Went to my buddy's meat counter today and he gave me a hint most of you may have heard. He told me to just cook until you can gently remove the bone. Let me tell you it works, the shoulder fell apart on the way to the pan! I have some pics on my phone of it smoking and I can tell you (not trying to brag) it is some of the best I have ever ate!! I didn't even pull it hardly! even more tender than the best steak I ever ate!