Tough casings

[diggingdogfarm]

I made some more sausage last night...I took the fat that I had previously ground and stored in bags.......

I think that's the problem, smearing has carried over to the new batch.

Next time, cube un-ground fat and grind it with the lean meat.


~Martin

 

[checkerfred]

Thanks for replying Martin.  I have some unground fat in the fridge...I'll try that and see what happens....the landjager seems to be holding up fairly well...I had some fat loss but it doesn't look like a lot so far....I'll know when they are done...right now they're at 120 IT so I still have 5 or 6 hours left I imagine.

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Im kinda stumped here, yeah really

Tell me more (best you can) on grinding, fat cut in, mix used, smoking.

 

[checkerfred]

Rick, I am too! lol....I can't figure it out.

Ok so I already had my deer ground up and stored....the fat from the supermarket is pork butt scraps.  When I got it, I partially froze it, then ground just the fat and placed it in those ground meat storage bags.  When I dethawed it partially, it wouldn't break up like the ground meat.  SO, now what I do is take the partially frozen ground deer, cut it into chunks...then I take the almost completely frozen fat and cut it into chunks and grind them together in a coarse grind.  Then I lightly mix.  At this point the meat is still very very cold.  My spices are already mixed with water, so I pour them over the mixture and mix it in well.  Meat is still very cold, though not frozen, and I put into my vertical stuffer and stuff.  Any extra that won't fit in the stuffer (larger batches) goes in the freezer to keep cold.

I'm using 70% deer to 30% complete fat (no pork in with it).  Maybe this is the problem?

next if I use bactoferm (I have LHP), I ferment at the recommended 8-12 hrs at 95 degrees in the oven with just the light on. 

when done fermenting, I usually have to wipe the casings dry if natural casings were used because I have some slight fat leakage, then I place them into a 125 deg. smoker for 1 - 1 1/2 hrs bumping up to 130 during the middle, then I bump up to 140 and add smoke for a few hours, bumping up to 145 then 150 in between, then smoke for a few more, bumping to 155 then 160, last night at this point my temp was around 115 I think, then I bumped to 170 and held....it got to around 135 or so....at this point, I had the sausages in there for about 11 hours, I tested my smoker and it was 5-7 degrees off on the temp. display so I bumped it up to 175 and then 180 over an hour. The temp started to climb again.  I might have went too high on this last part but it seemed like it was taking way too long for the 25-27mm sheep casings....suprisingly, I didn't loose much fat...most rendered earlier.

I'm going to do some more summer sausage today and will get a pic of everything during the process for you...also gonna try using some unground pork fat that I have

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Rick, I am too! lol....I can't figure it out.

Ok so I already had my deer ground up and stored....the fat from the supermarket is pork butt scraps.  When I got it, I partially froze it, then ground just the fat and placed it in those ground meat storage bags.  When I dethawed it partially, it wouldn't break up like the ground meat.  SO, now what I do is take the partially frozen ground deer, cut it into chunks...then I take the almost completely frozen fat and cut it into chunks and grind them together in a coarse grind.  Then I lightly mix.  At this point the meat is still very very cold.  My spices are already mixed with water, so I pour them over the mixture and mix it in well.  Meat is still very cold, though not frozen, and I put into my vertical stuffer and stuff.  Any extra that won't fit in the stuffer (larger batches) goes in the freezer to keep cold.

I'm using 70% deer to 30% complete fat (no pork in with it).  Maybe this is the problem?

next if I use bactoferm (I have LHP), I ferment at the recommended 8-12 hrs at 95 degrees in the oven with just the light on. 

when done fermenting, I usually have to wipe the casings dry if natural casings were used because I have some slight fat leakage, then I place them into a 125 deg. smoker for 1 - 1 1/2 hrs bumping up to 130 during the middle, then I bump up to 140 and add smoke for a few hours, bumping up to 145 then 150 in between, then smoke for a few more, bumping to 155 then 160, last night at this point my temp was around 115 I think, then I bumped to 170 and held....it got to around 135 or so....at this point, I had the sausages in there for about 11 hours, I tested my smoker and it was 5-7 degrees off on the temp. display so I bumped it up to 175 and then 180 over an hour. The temp started to climb again.  I might have went too high on this last part but it seemed like it was taking way too long for the 25-27mm sheep casings....suprisingly, I didn't loose much fat...most rendered earlier.

I'm going to do some more summer sausage today and will get a pic of everything during the process for you...also gonna try using some unground pork fat that I have

Here is some info on LHP.

For extra fast acidification. If a pronounced sourly flavor is desired, you selected this culture wisely. Bactoferm LHP culture causes the meat's pH to drop to under 5.3 in 30 hours or under 5.0 in 2 days.
Great for thin products like pepperoni or sausages ≤1” in dia.. Extra-Fast culture targeted for fermentation temperatures 90°F-105°F. P. acidilactici has optimal growth at 104°F and P. pentosaceus at 95°F, they will grow just fine under this temperature. They metabolize most common sugars and create lactic acid (use Dextrose, not Sugar). Typically this culture is for products that take around 2 weeks or less to fully complete (includes drying).

After seasonings and spices have been effectively mixed into minced meat the culture is introduced and also thoroughly mixed. For every 10 lbs. of meat: dilute ½ tsp. of culture in ½ cup distilled water (or chlorine free tap water). Let sit for 15-20 minutes for bacteria to “wake-up” then pour over mixed meat and re-mix thoroughly. Make sure meat stays cold through mixing process. Use InstaCure[emoji]8482[/emoji]#1 with this culture.

 

[boykjo]

How long has this venison been frozen. You could be using venison that has lost its moisture during the freezing window and is now dehydrated.......... Just a thought.

Joe
 

 

[checkerfred]

Hey Rick, I see SausageMaker.com and AlliedKenko.com have the same info but Butcher Packer says to ferment at 95 degrees for 8-12 hours

Immediately prior to use, open pouch and disperse contents in amount of distilled water equal to 0.5% of the batch weight. After all other ingredients have been blended into the meat mix, add diluted culture with mixing. GOOD DISTRIBUTION IS ESSENTIAL. Do not allow the culture to directly contact the other ingredients prior to mixing with meat. Optimum growth @95°F internal meat temperature and a relative humidity of 95%. This should be done in a smokehouse and controlled at this temperature until the culture has dropped the pH of the meat below 4.90pH. Fermentation usually takes a minimum of 8-12 hours depending on temperature and humidity.

The drying process is very critical. Under optimal conditions the drying room should be set at 60-70°F with a relative humidity of 75-82%.

That's from their website and also on the sheet that came with it.  I've tested the ph at 12 hours at 95 degrees and it's definitely under 4.9...I once let some summer sausage go for 18 or 20 hours (can't remember for sure) and the ph went down to around 3.8 or 4.0....Also, I always use at least 1/4 of a teaspoon if making small quantities

wonder why the difference in instructions?  I know the PH drops to < 4.9 in under 2 days....like I said it only takes 12 hours for me.

Boykjo, that's something I didn't think about....but I used deer from the season before last, and then deer from this season and noticed no difference

 

[checkerfred]

Ok, here is my processing from earlier today for some summer sausage

Took the fat straight out of the freezer:

Cut what I needed up in chunks, then put the rest back in the freezer.  Chunks went into freezer as well while I prepared the ground deer:

Notice the seasonal holiday plate...I guess I was feeling festive!

Cut the ground deer up into chunks. then it went into the freezer while I cleaned up a little...this deer is from 2 seasons back so it has a little dark area but it smelled good and the other I used like this didn't effect the taste:

Ground the deer and fat together, put back into freezer while I cleaned the grinder up:

I had areas where the fat/meat wasn't balanced as good so I mixed it a little bit before it went back into the freezer.  After I cleaned up the grinder, I added my spices to the meat and mixed.  Back into the freezer until I set up my stuffer.  Then back out of the freezer, I mixed in my bactoferm, loaded the stuffer and stuffed.

I have to say, mixing the meat like this as opposed to letting it thaw, the fat didn't smear.  We'll see how it cooks I guess:

 

[checkerfred]

To add to the other comment above about the bactoferm, I was using 1% dextrose for fermenting....I wanted a little less acidity so I used 0.7% dextrose....the instructions recommend anywhere from 0.5% to 1% dextrose......since then, my acidity is around 4.4

 

[BGKYSmoker]

I dont know why different sites say diff stuff when its the same product.

Did you let the venison bleed out?

What are you using to mix the meat? When you say the fat didnt smear is good, Last time sounds like the meat got over worked for the fat to smear.

Adding any extra water is not going to hurt the meat or displace any flavor.

 

[checkerfred]

Rick, the venison didn't bleed out....it was partially frozen so still had all it's juices intact.  I have had some where I let thaw out and it did bleed out into the pan.  Which way is better?  I'd assume not bleeding out since it would retain all the juices and moisture. 
 

I always add my spices to water and blend them up before mixing.  I then just use my hands to mix....I never make more than 5 lbs at a time so I've never needed a mixer.  How much do you mix yours up?  Do you just lightly toss/fold the meat together or really work it in?  Seems like I have to mix it for a minute or two to get the water/spices worked in good....then I mix in the bactoferm after that.

so is the smearing what causes the fat to render into liquid at low temps?

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Rick, the venison didn't bleed out....it was partially frozen so still had all it's juices intact.  I have had some where I let thaw out and it did bleed out into the pan.  Which way is better?  I'd assume not bleeding out since it would retain all the juices and moisture. 
 

I always add my spices to water and blend them up before mixing.  I then just use my hands to mix....I never make more than 5 lbs at a time so I've never needed a mixer.  How much do you mix yours up?  Do you just lightly toss/fold the meat together or really work it in?  Seems like I have to mix it for a minute or two to get the water/spices worked in good....then I mix in the bactoferm after that.

so is the smearing what causes the fat to render into liquid at low temps?

I bleed my venison out some in a double stacked plastic colander.

Yes mixing the dry with the water is the way to go, this way you dont have clumps. I use a KA with the hook when i just do 5 lbs. When i have larger i use the meat mixer, with both i only mix for 2-3 mins.

Yes the meat smearing is from over worked and that breaks the fat down faster when its starting to heat up.

Hang in there, You will get it.

 

[checkerfred]

Thanks Rick, I'll have to try bleeding it out next time to see what happens.  What's the KA?  Is that a kitchen aid mixed with meat mixing attachment? 

I'll definitely keep trying!  I mixed up some of your pepperoni sticks last night and added some pepper jack cheese to it....the test patty tasted awesome!  can't wait until they're done

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Thanks Rick, I'll have to try bleeding it out next time to see what happens.  What's the KA?  Is that a kitchen aid mixed with meat mixing attachment? 

I'll definitely keep trying!  I mixed up some of your pepperoni sticks last night and added some pepper jack cheese to it....the test patty tasted awesome!  can't wait until they're done

Yes Kitchen Aid with the dough hook. The paddle just makes the meat ball up in the middle.

 

[txbigred]

If you have pools of fat, then your smoker temps are too high. Try to keep it under 165F. With a small smoker like the MES, it is hard to get uniform temps in the smoker, the right side will be much hotter, and closer to the element will be much hotter also.

 

[checkerfred]

I never get it higher than 170....if i drop to 160, will it not take forever to get to temp? This last summer sausage i did mixed good but the fat still rendered out....it started at 140....it took about 12 or 14 hours to get to 152...i did some snack sticks with beef and didn't have much problem.

 

[BGKYSmoker]

I will be doing some soon. Will try to get pix step by step on how i do them.