill etc, which the surface has to hit 145.

Humidity helps kill the bacteria hence the requirement for high humidity cooking, it basically more similar to Sous Vide which is 100% humidity cooking. I will point out that for a restaurant to cook brisket they have to have at least 1 hour of 90% relative humidity as part of the cooking process if it is smoked under 250 degrees. I will point out that every home smoker violates the safe cooking temps and humidity for brisket, ribs, pulled pork.....ect. That said if you wrap it for an hour then you meet what a restaurant is held to.
oven times.PNG

Final note is that most home cooks do not have precise or actuate food temping device or know how to check, so with regards to the FDA temp of 165, this leaves lots of room for device error and the bugs are still killed. The 165 has a number of factors of safety because risks with chicken. 165 kills 99.9999% of the bugs in chicken however, 145 held for 8.5 - 9 minutes will make the same kill, however, the margin of error to temping and probe placement at 145 is very narrow vs 165.

This is the moral of the story....
just recently followed SmokingAl's simple instructions of roasting at 225° F to an internal temperature of 165° and just ate the best chicken breast of my life! No humidity needed.
smoking chicken breast at 225 till it hits 165 is money and if you happen to pull it at 160, just wrap it in foil for 10-15 minutes and your golden..... When I do 8-10 breasts for my wife for the week, I have breasts from 155 to 165 and once done I put them in a covered foil pan and then hold them i the oven at 155 for 20 minutes to and hour...
 
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I have a couple of approaches when it comes to chicken, first I avoid cooking whole birds as the dark meat and white meat need two separate internal temps. I butcher chickens or turkeys like this, and just pull the appropriate half when it's perfectly done.
8E9925Y.jpg

civilsmoker civilsmoker provided excellent information on using the time / temperature pasteurization charts and I've subscribed to this level of food safety for many years. Below is a great article from Thermoworks that explains how to use the same data and why you can trust the "hold time".

 
Below is the section of the code that defines the oven temp, humidly level, and holding at temp times. The times below are for everything but poultry and yes this is the pasteurization temps and times. Any Sous Vide chart will show the time for chicken that is under 165. I will point out though that every table has a "you should cook your chicken to 165" disclaimer due to tort liability and the FDA min temps.... 145 is the min for beef, for the FDA but there are "exclusions" for how its cooked (see below) and for intact muscle seared on a grill etc, which the surface has to hit 145.

Humidity helps kill the bacteria hence the requirement for high humidity cooking, it basically more similar to Sous Vide which is 100% humidity cooking. I will point out that for a restaurant to cook brisket they have to have at least 1 hour of 90% relative humidity as part of the cooking process if it is smoked under 250 degrees. I will point out that every home smoker violates the safe cooking temps and humidity for brisket, ribs, pulled pork.....ect. That said if you wrap it for an hour then you meet what a restaurant is held to.
View attachment 657851
Final note is that most home cooks do not have precise or actuate food temping device or know how to check, so with regards to the FDA temp of 165, this leaves lots of room for device error and the bugs are still killed. The 165 has a number of factors of safety because risks with chicken. 165 kills 99.9999% of the bugs in chicken however, 145 held for 8.5 - 9 minutes will make the same kill, however, the margin of error to temping and probe placement at 145 is very narrow vs 165.

This is the moral of the story....

smoking chicken breast at 225 till it hits 165 is money and if you happen to pull it at 160, just wrap it in foil for 10-15 minutes and your golden..... When I do 8-10 breasts for my wife for the week, I have breasts from 155 to 165 and once done I put them in a covered foil pan and then hold them i the oven at 155 for 20 minutes to and hour...

Boy, I sure do wish I could slam that "Like" button more than a few times. Thank you so much for being kind to me and understanding enough to know that I wanted some hand-holding here. Your margin of error thing got me over the hump. My chicken truly is the best I've ever had in my 62 years on God's good earth. At least as far as texture and tenderness. I can't imagine what this will taste like with a good brine and/or rub.

Which now begs the question - probably better for another thread but since it's my thread...

How are you pumping flavor into this bland-as-all-get-out chicken?

Civilsmoker, thank you again for your help. You (and others like you) are why I knew supporting this forum is a wise investment.

Murph
 
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I have a couple of approaches when it comes to chicken, first I avoid cooking whole birds as the dark meat and white meat need two separate internal temps. I butcher chickens or turkeys like this, and just pull the appropriate half when it's perfectly done.
View attachment 657854

civilsmoker civilsmoker provided excellent information on using the time / temperature pasteurization charts and I've subscribed to this level of food safety for many years. Below is a great article from Thermoworks that explains how to use the same data and why you can trust the "hold time".


Oh, man, oh, man, oh, man! Thanks for that article. I'm going to read that right a way. THANK YOU! It sounds like something I should know!

I'm with you on chopping and cooking per section. I also agree with Fueling Around who pounds his meat. Which sounds rude. But speaks to your own point about target cooking.

This forum is so worth it. Thank you for being here.

Murph
 
Oh, MAN! My mind has just been BLOWN by the temperature AND time concept. Who knew??

Shouldn't this be a sticky somewhere?? In my 62 years I've never heard of such a thing! Do you know how much sh!tty chicken I've eaten over the years?? Not happy.

But I am happy! I'm finally getting good (and safe!!!) chicken out of my kitchen after reading SMF. <Queue choir of angels> Thanks, guys!

Murph
 
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I have done bird parts similar to thirdeye thirdeye for a very long time and it yield perfect results.

However, here are a few links/examples of how I have been doing birds recently. Also to overcome the "bland" bird....... I learned this from Gordon Ramsey.... you have to either heavily season for the cook (its more than a sprinkle, or you moderately season (low on the salt) for the cook and then slice it and season after slicing (ie hit it with just a splash of salt and pepper....BAM BAM this uses less salt but adds more savoriness.

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/norman-rockwell-birds.313482/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/roasted-baby-spuds-bird.304066/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/classic-whole-roasted-bird.302978/

These birds are full of flavor and are crazy juicy... They also make a show for a dinner with guests!
 
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I have done bird parts similar to thirdeye thirdeye for a very long time and it yield perfect results.

However, here are a few links/examples of how I have been doing birds recently. Also to overcome the "bland" bird....... I learned this from Gordon Ramsey.... you have to either heavily season for the cook (its more than a sprinkle, or you moderately season (low on the salt) for the cook and then slice it and season after slicing (ie hit it with just a splash of salt and pepper....BAM BAM this uses less salt but adds more savoriness.

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/norman-rockwell-birds.313482/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/roasted-baby-spuds-bird.304066/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/classic-whole-roasted-bird.302978/

These birds are full of flavor and are crazy juicy... They also make a show for a dinner with guests!

This is AMAZING! We've chatted in direct message, which I am grateful for. Thank you for that. But now you have links to flavor bombs!! It is EXACTLY what I am looking for!

This place is amazing! Civilsmoker, you are awesome! Thanks, man! You are making perfect sense to a guy like me who is looking for good chicken!

Murph
 
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This is AMAZING! We've chatted in direct message, which I am grateful for. Thank you for that. But now you have links to flavor bombs!! It is EXACTLY what I am looking for!

This place is amazing! Civilsmoker, you are awesome! Thanks, man! You are making perfect sense to a guy like me who is looking for good chicken!

Murph
You are welcome Murph!
 
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