Another MES not heating thread

[themeatsweats]

Hi all. Neighbor was throwing out an MES model 20075415 due to it not heating up. Element is testing at 12ohms and the connectors at the element look ok, but were only reading about 24V when the unit was turned on, so I moved on to the safety switch as detailed in this post. When trying to take the quick connects off to test continuity, however, the thing shattered into 4-5 pieces.

I'm not in the market for a PID yet. I am pretty interested after reading a bit, but I've never actually smoked anything, so want to make sure this is something I enjoy before investing.

1. What's my best course of action to continue troubleshooting? Can I just temporarily connect the 2 wires that would have gone to that switch?
2. Are these still the right replacements? I don't really need 5...

 

[tallbm]

Hi all. Neighbor was throwing out an MES model 20075415 due to it not heating up. Element is testing at 12ohms and the connectors at the element look ok, but were only reading about 24V when the unit was turned on, so I moved on to the safety switch as detailed in this post. When trying to take the quick connects off to test continuity, however, the thing shattered into 4-5 pieces.

I'm not in the market for a PID yet. I am pretty interested after reading a bit, but I've never actually smoked anything, so want to make sure this is something I enjoy before investing.

1. What's my best course of action to continue troubleshooting? Can I just temporarily connect the 2 wires that would have gone to that switch?
2. Are these still the right replacements? I don't really need 5...

Hi there and welcome!

1. Yes you can wire nut those wires together at the safety switch and if that switch was the issue (very likely it was), the smoker will heat up and run for you.
WARNING: You won't have the safety switch in the mix so know what you are doing and keep an eye on things. Do this at your own peril.

... Now that I'm done with the disclaimer lol we can talk about a replacement switch.

2. Normally you want 150C switches to exactly replace the one that is busted and to use a ceramic version for more durability.
Best I could find at the moment was a 160C (320F) ceramic switch that was available for a decent price that would do the job. I run a 355F switch or so in mine so you will be fine, just keep an eye on things.

Now get this EXACT switch!
There are 2 different styles that look the same but are very different and only this style will work so get this exact one:

https://www.amazon.com/a13103100ux1198-Replaceable-Celsius-Temperature-Thermostat/dp/B017D2TQMA/ref=sr_1_9?crid=33EOTLFIQ6LPP&keywords=KSD301+155C+ceramic&qid=1675578444&refinements=p_85%3A2470955011&rnid=2470954011&rps=1&sprefix=ksd301+155c+ceramic%2Caps%2C110&sr=8-9

Also use hi temp connectors as the ones used by Masterbuilt are trash.

You seem to be savvy with electrical components so this should be a breeze for you.

Once you get this thing going and you want to kick it up to a whole other level (like having a brand new smoker) we can talk PID rewiring and buying a PID controller.

I think you are on the right path though. Get your feet wet and once you know you love smoking food you can turn that "golf cart" of an MES into a Ferrari by doing the simple rewire (cut off 4 wire ends and splice to make 2 whole wires) and using a PID controller for superior performance :)

 

[themeatsweats]

Rigged the switch together temporarily to see if that was the culprit and still didn't get the element to heat up, so I kept digging and found this on the bottom circuit board. Doesn't look right to me. Seems these boards don't exist for sale, either :(

 

[tallbm]

Rigged the switch together temporarily to see if that was the culprit and still didn't get the element to heat up, so I kept digging and found this on the bottom circuit board. Doesn't look right to me. Seems these boards don't exist for sale, either :(
View attachment 657055

Ouch looks like your board is done.

This is the time to talk the simple rewire and a PID controller.

Read here for a ton of detail on the simple rewire along with tons of pics.
In short, you cut the ends off 4 of those wires down at the circuit board and wirenut/splice to make 2 whole wires.
At that point the MES plug will feed power directly to the heating element while keeping the safety switch in the loop (except in your case).
If you do this and it heats up then you KNOW it's the board for sure :D

HeaterMeter Controller, with Wifi, and Electric Smoker (MES40) Mod in Detail

Want to know how to setup the HeaterMeter PID Controller with Wifi to work with the MES? Here you go :) Table of Contents Overview HeaterMeter Mod Design MES Rewired - just mention don't go into detail HeaterMeter Based Controller Box Wiring and Diagrams HeaterMeter Setup Common Setup...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

If it heats up then lets talk PID controllers because that is how your smoker will get controlled and will be a MONSTER of a smoker with it's performance :)

 

[themeatsweats]

Thanks tallbm . I think it's just those 2 transistors, so if I can get my hands on a couple I'll give that a whirl first. I was looking at Auber's, and then got really excited about the opensource/diy HeaterMeter, but it looks like the store is out of commission and there hasn't been any news for a few years. Is the project dead?

 

[tallbm]

Thanks tallbm . I think it's just those 2 transistors, so if I can get my hands on a couple I'll give that a whirl first. I was looking at Auber's, and then got really excited about the opensource/diy HeaterMeter, but it looks like the store is out of commission and there hasn't been any news for a few years. Is the project dead?

Not sure. I bought my HeaterMeter from Auber. They still sell a complete one but you have to buy all the peripheral stuff to build a complete controller for an electric smoker. It was intended for charcoal smoker with blower fans.

HeaterMeter for BBQ Control [HeaterMeter] - $129.95 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry

Auber Instruments, Inc. HeaterMeter for BBQ Control [HeaterMeter] - New product release! Auber SYL-3615 2nd generation WIFI charcoal smoker controller! See details here. Update: We have a few HeaterMeter Cases with small aesthetic defects for sale. Click SD-HMCase for details...

www.auberins.com

I have a big post on using it with the MES.
My wifi no longer works and I think it is pc board related, but I don't need it. The wifi was nice to have when learning and logging specific smokes but at this point I've done so many of them that I don't need the historical data. I know how my system performs and what to expect.

The worst part of using a heater meter (or making any PID controller) has to be finding and fabricating on/working on a project box!

....well after I did all the homework to figure out the tunings that is hahaha. You can read all about Heater Meter settings here from my old post.

HeaterMeter Controller, with Wifi, and Electric Smoker (MES40) Mod in Detail

Want to know how to setup the HeaterMeter PID Controller with Wifi to work with the MES? Here you go :) Table of Contents Overview HeaterMeter Mod Design MES Rewired - just mention don't go into detail HeaterMeter Based Controller Box Wiring and Diagrams HeaterMeter Setup Common Setup...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

I hope this info helps :)

 

[choochooman442]

I found MES 40 at the dump and rewired for a DIY PID control.

MES 40 Dump Find

Found this MES 40 in my local metal dump, as expected the control was dead. I had made a PID based control module for my 500 gallon counter flow smoker but had never used it. After cleaning off ten years worth of woodworking dust I mounted it on the MES 40. The MES wiring was easy to strip out...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

 

[tallbm]

I found MES 40 at the dump and rewired for a DIY PID control.

MES 40 Dump Find

Found this MES 40 in my local metal dump, as expected the control was dead. I had made a PID based control module for my 500 gallon counter flow smoker but had never used it. After cleaning off ten years worth of woodworking dust I mounted it on the MES 40. The MES wiring was easy to strip out...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

Can't beat a free one like your situation lol!

I always tell people the best MES you can get is one that you find for free or for like $40-$50 and then rewire and slap a PID on :)

 

[river100]

Thanks tallbm . I think it's just those 2 transistors, so if I can get my hands on a couple I'll give that a whirl first. I was looking at Auber's, and then got really excited about the opensource/diy HeaterMeter, but it looks like the store is out of commission and there hasn't been any news for a few years. Is the project dead?

I'm curious as to whether you fixed that control board. If one or both of those transistors were bad then more than likely the power relay was bad too. Something had to cause them to have too high of a current draw and get hot. My experience with component level repair of simple boards like that is that the transistors and relays are super simple to source. I'd be willing to bet the transistors are 2n4124 and or 2n3904. The most common ones used for driving small power relays. Edit. there is always a diode across the coil of relays and it could be the source of the high current draw if it ended up being shorted.

 

[themeatsweats]

I'm curious as to whether you fixed that control board. If one or both of those transistors were bad then more than likely the power relay was bad too. Something had to cause them to have too high of a current draw and get hot. My experience with component level repair of simple boards like that is that the transistors and relays are super simple to source. I'd be willing to bet the transistors are 2n4124 and or 2n3904. The most common ones used for driving small power relays. Edit. there is always a diode across the coil of relays and it could be the source of the high current draw if it ended up being shorted.

Hard to tell if it was rust or grease or dirt or something else going on, but they were the only items that visually appeared to be bad. Replaced them with https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YN7HVPN based on the tiny numbers I found on the faulty ones. My component level soldering experience is non-existent, so I'm not sure if I did a poor job or there was something else going on like you mentioned, but it still does not work and is in pieces on my garage floor next to a few other unfinished projects :) :(

 

[river100]

Hard to tell if it was rust or grease or dirt or something else going on, but they were the only items that visually appeared to be bad. Replaced them with https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YN7HVPN based on the tiny numbers I found on the faulty ones. My component level soldering experience is non-existent, so I'm not sure if I did a poor job or there was something else going on like you mentioned, but it still does not work and is in pieces on my garage floor next to a few other unfinished projects :) :(

It's a pretty basic board. Any component level tech could knock it out easily. If you know a TV repair tech they could do it. If not you might want to join the PID club... I don't have that model but tallbm probably knows the wiring on it inside and out.