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Nitrite Toxicity

Bearcarver

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I tend to agree but the definition seems to depend on the source...JJ😆

Buckboard bacon differs from traditional American style bacon in that its meat source is typically pork butt, also sometimes referred to as Boston Butt, despite its name does not come from the pig’s butt. Polk butt is a section of the pig that comes from the top part of the shoulder from the front legs.

Additionally, buckboard bacon can be sourced from pork loin as well, which is located just behind the shoulder along the back of the pig. Other areas of the pig can be used to make buckboard bacon, but basically it means any area that is not pork belly, where it is cured and then smoked.

My comment wasn't important enough to have you spend time researching.
All I did was tell what CB & BBB are referring to on this Forum for many years.
CB from Loin----BBB from Pork (Boston) Butt. That was all.

I never even hear of "Polk Butt".

Bear
 

bill1

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...I read your info twice before I stumbled on the " Given as" that took me to Blonder's paper.
I am just requesting that since folks can often benefit from additional info, that you post a more obvious link....
Ah, I see your point. Yes the way this blog renders the hyperlinks (no blue text!) is not real obvious it's a link and can be confused readily for text merely bolded for emphasis. I will try to remember to include spelling out the URL in the future to make it clear a link is intended. Since you have to C&P it anyway to use the Insert Link tool, it's no extra work at all. Thanks for the suggestion.

...Let me see if I am on the same page as you...A Lethal Dose of Nitrite is 22mg/Kg of body weight...Then, if a man of Any Weight should consume enough Nitrite to reach 22ppm of his total weight, it's the same fatal dose?
Exactly! By using dimensionless units it frees you from using only mg and kg. So a teaspoon of pink cure is .2 ounces. It's 1/16 NaNO2, so that teaspoon contains .0125 oz of NaNO2. Divide by 16 again to get .00078 pounds of NaNO2. If I weigh 200 pounds, then I divide .00078 pounds by 200 pounds and I get .0000039. Note the pounds divided by pounds is just 1 and goes away. If I multiply that little number by 1 million, I get 3.9 which here means 3.9ppm. Since 3.9<22 I'm not dead but it's close enough to 5 (for adverse affects) that I'd say that's a little too close for comfort. Now a teaspoon of pink cure on a 2# steak is( .2 oz)/(16 ounces/#)/(2#)=.00625. I could multiple by a million to get ppm, but now I'm going to multiply by 100 and get percent, or .625%. Most people would NOT consider that too salty. They might even want a little more. This is why I say pink cure can be dangerous...don't use it as a substitute for salt. Which leads to your 3rd point...

...On adding Cure to get a Ring, Nothing to defend... I didn't realize it was that common or desired...A Ring is Pretty but contributes very little to the flavor...
JJ, my Friend, from your posts it's clear you're a master cook. Me, heck my wife doesn't even like my cooking. There is no way I'd ever consider entering a competition. So the pink color is strictly for me. But I also think NaNO2 adds its own unique flavor which I confess I kinda' like. Again, I am just a hack when it comes to the culinary arts. Perhaps no one else in God's big earth would add pink cure for flavor. But if one does, then one needs to REALLY worry about approaching levels that may not be wise, because it's just not that hard to do. That was my only point.
 

bill1

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Yes...But it's the Salt, in 20 pounds of Bacon, that will kill you first!😊...JJ If my math is right...
20 pounds of Bacon, 9072g at 3% Salt contains about 272g Salt. A Lethal dose for a 75Kg man is 56g. I'm thinking 5X the Lethal dose would kill you!
I agree with the math, although I think we can maybe tolerate salt a little better than 56g/75kg = .75 parts-per-thousand or 750ppm.
This link:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_poisoning
says I can go to 3000ppm or 4X higher. The 272g in the 75kg man is 272g/75kg = 3.6 parts-per-thousand or 3600ppm, which is still >3000ppm so alas, he's a goner but...wait for it...what a way to go!
 

bill1

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bill1 and JJ...
for someone like me who's english is second language I need straight answer...
If I ever successfully manage to eat in one day, 20 lbs of store bought, commercially processed bacon, m I gonna die? Yes. or no? 😊
I wasn't quite sure how to read JJ's table at:
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage-making/curing/nitrates
so I consulted this USDA link for help:
https://www.fsis.usda.gov/wps/porta...t-preparation/bacon-and-food-safety/ct_index/
It appears that 20# of bacon could have up to 200ppm of NaNO2 in it or 4000 millionths of a pound or 4 thousandths of a pound = .004# of NaNO2. If you weigh 150# that's .004/150=27ppm which is >22ppm so, sorry, you're dead.
Very stupid of you.
Now if you'd wisely eaten 10# of bacon per day for a year prior, you'd weigh 300# so then .004/300 = 13ppm and you're alive!!! Also the salt wouldn't have killed you either by that clever plan.
So he that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
(I'm joking...fun with math.)
 

dernektambura

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I wasn't quite sure how to read JJ's table at:
https://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage-making/curing/nitrates
so I consulted this USDA link for help:
https://www.fsis.usda.gov/wps/porta...t-preparation/bacon-and-food-safety/ct_index/
It appears that 20# of bacon could have up to 200ppm of NaNO2 in it or 4000 millionths of a pound or 4 thousandths of a pound = .004# of NaNO2. If you weigh 150# that's .004/150=27ppm which is >22ppm so, sorry, you're dead.
Very stupid of you.
Now if you'd wisely eaten 10# of bacon per day for a year prior, you'd weigh 300# so then .004/300 = 13ppm and you're alive!!! Also the salt wouldn't have killed you either by that clever plan.
So he that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
(I'm joking...fun with math.)
Ay caramba!... Not good... but, lets stop for a moment having a fun with a math and calculate by using grams and percentage...
Nitrite:
20 lb = 9090 grams...
0.25% cure#1 = 22.725 gr
cure #1 contain 93.75% salt and 6.25% nitrite... so...
22.725 minus 6.25% = 21.304 gr of salt
22.725 minus 21.304 = 1.421 gr of Nitrite
1.421gr of pure Nitrite is lethal dose and I am dead...

Lets take a look at example of 1.5% salt addition:
20lbs. = 9090 gr
1.5% salt addition = 136.35 gr
Now, salt consumption lethal dose is 1 gr/kg of weight... I am dead @ 80kg as well as 300lbs guy you mentioned @ his 136 kg weight...
Also, lets not forget addition of 21 gr of salt from our nitrite calculation and add to 136 gr of our salt calculation and we get 157 gr of salt in 20 lbs of bacon... You may ask why we add salt from nitrite calculation and answer is that 99% of people does not subtract curing salt amount from salt called by recipe...Yea... salt would kill me twice...

Make sense?
 
Last edited:

bill1

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...Nitrite...1.421gr of pure Nitrite is lethal dose and I am dead...

...Now, salt consumption lethal dose is 1 gr/kg of weight... I am dead @ 80kg as well as 300lbs guy...
Make sense?
Our maths are giving the same answers, we just differ in where we're heading. If we all agree that 23mg/kg = 23ppm is the lethal dose for NaNO2 per body weight, then 1.421g=1421mg is lethal for bodies less than 1421/23 = 62kg = 140#. Welterweights and above survive!

On the salt, we differ on what's fatal. You say 1g/kg=1ppt=1000ppm is lethal. I used 3000ppm based on the Wikipedia entry and JJ used 750ppm. Anyone want to find some refereed journal publications supporting either of these numbers? I confess I'd rather think about eating bacon than working that hard.
 

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