My first Italian sausage, and please help me improve!

[sawhorseray]

"Pick a recipe from here , Kutas or marianski and follow it . See where you end up ."

I agree 100%. While the Kutas book has always been my bible, Marianski's books are a little more up to date on the amount of nitrates and nitrites used in smoking and sausage recipes. RAY

 

[chopsaw]

Yeah , I like them both , but like Marianski because of the smaller batch recipies .

 

[Polka]

Also in re-reading the thread, I'm not sure what your internal temps you are trying to reach -- should be about 152 IT for the sausage when heating for poaching and freezing, or cured and smoking. My first two batches were a similar mishap to yours -- meat and fat / water separated, and was dry. Basically overcooked / fat-out for me. We all try not to do that if we can help it. I'm sure this is what you try to avoid too. I just couldn't tell in the thread for certain what IT you were shooting for, or achieved.

Take care, and happier stuffing for ya!

R

 

[DanMcG]

40% fat is a lot. You could add some chicken thigh meat to up the ratio to around 80/20

 

[daveomak]

So, more like an emulsified sausage, extract more protein from the meat? Is there any additives I could add to increase the binding ability? Other than egg whites.

You could add STPP... Sodium Tripoly Phosphate... I add it to most stuff... Sticks, Ham, Sausage, Ribs.....
There are products made for Brisket if you want to win the cookoff.. See meat specialty outlets like Walton's...
Walton's 1
Walton's 2

 

[Armyguy2004]

I'd think it has to be either not enough fat in the sausage or you aren't mixing till it becomes sticky, as danmcg stated. Most fresh Italian is made from straight porkbutt, which I believe has a fat content of around 30%. I don't know of anyone who has ever had to use soy protein concentrate or dry milk powder in fresh Italian, that stuff comes into play when sausage is going to be smoked. Most recipes call for one cup of liquid for every five pounds of meat, and the batch needs to be mixed for a good ten minutes, until it become sticky. There is a book titled "Great Sausage Recipes & Meat Smoking" authored by Rytec Kutas that has always been my bible, great guidelines. RAYView attachment 403749
View attachment 403750

So, how do you mix them well with machines? I have been using either a stand mixer or a food processor. I normally use food processor for the emulsified sausages. How do you mix them and for how long? Thank you!

 

[Armyguy2004]

So is that 40 % fat ? I think the guide line for Italian in the US is 33% . You're buying the meat pre ground ? I use 80 / 20 and grind myself .

I think you need to start from the beginning .
Get the meat paste closer to 80 / 20 .

I just looked at your recipe , 2 Tablespoons of water for 3 lbs I would say is low .

The amount of water I use varies on the meat paste . I measure out 1 cup per 5 lbs . Then add it a little at a time until it comes together ( gets sticky ) most times it's about 1/2 cup per 5lbs of meat paste .

In the picture , your casings look like they weren't soaked enough . I store mine wet like the link posted above .

Pick a recipe from here , Kutas or marianski and follow it . See where you end up .

So the mixing would help the myosin to coat the water and keep them within? I have been reading marianski s book.

 

[Armyguy2004]

You could add STPP... Sodium Tripoly Phosphate... I add it to most stuff... Sticks, Ham, Sausage, Ribs.....
There are products made for Brisket if you want to win the cookoff.. See meat specialty outlets like Walton's...
Walton's 1
Walton's 2

Thank you, and this is a bit out of my league at the moment . Thank you for helping!

 

[sawhorseray]

So, how do you mix them well with machines? I have been using either a stand mixer or a food processor. I normally use food processor for the emulsified sausages. How do you mix them and for how long? Thank you!

I used to use a hand mixer like this one

005.JPG

• sawhorseray
• Feb 24, 2015

You can get them from Cabelas for about $45, they do a 20lb batch. You crank the meat for about ten minutes, it becomes sticky and perfect for stuffing, I like natural hog casings. My shoulders are shot so a few years back I got a meat mixer from Cabelas that attaches to my one horse power grinder, now I drill a beer while things are getting mixed up. Stick with the Marianski book, it'll have all you need to know and you'll be a pro in no time. RAY

 

[Armyguy2004]

I used to use a hand mixer like this one

005.JPG

• sawhorseray
• Feb 24, 2015

You can get them from Cabelas for about $45, they do a 20lb batch. You crank the meat for about ten minutes, it becomes sticky and perfect for stuffing, I like natural hog casings. My shoulders are shot so a few years back I got a meat mixer from Cabelas that attaches to my one horse power grinder, now I drill a beer while things are getting mixed up. Stick with the Marianski book, it'll have all you need to know and you'll be a pro in no time. RAY

thank you, i was thinking to buy one of these things! nice to know this is still in fashion!

 

[chopsaw]

I do 5 lb batches and mix by hand .

 

[daveomak]

You don't need to cook sausage to 152F... You can follow pasteurization table put out by the USDA/FDA...

Cooking you sausage to, as an example, to 135F internal temperature, and hold at that temperature for 36 minutes, it will be fully cooked and pasteurized for a safe level of bacteria reduction... Personally, I cook to a recommended temperatures for a longer period of time to increase the bacterial reduction to be on the safe side...

Temperature Time Temperature Time
°F (°C) (Minutes) °F (°C) (Seconds)
130 (54.4) 112 min 146 (63.3) 169 sec
131 (55.0) 89 min 147 (63.9) 134 sec
132 (55.6) 71 min 148 (64.4) 107 sec
133 (56.1) 56 min 149 (65.0) 85 sec
134 (56.7) 45 min 150 (65.6) 67 sec
135 (57.2) 36 min 151 (66.1) 54 sec
136 (57.8) 28 min 152 (66.7) 43 sec
137 (58.4) 23 min 153 (67.2) 34 sec
138 (58.9) 18 min 154 (67.8) 27 sec
139 (59.5) 15 min 155 (68.3) 22 sec
140 (60.0) 12 min 156 (68.9) 17 sec
141 (60.6) 9 min 157 (69.4) 14 sec
142 (61.1) 8 min 158 (70.0) 0 sec
143 (61.7) 6 min
144 (62.2) 5 min
145 (62.8) 4 min
Table C.1: Pasteurization times for beef, corned beef, lamb, pork and cured pork (FDA, 2009, 3-401.11.B.2).

 

[Armyguy2004]

You don't need to cook sausage to 152F... You can follow pasteurization table put out by the USDA/FDA...

Cooking you sausage to, as an example, to 135F internal temperature, and hold at that temperature for 36 minutes, it will be fully cooked and pasteurized for a safe level of bacteria reduction... Personally, I cook to a recommended temperatures for a longer period of time to increase the bacterial reduction to be on the safe side...

Temperature Time Temperature Time
°F (°C) (Minutes) °F (°C) (Seconds)
130 (54.4) 112 min 146 (63.3) 169 sec
131 (55.0) 89 min 147 (63.9) 134 sec
132 (55.6) 71 min 148 (64.4) 107 sec
133 (56.1) 56 min 149 (65.0) 85 sec
134 (56.7) 45 min 150 (65.6) 67 sec
135 (57.2) 36 min 151 (66.1) 54 sec
136 (57.8) 28 min 152 (66.7) 43 sec
137 (58.4) 23 min 153 (67.2) 34 sec
138 (58.9) 18 min 154 (67.8) 27 sec
139 (59.5) 15 min 155 (68.3) 22 sec
140 (60.0) 12 min 156 (68.9) 17 sec
141 (60.6) 9 min 157 (69.4) 14 sec
142 (61.1) 8 min 158 (70.0) 0 sec
143 (61.7) 6 min
144 (62.2) 5 min
145 (62.8) 4 min
Table C.1: Pasteurization times for beef, corned beef, lamb, pork and cured pork (FDA, 2009, 3-401.11.B.2).

so in this way, you can keep the meat at a lower temperature, and prevent the fat from melting?

 

[chopsaw]

so in this way, you can keep the meat at a lower temperature, and prevent the fat from melting?

Are you making sausage for grilling ? Pre cooking ? Most Italian would be fresh not be pre cooked .
Get the lean to fat at the right amounts .
You have had some very good advice above . You should start there . Good luck .

 

[daveomak]

so in this way, you can keep the meat at a lower temperature, and prevent the fat from melting?

Yes... It makes a more "tooth friendly" sausage... No fat out... etc... It's not dry and crumbly....

..