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Adding Jalapeno or Hatch Chili???

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Big_John

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If you have a tried and true recipe for smoking sausage and then hanging it to cure for 3-4 weeks......

What if you add either Jalapeno or Green Chili to the meat before you stuff the sausages .... then smoke and hang to cure????

My uncle, an ole pro to this says he would be concerned with the peppers/chilis negatively affecting the cure.

What do you think? Is it a good idea or a bad idea to add finely diced Jalapeno or Green Chili to the meat?

I know I can easily add the diced pepper/chili to sausages we cold smoke, immediately package and take to the freezer... to then pull out and grill. But what about smoked/cured sausages that hang for 3-4 weeks and are not cooked???
 
Adding fresh peppers can definitely change the moisture content, which might interfere with the curing process and even lead to spoilage if not done carefully. One approach is to lightly roast or dehydrate them first to reduce water. That way you can still get the flavour without compromising the cure or texture of the sausage.
 
..... One approach is to lightly roast or dehydrate them first to reduce water. That way you can still get the flavour without compromising the cure or texture of the sausage.
Great suggestion... Dry before.....
 
I think you are confusing dry cured salami and smoke sausages. But since this was posted in the sausage forum, I am responding for clarification. Smoke sausages use less 2% salt and are not dried. Salami uses higher salt above 2.75%, may or may not be smoked, and can be dried. The two are not the same.
 
Also, if I remember right, you were asking some questions about drying some sausages from an old family recipe. 1.25-1.5" diameter if I remember right. My question for you is this-how fresh was the meat? Was the meat from a recently slaughtered pig-and the salami made within 24 hours of the kill? This is important, because this was likely how it was done 100 years ago. Using ultra fresh pork within 24 hours of the kill ensured there was enough natural glycogen and residual sugars in the tissue to fuel fermentation to get a reasonably good pH drop for safety. This was likely not written down in the recipe, it was assumed the pork was ultra fresh. Not only that, but using ultra freshly butchered pork ensures a very low bacteria load on the meat prior to processing the dried sausages.

This is not the case when using commodity pork bought in cryovac packs at a local grocery store. there is not enough residual sugars in the meat to fuel fermentation to get a reasonable pH drop. You might get 0.1-0.2 drop in pH, and with commodity pork meat being around pH 5.7-5.8 that would put you around 5.6-5.7 which is still not low enough to be a significant safety hurdle for a dried sausage. Combine this with a much higher bacterial load, and you are taking chances. This is why a fermentable sugar like dextrose is added when making a dried sausage....to replace the natural sugars that were present in a freshly butchered pig. Old timers did not need to be concerned with this step, but when making salami with modern commodity pork it is imperative to use a fermentable sugar like dextrose.
 
Also, if I remember right, you were asking some questions about drying some sausages from an old family recipe. 1.25-1.5" diameter if I remember right. My question for you is this-how fresh was the meat? Was the meat from a recently slaughtered pig-and the salami made within 24 hours of the kill? This is important, because this was likely how it was done 100 years ago. Using ultra fresh pork within 24 hours of the kill ensured there was enough natural glycogen and residual sugars in the tissue to fuel fermentation to get a reasonably good pH drop for safety. This was likely not written down in the recipe, it was assumed the pork was ultra fresh. Not only that, but using ultra freshly butchered pork ensures a very low bacteria load on the meat prior to processing the dried sausages.

This is not the case when using commodity pork bought in cryovac packs at a local grocery store. there is not enough residual sugars in the meat to fuel fermentation to get a reasonable pH drop. You might get 0.1-0.2 drop in pH, and with commodity pork meat being around pH 5.7-5.8 that would put you around 5.6-5.7 which is still not low enough to be a significant safety hurdle for a dried sausage. Combine this with a much higher bacterial load, and you are taking chances. This is why a fermentable sugar like dextrose is added when making a dried sausage....to replace the natural sugars that were present in a freshly butchered pig. Old timers did not need to be concerned with this step, but when making salami with modern commodity pork it is imperative to use a fermentable sugar like dextrose.

I hear you and respect the Science and believe it. But......

The sausage our family makes is generally either 65% Venison/35% Boston Butt or a 50/50... depending upon who makes it and what their preference is. For my batch, it was 65% Pork and 35% Venison, as I was short on Deer. For the last 50 years the Boston Butts have been purchased from a grocery store. We have never added any type of sugar to the seasoning mix. It is Salt, Pepper, Cayenne Powder, Red Pepper Flake, Garlic and #1 Cure. We cold smoke for 24-36 hours and then hang to cure/dry for 10-21 days, depending upon Environmental conditions and how thick the sausages stuffed. Not a single time, never.... in decades have we had a spoiled batch and to my knowledge never a sickness or sour stomach after eating. The family as a whole makes anywhere between 600-1,000 lbs every year.

But, everyone sticks with the basic recipe and has never deviated. I was intrigued at the idea of adding Jalapeno or Green Chili, as I purchased some store-bought, smoked, dried sausage in New Mexico not long ago that had Green Chili and it was outstanding. I think the advice to dry the chili before mixing it in to the sausage grind is a great idea. I have a little 23 lb batch I need to finish and I think I am going to do some experimenting.


..........
 
Well, you are taking chances making a dry sausage without fermentation; and you are not following USDA guidelines for a dried sausage. It works-until it doesn't. You are using cure #1, so Botulism is in check, but if the drying goes longer than 30 days, you should use cure #2. I also highly suggest you use minimum of 2.75% salt for a strong safety hurdle. Worst offenders for a high pH in a salami from my knowledge are Staphylococcus Aureus, and Listeria monocytogenes:


Fermentation in dry sausage (such as salami) production creates multiple **"hurdles"** that work together to inhibit pathogenic bacteria. The primary goal during the early fermentation stage is to rapidly lower the pH through lactic acid production by beneficial lactic acid bacteria (LAB, often from starter cultures). This acidification, combined with salt, nitrite/nitrate, reduced water activity (a_w) from drying, and sometimes anaerobic conditions inside the casing, prevents **exponential growth** of pathogens like *Staphylococcus aureus* and *Listeria monocytogenes*.

### Why Fermentation Controls *Staphylococcus aureus*
*S. aureus* is a major concern in fermented sausages because it can produce heat-stable enterotoxins (which cause food poisoning even if the bacteria are later killed). It tolerates relatively high salt and can grow at a_w as low as ~0.86 (aerobic) or 0.90 (anaerobic). However, it is a poor competitor against LAB, especially under anaerobic conditions, low pH, and moderate temperatures.

- **Key control via fermentation**: A rapid drop to pH ≤5.3 strongly inhibits *S. aureus* multiplication and toxin production. Regulatory guidelines (e.g., USDA/FSIS) use "degree-hours" to limit time at temperatures >15.6°C (60°F) before reaching pH 5.3, ensuring no more than ~2-log growth of *S. aureus*. Without quick acidification, the pathogen could grow exponentially in the warm, nutrient-rich meat batter before drying reduces a_w enough to stop it.
- Once pH falls below ~5.1–5.3 and a_w drops (typically to ≤0.90–0.95 during drying), *S. aureus* is effectively controlled. Starter cultures enhance this by outcompeting the pathogen and producing additional inhibitory compounds (e.g., bacteriocins in some cases).

Without fermentation (or if acidification is too slow), *S. aureus* from raw meat or handling could multiply significantly in the initial hours/days when the batter is still at higher pH (~5.8–6.5) and a_w (~0.96+).

### Why Fermentation Controls *Listeria monocytogenes*
*L. monocytogenes* is more cold-tolerant and can survive or slowly grow in many refrigerated RTE meats. It is less salt-tolerant than *S. aureus* but can persist in fermented products if hurdles are insufficient. Fermentation helps by:
- Rapid pH drop (LAB acidification) that stresses the pathogen.
- Competitive exclusion by LAB (which dominate and produce acids/bacteriocins).
- Synergy with drying (a_w reduction to ≤0.90–0.92), salt, and nitrite, which together limit growth or cause gradual inactivation.

In properly fermented and dried salami, *L. monocytogenes* typically shows little to no growth and often declines by 1–2+ logs (or more with extended ripening). It rarely causes outbreaks in traditional dry sausages due to these combined hurdles, though prevalence in raw materials means control is essential. Slow or incomplete fermentation/drying can allow limited survival or growth early on, especially if a_w stays above ~0.92 for too long.

### Salt Tolerance of These Pathogens
Salt tolerance is usually discussed in terms of **water-phase salt** (brine concentration: % salt / (% salt + % water) × 100) or its effect on a_w.

- **Staphylococcus aureus**:
- Highly salt-tolerant. It can grow in up to ~10–20% NaCl (or ~15% in some reports) and at a_w down to 0.83–0.86. It is not strongly inhibited by nitrite either.
- In sausages, typical salt levels (2–3%+ in the mix, leading to higher brine % as drying occurs) slow but do not fully stop it alone—hence the need for pH drop.

- **Listeria monocytogenes**:
- Moderately salt-tolerant. It can grow at up to ~10% NaCl (or ~10–12% in some conditions) and a_w as low as ~0.90–0.92, but growth slows significantly at higher salt/brine levels. It tolerates refrigeration and survives drying better than it grows.
- In fermented sausages, salt (often 2.4–3%+) contributes to the hurdle effect but is rarely sufficient by itself; it works best with low pH and low a_w.

Both pathogens are more inhibited by the **combination** of factors (pH + a_w + salt + competition) than by salt alone. Dry sausages typically achieve final a_w ≤0.85–0.90 and pH 4.6–5.3, which places them below the growth limits for both.

### How Cold Smoking Affects Them
**Cold smoking** (typically <30–40°C / <86–104°F, often 20–25°C for hours/days) is a traditional step in some Northern-style or European fermented sausages. It adds flavor (phenolic compounds) and has mild antimicrobial effects but is **not a lethal heat treatment** (unlike hot smoking).

- **On *S. aureus***: Limited direct killing effect. Cold smoke may slightly inhibit surface growth due to phenols and reduced oxygen, but the main control still comes from pH and a_w. It does not reliably destroy the bacteria or their pre-formed toxins. Proper fermentation beforehand is critical, as cold smoking temperatures overlap with ranges where *S. aureus* could grow if pH hasn't dropped yet.

- **On *L. monocytogenes***: Mild inhibitory or listeriostatic effect from smoke compounds (phenols), but it does **not kill** the pathogen reliably. Studies on cold-smoked products (e.g., fish or sausages) show *L. monocytogenes* often survives the process and can persist or slowly grow during refrigerated storage if other hurdles (low a_w, low pH) are not strong enough. In fermented sausages, cold smoking adds an extra hurdle that may contribute to gradual reduction when combined with drying, but it is not sufficient alone. Post-process contamination is a bigger risk in cold-smoked items.

In summary, fermentation (via rapid LAB-driven pH drop) is essential to outcompete and inhibit these pathogens early in the process, before drying fully lowers a_w. Salt provides a supporting hurdle but is not the primary control—*S. aureus* is far more salt-tolerant. Cold smoking enhances preservation mildly but relies on the other steps for safety. Always follow validated processes (e.g., degree-hour limits for pH drop, target final pH ≤5.3 and a_w ≤0.90) and use starter cultures for consistent results. Home or small-scale production requires strict hygiene and monitoring to minimize risks.
 
Well, you are taking chances making a dry sausage without fermentation; and you are not following USDA guidelines for a dried sausage. It works-until it doesn't. You are using cure #1, so Botulism is in check, but if the drying goes longer than 30 days, you should use cure #2. I also highly suggest you use minimum of 2.75% salt for a strong safety hurdle. Worst offenders for a high pH in a salami from my knowledge are Staphylococcus Aureus, and Listeria monocytogenes:

As I said, I understand and respect the Science.... My German heritage has been making this sausage for a very, very long time and we are going to stick with our success.

We never cure for more than 21 days... so #1 is what we use.
 
Also, when you start changing the meat to fat ratios, you affect the salt-in-solution concentration in the meat batter. Meat (~75% water) has a higher water content than fat (~15% water) It is safe to increase the fat, because this will concentrate the salt in less water in the meat batter. For a dried sausage, you want minimum of 5% brine solution in the meat batter. For a very lean mix, 15% fat or less, you actually need 3 to 3.25% salt to achieve a 5% brine solution. I suggest using salt amounts by weight, not by the cup. Way more accurate.
 
So I see you are adding cayenne pepper. Depending on how much you add, Cayenne pepper does contain about 3g fermentable sugars per 10g. pepper powder and this can contribute to fermentation. You would need to add 7-10g. cayenne pepper powder per 1 kilogram meat paste to achieve a pH drop low enough for safety.
 
So I see you are adding cayenne pepper. Depending on how much you add, Cayenne pepper does contain about 3g fermentable sugars per 10g. pepper powder and this can contribute to fermentation. You would need to add 7-10g. cayenne pepper powder per 1 kilogram meat paste to achieve a pH drop low enough for safety.

Maybe that helps my mix.... But we ate the first link tonight and it was perfect.
 
My Grandmother use to slice this cold smoked and cured sausage super thin.... and place it on a slice of white bread with Mayo... and some Water Cress and it was a sandwich out of this world!!! I usually ate three of them.
 
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