Second Bacon Attempt--Dry Brine This Time

[mneeley490]

Started up another batch yesterday with an 11 lb. pork belly, after slicing off the rind. This time I'm going by Todd Johnson's dry brine recipe: http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/109696/bacon-cure-recipe

However, I did make two substitutions. One, I am using MTQ for the cure. And two, maple sugar in place of the brown sugar. I'm hoping to get more of a maple flavor coming thru this time. Cut (unevenly) into three pieces. One was at 3 lb, 3.9 lb, and 4 lb.

I divided the cure mixture into what I believe was the right dosage for each piece, rubbed, and put into 2 gal. plastic bags and sucked as much air out as I could with a straw. (These pieces were much too big to use with my vacuum sealer.) And that's where it stands now. I will turn each bag daily and check on their progress.

I am calculating the rate of cure penetration as 1/4" per day, per side, plus 2 days. So if it is 1-3/4" at its thickest point, and the cure is working in from both sides equaling 1/2" each day, then it should be cured in 4 days, plus 2 more for good measure. That would mean that I could theoretically smoke on day 7, correct?

Pics to follow...

 

[dirtsailor2003]

Started up another batch yesterday with an 11 lb. pork belly, after slicing off the rind. This time I'm going by Todd Johnson's dry brine recipe: http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/109696/bacon-cure-recipe

 One, I am using MTQ for the cure. . Cut (unevenly) into three pieces. One was at 3 lb, 3.9 lb, and 4 lb.

I divided the cure mixture into what I believe was the right dosage for each piece, rubbed, and put into 2 gal. plastic bags and sucked

Pics to follow...

For Morton's TQ you need to use 1 tbsp (1/2 oz)  per pound. From the sounds of it you measured it all out for all three pieces mixed with the sugars then divided.  You should have measured the correct amount of cure out separately for each weighed piece of meat. Then added the divided sugar to each separate pile of measured cure . Then rub the required cure mixture into each piece, placing each piece into its own bag. If you divided after mixing with the sugar there is no way to know if the correct amount of cure got in each bag for the weight of each cut.

At least that's how I was taught to measure out for dry brining bacon. Also was taught to never swap amounts of different cures(original recipe called for Mortons Sugar Cure, not MTQ) per recipes called out amount.

 

[mneeley490]

That is exactly what I did. Sorry I wasn't clear on that, but I was typing at work & didn't have a lot of free time.

Combined sugar & spices, minus the MTQ, equaled 215 gr. Divided that into 65 gr, 75gr , & 75gr. Then added 3 T. MTQ to #1, 3 T.+ 2 t. to #2, and finally 4 T. to #3. Combined each separately and rubbed each piece of belly with the appropriate amount.

Flipped tonight. They are making a small amount of liquid, as to be expected.

 

[diggingdogfarm]

SI am calculating the rate of cure penetration as 1/4" per day, per side, plus 2 days. So if it is 1-3/4" at its thickest point, and the cure is working in from both sides equaling 1/2" each day, then it should be cured in 4 days, plus 2 more for good measure. That would mean that I could theoretically smoke on day 7, correct?

I would give it 7 days per inch of total thickness.
Yes, salt and cure may well have penetrated to the center in less time, but at a gradient.
It's best to allow extra time so that the salt and cure equalize evenly throughout the belly.


~Martin

 

[mneeley490]

I would give it 7 days per inch of total thickness.
Yes, salt and cure may well have penetrated to the center in less time, but at a gradient.
It's best to allow extra time so that the salt and cure equalize evenly throughout the belly.


~Martin

So at 1-3/4" we're looking at, say, 12 days curing time?

 

[diggingdogfarm]

Yeah.


~Martin

 

[mneeley490]

Ok, I can live with that. Thanks, Martin!

 

[mr t 59874]

Just a note: Morton Tender Quick is interchangable with the Sugar Cure Plain or Smoke for bacon dry surface application.  Morton does recomend 7 days per inch.  Mine usually run 1 3/4 to 2 inches so, I just cure 14 days just to simplify things, equalize for two days per mortons recomendation then smoke for three days.

 

[diggingdogfarm]

Just a note: Morton Tender Quick is interchangable with the Sugar Cure Plain or Smoke for bacon dry surface application.  Morton does recomend 7 days per inch.  Mine usually run 1 3/4 to 2 inches so, I just cure 14 days just to simplify things, equalize for two days per mortons recomendation then smoke for three days.

Morton Sugar Cure Smoke Flavored is for long term dry curing only, it's not interchangeable with MTQ or MSC, it's a different formula.



~Martin

 

[mr t 59874]

Morton Sugar Cure Smoke Flavored is for long term dry curing only, it's not interchangeable with MTQ or MSC, it's a different formula.



~Martin

Martin,  Quoting from the Morton Home Meat Curing Guide, Chapter 4, page 12 - BACON dry cure - 1/2 oz dry cure per pound of meat.  Sugar Cure (Plain or Smoke Flavored) mix is generally used, but Tender Quick may be used for dry application.

 

[diggingdogfarm]

The smoke flavored is intended for long term dry curing.
It shouldn't be used for the type of bacon that most folks are making.
It's intended for dry cured country ham or country bacon.

It contains only nitrate, no nitrite.

"Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] Smoke Flavor is only for dry curing ham and bacon. This product should not be used with other meats or in a brine cure."

http://www.mortonsalt.com/for-your-...g-salts/182/morton-sugar-cure-smoke-flavored/



~Martin

 

[mr t 59874]

The smoke flavored is intended for long term dry curing.
It shouldn't be used for the type of bacon that most folks are making.
It's intended for dry cured country ham or country bacon.

It contains only nitrate, no nitrite.

"Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] Smoke Flavor is only for dry curing ham and bacon. This product should not be used with other meats or in a brine cure."

http://www.mortonsalt.com/for-your-...g-salts/182/morton-sugar-cure-smoke-flavored/



~Martin

You are correct on the long term use of the smoke flavored cure.  That does not mean it cannot be used for bacon though.  On page seven the guide states that the mix is formulated for large cuts of meat like hams or bacon and should only be used for dry curing.  I do believe I mentioned dry cure in the previous post. 

 

[diggingdogfarm]

You are correct on the long term use of the smoke flavored cure.  That does not mean it cannot be used for bacon though.  On page seven the guide states that the mix is formulated for large cuts of meat like hams or bacon and should only be used for dry curing.  I do believe I mentioned dry cure in the previous post. 

Huh?
I don't think you read what I posted!
Who said it can't be used for bacon?
I certainly didn't.

The smoke flavored is intended for long term dry curing.
It shouldn't be used for the type of bacon that most folks are making.
It's intended for dry cured country ham or country bacon.

It contains only nitrate, no nitrite.

"Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] Smoke Flavor is only for dry curing ham and bacon. This product should not be used with other meats or in a brine cure."

http://www.mortonsalt.com/for-your-...g-salts/182/morton-sugar-cure-smoke-flavored/
~Martin

I brought this up because it's important that folks don't confuse dry cure, apply a dry cure and dry curing, they're not all the same thing when it comes to using nitrite and nitrate.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/124452/confusing-dry-curing-with-dry-curing


~Martin

 

[mr t 59874]

Martin, OMG,  So whats your bottom line?  Are you saying that Morton is wrong, that it can't be used as stated in the guide? 

 

[diggingdogfarm]

One more time.
Folks should not be using it (Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] Smoke Flavored) for short term curing, it's intended for long term DRY curing, just as Morton's says.

"Are the meat curing products interchangeable?
Only Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Tender Quick[emoji]174[/emoji] and Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] PLAIN are interchangeable measure for measure. Morton[emoji]174[/emoji] Sugar Cure[emoji]174[/emoji] Smoke Flavored is used for DRY curing ham and bacon only."

http://www.mortonsalt.com/faqs/meat-curing-faqs


~Martin

 

[mr t 59874]

One more time.
Folks should not be using it for short term curing, it's intended for long term dry curing, just as Morton's says.


~Martin

The above quote is correct, but not complete.   I refer you back to post # 10 in this thread. 

 I see there are ones that use no nitrate or nitrite.  Would  I do that?   No, I'll stick with Morton's curring mixes and recommendations.  They say that MTQ, MSC and MSFSC  all can be used at the rate of 1/2 oz per pound @ 7 days per inch. I take it they consider that long term for dry cured bacon.

 Personally I use MTQ on my pork bellies and have always had excellent results.

I am not going to get involved any further in a P'n match here.  The important thing is and I'm sure you will agree, when folks are using a commercial cure or brine, they should stick to the manufactures recommendations.  At the price of meat these days, no one wants to toss any out.

Tom

 

[diggingdogfarm]

It's not a P'n match, MTQ and MSCP can be used for long term dry curing (my family used them for decades on the farm), but MSCSF is NOT intended for short term fast curing, the way most folks cure bacon now-a-days.
And again, folks confuse dry curing with apply a dry cure short term, they're not the same thing.

~Martin

 

[mr t 59874]

If this isn't a match I will continue.  I'm not discussing other curing methods here whatever they might be, just Morton's.  You stated that the cures were not interchangeable, but they are when using the dry cure treatment for bacon and dry surface application.

  I strongly recommend to the ones using Morton cures, that they purchase their Curing Guide as it goes into more detail than what can be retrieved from their web sites.  After all, if they put all the guide info on the web, the guide sales would diminish.

Tom

Martin, Been wanting to ask.  Have you or any one else been able to ice fish this year?  Terrible conditions here.

 

[diggingdogfarm]

If this isn't a match I will continue.  I'm not discussing other curing methods here whatever they might be, just Morton's.  You stated that the cures were not interchangeable, but they are when using the dry cure treatment for bacon and dry surface application.

  I strongly recommend to the ones using Morton cures, that they purchase their Curing Guide as it goes into more detail than what can be retrieved from their web sites.  After all, if they put all the guide info on the web, the guide sales would diminish.

Tom

Martin, Been wanting to ask.  Have you or any one else been able to ice fish this year?  Terrible conditions here.

Again, the bottom line is, MSCSF is not intended for and should not be used for short term curing.

No ice fishing here this year, or last year, it hasn't been cold enough.


~Martin

 

[chef jimmyj]

The subject of the Sodium Nitrate in Morton's Cures and whether it is safe for use in the typical 14 day Dry Brining, Dry Curing or anything less other than a long Cured Country style Bacon has lead to Many a battle here. While I have not personally talked to anyone at Morton's others have and the company believes in and endorses their product. Since the company has been in business since the late 1840's, they may just not put any value in studies showing the use and consumption of unconverted nitrate as causing an issue. I know Nitrate has been banned for Bacon production by the USDA but I can't seem to find any info from them on why...I have read the studies on Nitrite and Nitrate forming Nitrosamines during high temp cooking, but nitrosamines can be formed in the gut as well. Studies show the addition of Vitamin C reduces the Nitrosamine so that enjoy the Bacon and a glass of OJ and be worry free!  Is there an issue with Nitrate being converted by the Bacteria in the Gut and reaching toxic or unsafe levels. I just can't find any reason why this discussion or argument continues. You have any info on this Martin?...JJ

This is an interesting read...http://culinaryarts.about.com/od/seasoningflavoring/a/nitrates.htm