Kosmos Phosphates

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jcam222

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Jun 13, 2017
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I bought a bag of the Moisture Magic. I did not have good luck and wondered if anybody ne else could point out what I might have been doing wrong. 1) Despite multiple attempts I could not get it to disolve. Whether mixing in a bowl or in a shaker cup it pretty much just caked up into gravel. I followed 1/8 cup per cup of liquid. 2) To me the minor amount that did disolve gave the broth an intensely bitter taste. I used up about half a $24 bag and ended up using none in my cook. Anyone tell me what I might have done wrong?
 
I use phosphates but not that brand. That is alot in one cup of liquid. My stuff that I use says to use .5% to meat weight in the water
 
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I’m going to give them a call Friday. Bag says 1/8 cup to 1 cup. I thought that was an awful lot too.
 
I use phosphates but not that brand. That is alot in one cup of liquid. My stuff that I use says to use .5% to meat weight in the water

I’m going to give them a call Friday. Bag says 1/8 cup to 1 cup. I thought that was an awful lot too.

I thought the same thing as Farmer . I think we use the same product . .5% of meat weight is the max amount . I use it at a lesser rate , about .3% . Also I do the liquid by meat weight , so it's more than a cup . So less phosphate more liquid for what I do .

I went to the product page , and it does say 1/8 cup to 1 cup liquid . It also says it's sodium tripolyphosphate which is the same that I use .
 
I thought the same thing as Farmer . I think we use the same product . .5% of meat weight is the max amount . I use it at a lesser rate , about .3% . Also I do the liquid by meat weight , so it's more than a cup . So less phosphate more liquid for what I do .

I went to the product page , and it does say 1/8 cup to 1 cup liquid . It also says it's sodium tripolyphosphate which is the same that I use .


Yeah, we use the same product Chop.We thinking the same , I think
 
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I'll add a 3rd opinion that 1/8th cup sound like a huge amount.

I use Butcher & Packer #414 "special binder" and AmesPhos and neither of them are anywhere near that high a ratio. What quantity of meat was that 1/8th cup in a cup of water supposed to mix with? B&P 414 is 2 ounces (by weight) to 25 pounds of ground meat. That works out to just 11.34 grams in 5 pounds of meat. AmesPhos is 0.3 to 0.5% of the total weight of meat, so for 5 pounds that would be 6.8 to 11.34 grams for the same 5 pounds of meat (5 pounds of meat is 2268 grams x 0.003 for 0.3% etc...).

Oh wait, I think I see what's going on. I looked at the Moisture Magic product site and they have a couple of instructions. The 1/8th cup to 1 cup of water is for INJECTION. For mixing with meat (as in sausage, sticks, etc....) it is listed as 1 ounce to 12.5 pounds which is the same as the B&P 414 at 2 ounces to 25 pounds of ground meat. So 2.27 grams per pound or 11.34 grams for 5 pounds of GROUND MEAT would be spot on.

How are you using the phosphate in your recipe? Injection, brine, or mix with ground meat as it makes a difference.

One other comment, the B&P 414 is also a little difficult to dissolve in water IMO. You need to crush any lumps to dust before adding to water. I've had the best results in ground meat by crushing up the B&P as much as a can with the back of a spoon and then adding it to my overall measured spices and mixing it in. Then add all the spices to the wet (water, beer, etc...) to make a slurry to add to my ground meat. No problems with clumpy messes that way for me.

That 1/8th cup for a cup of water in an injection still sounds off to me. They list 1 cup to a 1/2 gallon of water for a brine. 1/2 gallon is 7.9 cups so the ratio they list for a brine is 1:7.9 and the ratio of 1/8th cup to a cup is 1:8 which is virtually the same. Devil is in the details as it "sounded" like a lot more when I first read it, but I guess it's the same as their brine amount.

I've not injected phosphates or used them in a brine. I just use them in ground meats and I swear by them and the results they give. You don't need NFDM or soy binder if you use phosphates. And phosphates are a natural compound so it's not franken-food.

Also you might want to look at B&P 414 as it is about 1/4 the price of the Moisture Magic price I saw on Amazon.
 
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My plan was to use in a broth/ butter and spice blend for imjection. I tried multiple times and ways to get 1/8 cup ti mic in a cup of liqud. Same result everytime, clumped up rocks. The little that did disolve madecthe broth extremely bitter.
 
Per the ingredients it's just STPP. Shame on them for not making it clear how much to use. I have had ALOT of success by weight with .5% in 10% liquid as an injection. I find the liquid must be warmed to assist dissolving. Quick nuke works great. Dissolve it FIRST before salt etc. Put in fridge to cool a few moments. I would not advise using it all unless going by weight. VERY small amounts here. Think gram scale to a tenth. IE 1lb is 454g so .5% is 454*.005=2.3g. It's like a 1/4tsp. Grab a small digital scale on ebay or amazon. I've used STPP on lots of stuff (even hamburger) and totally hooked on it.
 
Found a good price on a picnic shoulder today , so got it to cure a ham .
So using a 10% pump of the meat weight my liquid was just under 2 cups and the STPP was right at 2 TBLS . Which was a little more than 1/8 cup for the 2 cups liquid .

I'm using grams , but stating cups due to the " 1/8 cup to 1 cup water " directions .

I put it in a mason jar . Shaken not stirred ,,, in this order :
stpp mix
sugar mix
salt mix
cure mix .
 
Found a good price on a picnic shoulder today , so got it to cure a ham .
So using a 10% pump of the meat weight my liquid was just under 2 cups and the STPP was right at 2 TBLS . Which was a little more than 1/8 cup for the 2 cups liquid .

I'm using grams , but stating cups due to the " 1/8 cup to 1 cup water " directions .

I put it in a mason jar . Shaken not stirred ,,, in this order :
stpp mix
sugar mix
salt mix
cure mix .


At .5 %? STTP
 
Going by my scale should be close to that . Meat weight was 8 1/2 pounds . Was shooting for .4% using my notes from the last time I did a picnic .
 
If you are planning on injecting STPP, weigh out ~0.4% of the meat... (0.004 X #'s of meat in grams) and dilute in your liquid before anything else is added.. (plain water)... Following directions on the package may not be correct as those directions could, and possibly are, for commercial processors...
 
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There are many phosphates on the market... which ones are you speaking of....
These are for meat...
each has a different property...
Each does something different....
DO NOT randomly chose a phosphate for meat additions...

upload_2018-12-25_7-38-38.png
 
I bought a bag of the Moisture Magic. I did not have good luck and wondered if anybody ne else could point out what I might have been doing wrong. 1) Despite multiple attempts I could not get it to disolve. Whether mixing in a bowl or in a shaker cup it pretty much just caked up into gravel. I followed 1/8 cup per cup of liquid. 2) To me the minor amount that did disolve gave the broth an intensely bitter taste. I used up about half a $24 bag and ended up using none in my cook. Anyone tell me what I might have done wrong?

Follow the directions.... Simply mix ⅛ cup of the Moisture Magic Meat injection with 1 cup of distilled water ... It's needs to be added FIRST to your solution... Distilled water is best to insure NO CLUMPING..... The amounts they cite are for 0.5% of their mix to add....
 
I'll add a 3rd opinion that 1/8th cup sound like a huge amount.

I use Butcher & Packer #414 "special binder" and AmesPhos and neither of them are anywhere near that high a ratio. What quantity of meat was that 1/8th cup in a cup of water supposed to mix with? B&P 414 is 2 ounces (by weight) to 25 pounds of ground meat. That works out to just 11.34 grams in 5 pounds of meat. AmesPhos is 0.3 to 0.5% of the total weight of meat, so for 5 pounds that would be 6.8 to 11.34 grams for the same 5 pounds of meat (5 pounds of meat is 2268 grams x 0.003 for 0.3% etc...).

Oh wait, I think I see what's going on. I looked at the Moisture Magic product site and they have a couple of instructions. The 1/8th cup to 1 cup of water is for INJECTION. For mixing with meat (as in sausage, sticks, etc....) it is listed as 1 ounce to 12.5 pounds which is the same as the B&P 414 at 2 ounces to 25 pounds of ground meat. So 2.27 grams per pound or 11.34 grams for 5 pounds of GROUND MEAT would be spot on.

How are you using the phosphate in your recipe? Injection, brine, or mix with ground meat as it makes a difference.

One other comment, the B&P 414 is also a little difficult to dissolve in water IMO. You need to crush any lumps to dust before adding to water. I've had the best results in ground meat by crushing up the B&P as much as a can with the back of a spoon and then adding it to my overall measured spices and mixing it in. Then add all the spices to the wet (water, beer, etc...) to make a slurry to add to my ground meat. No problems with clumpy messes that way for me.

That 1/8th cup for a cup of water in an injection still sounds off to me. They list 1 cup to a 1/2 gallon of water for a brine. 1/2 gallon is 7.9 cups so the ratio they list for a brine is 1:7.9 and the ratio of 1/8th cup to a cup is 1:8 which is virtually the same. Devil is in the details as it "sounded" like a lot more when I first read it, but I guess it's the same as their brine amount.

I've not injected phosphates or used them in a brine. I just use them in ground meats and I swear by them and the results they give. You don't need NFDM or soy binder if you use phosphates. And phosphates are a natural compound so it's not franken-food.

Also you might want to look at B&P 414 as it is about 1/4 the price of the Moisture Magic price I saw on Amazon.

Hi I was on BP's website I couldn't find B&P 414??/
THanks Dan
 
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