Masterbuilt not standing by warranty?

[ItsMeAgain]

After thinking about that 2 pans being together, that could be what killed your element.
Those pans stopped the heat from rising past them, and the sensor is on the back wall, above those pans. So the Heating element kept putting out more heat, and the temp never got hot enough at the sensor to stop the element. So it just kept getting hotter & hotter & hotter.
Might be Lucky it didn't start on fire.
Note: The Safety Switch is also above those pans, so it couldn't do an Emergency Shut-Down!

Bear

I can follow the logic Bear and maybe I did step in it by doing that but it still seemed to get plenty hot- I am certain that ariflow wasn't blocked off. The pans in the pic were not the ones I had been using. Mistake noted though, thanks

 

[ItsMeAgain]

If anyone else has issues with Masterbuilt it is easy to find on Facebook via a computer. Over the weekend I looked on FB with my cell and there was a ton of Masterbuilt "groups" but the "Mother ship" did not show up. Going to https://www.facebook.com/masterbuilt will get you to their home page on FB and I attempted to use Messenger to get a note to them.

The replay was
"Hello! Thank you for sending us a message. Please click on one of the options below so we can better assist you.
*Please note, due to COVID-19 delivery times may be longer than usual and our selection of items available may be temporarily reduced. Our teams are working diligently to ensure your order is filled and shipped in a timely fashion. Customer Support response times may also be delayed up to 72-96 business hours. We appreciate your support."

Figured I'd quote them my case number and maybe able to get some assistance.

 

[Boslaw]

I agree with the above. My manual only says guaranteed to within 15 degrees. Regardless, I paid for 275, and I'm going to complain until they try to get it right.

 

[Boslaw]

I received a response through Facebook -- "Keep in mind, we do not recommend replying to your case email unless you are responding to a representative, as it will move you to the back of our queue"-- That's really odd behavior but good to know. Just by emailing them to ask for status, you get kicked to the back of the line. There's no other way to contact them for status without responding to your case email, so you have no choice but to wait in silence and hope they're reading, or harrass them through facebook.

 

[tallbm]

I got my MES40 unit in 2019 just before Christmas. The first one had some pretty good damage on a corner as FedEx brought it from SamsClub.com.

The replacement unit was rec'd after not much of a hassle. I started using the new one around Christmas and it worked well but the first element burned open by May. This unit is on my screen porch up near the house and is not exposed to weather/moisture. I found the listing for parts on the Masterbuilt website and the price of two replacement elements plus shipping was around $30. This seemed fair as at least one seller on Amazon was at $30 for one element shipped. It took over a week to show up in PA from GA (covid delays?). Replacing the element was fairly easy and I did a few more cooks with it and it worked for a couple weeks.

I had promised to bring lunch to some friends and had my chicken trimmed and brined. I lit my smoke tube and saw the element glowing as it heated up. I came back to check the progress and it had only reached 120 with the set temp at 225. Since I had just swapped the element I checked that first but the element still measured 12.2 ohms and the connections were good. I hooked my volt meter leads direct to the wires that feed the element and when you set up a cook and the unit showed it was heating, it only puts out 1.65vac and I'd expect 120vac on the element. I was able to cook the meat in the oven so it didn't go to waste but my Masterbuilt has failed me twice in 7 months. I believe I read another thread here on SMF where negative opinions were shared on the quality of MES units sourced through Sam's Club.

I filled out a service request on their website as the phone number has a recording saying that the online/email support is the only option during covid. So far at 7 business days as of Friday I have an email that they rec'd my request for help but nothing further.

I'd really like to get my MES back in running shape and didn't expect that the quality would be lacking so much. I understand the option to convert to a PID should yield a much more consistent experience but for the short time I've owned this unit I feel like Masterbuilt should be supplying the parts and support necessary to repair or replace this unit.

Other friends bought their own Masterbuilt propane smoker after having dinner I provided for them a couple times. It's easy to get addicted to smoking meat like other smoking I guess. Not sure if Masterbuilt watches these forums or not but I'll jump over on Twitter or Facebook next and see if I can get some help from Masterbuilt via those channels.

I had held off doing any further disassembly/troubleshooting so as not to void my warranty...

Hi there and welcome!
I can't help you with MB customer service but I can help you troubleshoot and see if there is an issue somewhere else in the unit.

Pull that other panel off the back and I'm pretty sure that may be your safety rollout limit switch. Check the connectors there and check if the switch shows any signs of damage.
The connectors and that switch can fail and often do. This may explain the lack of voltage making it to the heating element if the wiring at that point or the switch are failing.

If the switch is melting down u can simply splice the 2 wire ends together and the smoker will run without the switch and u can buy a replacement but keep smoking until then. If the connectors are screwed u can repalce them with hi temp ones if you have them.

Let us know what you find there.

 

[daspyknows]

Do a search on LinkedIn and find the name of the CEO, VP of customer service and VP of Marketing. Send them direct emails. When dealing with frustrating customer service I have had success. I did that with Buffalo Technology after a network storage server died 2 weeks after warranty and was told by the the tech support person that I should expect things to break after warranty. They replaced the unit. Ultimately all 4 of their storage servers died but at least I got service.

 

[ItsMeAgain]

Hi there and welcome!
I can't help you with MB customer service but I can help you troubleshoot and see if there is an issue somewhere else in the unit.

Pull that other panel off the back and I'm pretty sure that may be your safety rollout limit switch. Check the connectors there and check if the switch shows any signs of damage.
The connectors and that switch can fail and often do. This may explain the lack of voltage making it to the heating element if the wiring at that point or the switch are failing.

If the switch is melting down u can simply splice the 2 wire ends together and the smoker will run without the switch and u can buy a replacement but keep smoking until then. If the connectors are screwed u can repalce them with hi temp ones if you have them.

Let us know what you find there.

Thanks for the input tallbm, I had pulled the cover and checked the other part. I figured that was likely the thermistor/thermostat but it looked clean and the connections are good.

with the unit plugged in and turned off it was showing 2.75vac

powered unit in but didn’t call for heat and voltage went up to 2.8vac (negligible difference).

Told it to heat and I show 116vac across the terminals but as I saw previously I had less than 2v to the element

 

[ItsMeAgain]

Keep in mind, we do not recommend replying to your case email unless you are responding to a representative, as it will move you to the back of our queue"--

I think it’s unfortunate that a reply to your case on Masterbuilt pushes you back in the queue- not certain the benefits of assigning a case number only to push it out anytime the client (us) adds more info.

Thanks for sharing this info Boslaw, I did not have any emails stating this nor did the the quick reply I got thru FB messenger tell this. To be clear my reply was in 10 minutes after I told them my case number but only to say “we’ll try to get you some help from support”

 

[tallbm]

Thanks for the input tallbm, I had pulled the cover and checked the other part. I figured that was likely the thermistor/thermostat but it looked clean and the connections are good.

with the unit plugged in and turned off it was showing 2.75vac

View attachment 455015

powered unit in but didn’t call for heat and voltage went up to 2.8vac (negligible difference).

Told it to heat and I show 116vac across the terminals but as I saw previously I had less than 2v to the element

View attachment 455016

Ok this is interesting.

You are reading 116 VAC at that point which means you are getting current.
But you say that you get the equivalent of a no current reading when u try the same thing at the element when it is turned on?

The MES is pretty simple.
Plug wires go into the circuit board at the bottom.
Wires come from the circuit board to the heating element (hot wire goes to safety switch then to heating element).
The controller reads temp inside the smoker and flips the relay switch on at the circuit board to allow electricity to flow from the plug to the heating element and to cut off electricity when set temp is hit.

So if you are reading current at the safety switch that means the controller and the circuit board are working and letting electricity flow through towards the element to that point.

It would be a good idea to do a similar check on the other wire that goes to the heating element. Or do continuity checks checks on the wires coming from the circuit board through to the heating element. Just make sure you have the connectors unplugged from the heating element when u are doing continuity checks or else you cant ever tell which wire u are testing from the circuit board to the heating element with the heating element connecting the wires together from that end :)

It has happened were people have found frayed or burnt up wiring in their MES which have caused problems.

Let us know what you find :)

 

[ItsMeAgain]

Ok this is interesting.

You are reading 116 VAC at that point which means you are getting current.
But you say that you get the equivalent of a no current reading when u try the same thing at the element when it is turned on?

The MES is pretty simple.
Plug wires go into the circuit board at the bottom.
Wires come from the circuit board to the heating element (hot wire goes to safety switch then to heating element).
The controller reads temp inside the smoker and flips the relay switch on at the circuit board to allow electricity to flow from the plug to the heating element and to cut off electricity when set temp is hit.

So if you are reading current at the safety switch that means the controller and the circuit board are working and letting electricity flow through towards the element to that point.

It would be a good idea to do a similar check on the other wire that goes to the heating element. Or do continuity checks checks on the wires coming from the circuit board through to the heating element. Just make sure you have the connectors unplugged from the heating element when u are doing continuity checks or else you cant ever tell which wire u are testing from the circuit board to the heating element with the heating element connecting the wires together from that end :)

It has happened were people have found frayed or burnt up wiring in their MES which have caused problems.

Let us know what you find :)

So the access to said circuit board is on the underside/bottom of the unit?
Thanks again
I'll report back in the morning

 

[ItsMeAgain]

So the access to said circuit board is on the underside/bottom of the unit?
Thanks again
I'll report back in the morning

I got a look this morning and I see nothing melted/damaged/broken etc. Wiring looks good. Solder joints look pretty good too.

In the mean time MB replied this morning with “Thank you for contacting customer service. I have placed Sales Order xxxxxx for heating element and high temperature limiter. The order will ship within 3-5 business days. Please let me know if I can be of any further assistance.“.

So I’ll wait longer and see what happens with the new parts. I opened the case on 7/9 and got the first meaningful response 7/22.

Will resurrect the old Brinkman charcoal smoker in the mean time because I know it will work

cheers

 

[dr k]

I got a look this morning and I see nothing melted/damaged/broken etc. Wiring looks good. Solder joints look pretty good too.

View attachment 455137

View attachment 455138

View attachment 455139
In the mean time MB replied this morning with “Thank you for contacting customer service. I have placed Sales Order xxxxxx for heating element and high temperature limiter. The order will ship within 3-5 business days. Please let me know if I can be of any further assistance.“.

So I’ll wait longer and see what happens with the new parts. I opened the case on 7/9 and got the first meaningful response 7/22.

Will resurrect the old Brinkman charcoal smoker in the mean time because I know it will work

cheers

Nice that you took pics in case you go to PID in the future. Cut and terminate together the red and black wires by your thumb that go to the black cube relay. The other red wire next to the white at your pinky are cut and terminated together and done. The red/white are terminated at the circuit board so they are good left alone but I wanted to get away from those alum female quick disconnect lugs and wire nut vs potential alum oxide corroding them and messing with it later. Plug into a plug and play Auber. When you look at the heating element lugs they both may not be red because they sometimes chage wire colors from the roll out switch to the element. I checked continuity between the two power cord spades and open circuit to each spade from the power cord ground pin and continuity from ground power cord pin to the chassis/body of the smoker.

 

[tallbm]

I got a look this morning and I see nothing melted/damaged/broken etc. Wiring looks good. Solder joints look pretty good too.

View attachment 455137

View attachment 455138

View attachment 455139
In the mean time MB replied this morning with “Thank you for contacting customer service. I have placed Sales Order xxxxxx for heating element and high temperature limiter. The order will ship within 3-5 business days. Please let me know if I can be of any further assistance.“.

So I’ll wait longer and see what happens with the new parts. I opened the case on 7/9 and got the first meaningful response 7/22.

Will resurrect the old Brinkman charcoal smoker in the mean time because I know it will work

cheers

So for clarity sake. Have you confirmed u get 116vac to each wire going to the heating element?
so far u get it going to the wire that goes to the safety switch which leads me to believe it makes it to the element on that wire.

If you have/can confirm that at least u get power to the wire end going to the heating element then we can basically lean toward something wrong with the element.

A continuity check would be a safer way to go about it but u need to be sure and unhook the wires from the element or else everything will ring true on the continuity... in normal cases ahhaha

 

[ItsMeAgain]

So for clarity sake. Have you confirmed u get 116vac to each wire going to the heating element?
so far u get it going to the wire that goes to the safety switch which leads me to believe it makes it to the element on that wire.

If you have/can confirm that at least u get power to the wire end going to the heating element then we can basically lean toward something wrong with the element.

A continuity check would be a safer way to go about it but u need to be sure and unhook the wires from the element or else everything will ring true on the continuity... in normal cases ahhaha

Hi Tallbm

I got the 116vac across the terminals of the "temperature limiter" but not through it. The element still measured 12.2 ohms so its not open and that number seems to be right to me. My guess was that the temp limiter was not passing the current on to the element but I don't have a schematic. Just planned to swap the part when it arrives and should know immediately if that was a good fix or not.

I did look at some of the talk on here about a PID. It seems the Auber is the favorite but it looked to be about $160 vs I saw an inkbird PID for $40... I have not had a lot of time to get my options straight but I feel certain it has been discussed at length on SMF so i just need to do my research.

Sorry I didn't do more research before buying the smoker I bought. Sounded like the specific model I came up with was a bit of a loser :0)

I'll see what the various opinions point to for another purchase. I guess if you have two smokers (or three...) you'll have better options.

 

[JC in GB]

Hi Tallbm

I got the 116vac across the terminals of the "temperature limiter" but not through it. The element still measured 12.2 ohms so its not open and that number seems to be right to me. My guess was that the temp limiter was not passing the current on to the element but I don't have a schematic. Just planned to swap the part when it arrives and should know immediately if that was a good fix or not.

I did look at some of the talk on here about a PID. It seems the Auber is the favorite but it looked to be about $160 vs I saw an inkbird PID for $40... I have not had a lot of time to get my options straight but I feel certain it has been discussed at length on SMF so i just need to do my research.

Sorry I didn't do more research before buying the smoker I bought. Sounded like the specific model I came up with was a bit of a loser :0)

I'll see what the various opinions point to for another purchase. I guess if you have two smokers (or three...) you'll have better options.

I will be offering a PID controller system to resurrect a single burner style master built smoker for under $100 in the next few weeks. Perhaps you may be interested in that for controlling the temp in your pit?



JC

 

[reddigreen]

I will be offering a PID controller system to resurrect a single burner style master built smoker for under $100 in the next few weeks. Perhaps you may be interested in that for controlling the temp in your pit?



JC

I might be. Please keep me/us in the loop.

 

[hooked on smoke]

That's a bummer.
I would think that if you have records of reporting the issue prior to the 8 mo. period you mentioned they should still validate the warranty. If they didn't cooperate within the 8 mo. That on them.
You started a claim within the warranty period. They need to honor it. Keep at em.
Good luck

 

[Jonok]

Wow, I’m really surprised you’ve had so many problems My experience has been the opposite.. I have burned up 4 sams club 40 inchers, and paid for one (as well as the $30 extended warranty each time). Three of them were supported very well as I did my best to use them to death, with a ridiculous amount of free spare parts provided until either there was a death knell like blowing the GFCI consistently, or running out the warranty period at which point the extended warranty kicked in. In every case, I ultimately got a check for a new smoker after I used the damned thing way more than a “consumer“ could be expected to use it in the same time period.
They’ve got to make a profit as well, and for an average guy that does a smoke or two a month, the thing is almost certainly going to outlast the three year warranty if one keeps it out of the weather. (At which point if it breaks, it’s still gonna be the best 40” electric smoker for less than $1000 with a few aftermarket mods). For $3-500, that’s not really an unreasonable life expectation.

 

[tallbm]

Hi Tallbm

I got the 116vac across the terminals of the "temperature limiter" but not through it. The element still measured 12.2 ohms so its not open and that number seems to be right to me. My guess was that the temp limiter was not passing the current on to the element but I don't have a schematic. Just planned to swap the part when it arrives and should know immediately if that was a good fix or not.

I did look at some of the talk on here about a PID. It seems the Auber is the favorite but it looked to be about $160 vs I saw an inkbird PID for $40... I have not had a lot of time to get my options straight but I feel certain it has been discussed at length on SMF so i just need to do my research.

Sorry I didn't do more research before buying the smoker I bought. Sounded like the specific model I came up with was a bit of a loser :0)

I'll see what the various opinions point to for another purchase. I guess if you have two smokers (or three...) you'll have better options.

Pardon my confusion a bit so please bear with me lol.
The following image shows 116vac into (electricity in from bottom) and out (electricity out form top) pf the switch according to how the probes are positioned (switch is normally closed allowing flow through):


The switch seems fine so maybe there is a break in the wire coming from the top of the switch and going to the heating element because the switch is normally closed so if it was failing in open positioned you shouldnt have gotten 116vac when u measured the bottom (elecricity in) and the top (electricity out) tabs.

Unless I am completely brain farting on something, which happens, what I am seeing is the switch is fine according to the image.
Unplugging the connectors from the switch and unplugging from the heating element you should be able to do a continuity check from the top wire (should be that one) at the switch to one of the unhooked wire ends at the heating element.
If u get no continuity confirmation that something is happening with the wire between the switch and the element. Peoples wires have had problems in the body before so its not unheard of just not so common.

Let me know if I'm missing something here and please dont take any of this as I'm questioning your ability or knowledge lol. I'm just looking for troubleshooting info and its hard to know the situation across the internet and across written text :)

 

[ItsMeAgain]

Pardon my confusion a bit so please bear with me lol.
The following image shows 116vac into (electricity in from bottom) and out (electricity out form top) pf the switch according to how the probes are positioned (switch is normally closed allowing flow through):
View attachment 455463

The switch seems fine so maybe there is a break in the wire coming from the top of the switch and going to the heating element because the switch is normally closed so if it was failing in open positioned you shouldnt have gotten 116vac when u measured the bottom (elecricity in) and the top (electricity out) tabs.

Unless I am completely brain farting on something, which happens, what I am seeing is the switch is fine according to the image.
Unplugging the connectors from the switch and unplugging from the heating element you should be able to do a continuity check from the top wire (should be that one) at the switch to one of the unhooked wire ends at the heating element.
If u get no continuity confirmation that something is happening with the wire between the switch and the element. Peoples wires have had problems in the body before so its not unheard of just not so common.

Let me know if I'm missing something here and please dont take any of this as I'm questioning your ability or knowledge lol. I'm just looking for troubleshooting info and its hard to know the situation across the internet and across written text :)

Ok sorry tallbmfor the delay,It seems that there are more tasks to accomplish than hours in the day. I appreciate your help any willingness to follow up.

I know in my previous pic I showed 116 vac across the terminals of the switch but much like any light switch in your house (Even ones that are off) you can measure voltage because it is available at the switch but it doesn’t get sent to the light until the switch is closed. It seems to me that this limiter switch may be normally closed but opens up in order to stop the flow of current if the limit is reached? Or when it fails?

My switch measures open both ways (Regardless of the polarity of my meter leads) so again I feel that the potential was AT the switch but not being sent on to the element.

In the hope of answering your question as well as putting out some information that hopefully others may find useful at some point I tagged my terminals with simple one through four numbers and set about checking for continuity.

Before any continuity checks took place yes I did disconnect the wiring from the terminals of the limiter switch and also from the element. Rather than post all of the pictures and hog bandwidth I will say that terminal two shows perfect continuity with terminal three so the wire from the switch is still intact to the element. I did not go as far as to disassemble the cover from the bottom of the unit to reveal the circuit board again but my gut feeling is that a wire from that relay is probably feeding the other side of the element and with the limit switch open no current may flow. This is only a guess.

I did disassemble the limiter switch from the unit in preparation for receiving the new one although I still have not seen anything to lead me to believe that the parts have actually shipped from MB yet as they told me 3 to 5 days until shipment takes place earlier when they did answer me. Having somewhat of a electronics background I thought I might be a wise guy and look at the part number on said limiter switch to see if they are something you can buy off-the-shelf for ~$.79 apiece from our favorite parts supplier like mouser.com but it appears (and I say appears) that the part number was scratched off to the point of not being readable.

So I’ll report back when the new limit switch is received and my hope is that it will allow my smoker to contribute more than just providing a puzzle for me to solve.