Nitrate free bacon...

[smokensweet]

ok,
I saw a feature on bacon, i think on cnn, i feel like it was in the midwest kansas or something like that. Anyway, they cure thousands of pounds a month using only salt and sugar, no curing salt. 10 days stacked high in a cooler, rinsed and hung at room temp for another ten days, then cold smoked for yet another ten days, internal temp never above 105 if i remember.
I was surprized having been curing and cold smoking bacon for a decade or so now. Every site i search does nothing similar. Food safety concerns me on this process, no curing salt at all and hung for ten days at room temp. I kinda want to try this but im a little worried as i live in the philippines where its not just warm but also humid.
Has anyone else seen this feature or have any thoughts on it? I pointed out kansas because wherever it was it wasnt a cool everyday climate.

 

[nanuk]

if it isn't cured, it isn't bacon.... or at least I don't think so.

Salt Pork, sure... but bacon?

 

[smokerjim]

did they say anything about using celery salt

 

[SlickRockStones]

Lucky’s Market is a newer chain coming into our area that is said to cure,smoke and slice nitrate and nitrite free bacon in store. Should be opening soon in Pt. Charlotte so we shall see.

 

[smokerjim]

as far as I know nitrate and nitrite free bacon just means that they weren't added, but using certain plants make it naturally. like celery salt, celery juice. I could be wrong about this will be interesting to see

 

[dr k]

Oof! That's why we evolved to nitrite. No nitrate allowed in store bought bacon anymore. Salting and sugaring was/is a good preserving technique that is time consuming because you rinse and reapply. Salt's hygroscopic effect of dtawing up liquid reduces water activity, keeping bacteria's inability to grow and sugar makes food less salty and feeds lactobacillus a probiotic to take over and drop the PH to make the outside more acidic, inhibiting microbe growth. This appears to be a technique that curing eliminates. Um, don't do it. Nitrite inhibits pork fat from turning rancid because it's less satured than beef's chunky, cakey dryer texture and pork's wet slimy fat texture will turn rancid very quickly which is 50% on why we cure pork. Then curing pork inhibiits botulism a common foodbourne pathogen to pork because botulism metabolizes from the iron in myoglobin and that's why cured food is pink because myglobin's iron hasn't oxidized. Don't do it untill you learn the technique. Then don't do it.

 

[smokensweet]

did they say anything about using celery salt

No celery salt. Just sea salt and sugar. I was shocked because everything i have read says the same, and yes oldtimers saying its not bacon. But this wasnt some hobbyist operation, 1000’s of lbs a week and sitting at room temp for 10 days with another ten days in cold smoking. Obviously it works but im just kinda affected i guess.

 

[smokensweet]

Oof! That's why we evolved to nitrite. No nitrate allowed in store bought bacon anymore. Salting and sugaring was/is a good preserving technique that is time consuming because you rinse and reapply. Salt's hygroscopic effect of dtawing up liquid reduces water activity, keeping bacteria's inability to grow and sugar makes food less salty and feeds lactobacillus a probiotic to take over and drop the PH to make the outside more acidic, inhibiting microbe growth. This appears to be a technique that curing eliminates. Um, don't do it. Nitrite inhibits pork fat from turning rancid because it's less satured than beef's chunky, cakey dryer texture and pork's wet slimy fat texture will turn rancid very quickly which is 50% on why we cure pork. Then curing pork inhibiits botulism a common foodbourne pathogen to pork because botulism metabolizes from the iron in myoglobin and that's why cured food is pink because myglobin's iron hasn't oxidized. Don't do it untill you learn the technique. Then don't do it.

Thats why im posting i guess, im not new to curing and have cured thousands of pounds of it over the years. I know the effects of curing salt and not using it as well as substitutes. But this feature showed them and they detailed how long it sat with the salt and sugar rub as well as hanging at room temp and cold smoking. I guess thats how it was done before curing salts existed and if they could make safe bacon before refrigeration existed we should be able to now.
Im hoping someone else saw the feature as well and remembers the name of the company so i can directly reach out to them. My biggest concern is yes, botulism and parasites. Cold smoking and no curing salt i dont see how they address those, but it was a large scale commercial operation... so im sure its been inspected and approved as safe.

 

[Fueling Around]

Up until the smoking part it reads as you're describing the old school Italian prosciutto.

Italian charcuterie is a craft left to the masters.
Don't go there.

 

[daveomak]

If you use liquid smoke for flavoring... It could be a worth while process... The nitrite prevents botulism which can grow in a low oxygen environment like a smoke house... Just refrigeration will dehydrate the meat helping to prevent growth of all kinds of nasties.. Unfortunately, the process is probably approved by the USDA which...... YOU WILL NEVER duplicate....
Making bacon is soooo easy and fulfills a desire to produce quality, real world, old world bacon...
If meat is smoked, it has nitrate/nitrite in it....
Personally, I will NEVER alter my method to eliminate nitrite... It's healthy and makes some awesome eats...
Stick with your celery.... make 2nd rate bacon if that's your goal.....

 

[gmc2003]

CNN = Fake News. Sorry I just had to say that.

I have seen uncured bacon sold in our local grocer before. I've never tried it or been curious enough to read the label, but I would imagine like most of the smoked cheese in the deli dept. it has liquid smoke in it.

Chris

 

[smokin peachey]

I have made lots of uncured bacon. I use celery juice powder, apple butter or maple sugar and salt. My wife has food allergies and can’t have sugar and is scared to try cure #1.

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/aip-paleo-curing-bacon-and-ham.280484/

Definitely not liquid smoke.

 

[HalfSmoked]

Finding this very interesting. It seems to me more investigation is needed into their process. Smokin Peachey as said has done bacon with other items and it works fine for him.

Warren

 

[smokerjim]

I read a pack of uncured bacon at work today, forgot to take picture I will take one tomorrow, this was a pack of promise land uncured bacon it says no nitrites/nitrates added just contains nitrites/nitrates that naturally occur from celery powder and sea salt, I will post a pic sat. the company your talking about may use a different way but I just wanted to point out that a lot of companies are claiming to have uncured bacon, hotdogs, and this must be legal, but really there just curing it naturally.

 

[PolishDeli]

Isn’t all USA cured bacon nitrate free by decree of the USDA?
It is cured with nitrites exclusively.

The “uncured/nitrate free/nitrite free” stuff that is made with celery juice powder does contain nitrates and/or nitrites; but which one(s)? NaNO2? NaNO3? KNO2? KNO3? Something else? All of them? How much of each? So, calling it uncured is misleading at best. "Cure level unknown" would be the better label.

Cure #1 contains exactly 6.25% NaNO2 by weight. NaNO2 is naturally occurring by the way, too. Therefore, using CJP doesn’t make it any more or less natural.

 

[dr k]

Isn’t all USA cured bacon nitrate free by decree of the USDA?
It is cured with nitrites exclusively.

The “uncured/nitrate free/nitrite free” stuff that is made with celery juice powder does contain nitrates and/or nitrites; but which one(s)? NaNO2? NaNO3? KNO2? KNO3? Something else? All of them? How much of each? So, calling it uncured is misleading at best. "Cure level unknown" would be the better label.

Cure #1 contains exactly 6.25% NaNO2 by weight. NaNO2 is naturally occurring by the way, too. Therefore, using CJP doesn’t make it any more or less natural.

I wish there was a legitimate paper differentiating the difference in nitrate in vegetables and their concetrations compared to nitrite cured animal protein. I only hear about cured meat and the biased negative dialogue.

 

[smokensweet]

Ok i hope this link works. This was the feature. To whoever said cnn=fake news, stop it, grow up already. To those who say they are using celery salt or something else please watch for yourself. They specifically say they arent.
And finally to those saying leave it to the masters, i may be just a journeyman but if inever advance from where i am now how will i ever become one. Encourage, dont discourage. Been smoking meats and curing for a dozen years, hundreds of kilos a month. Im not some kid playing around.

 

[smokerjim]

Ok i hope this link works. This was the feature. To whoever said cnn=fake news, stop it, grow up already. To those who say they are using celery salt or something else please watch for yourself. They specifically say they arent.
And finally to those saying leave it to the masters, i may be just a journeyman but if inever advance from where i am now how will i ever become one. Encourage, dont discourage. Been smoking meats and curing for a dozen years, hundreds of kilos a month. Im not some kid playing around.

link isn't working

 

[smokerjim]

neve

link isn't working

never mind it popped up thanks

 

[gmc2003]

To whoever said cnn=fake news

It's called a sense of humor.

Chris