How to get that TANG!

[BGKYSmoker]

You're close to getting folks all riled up with some of your this and that then saying too triggering for the group. There are some very good smoked and dry cured sausage/salami makers here. Your rocket science and somewhat negativity posts are keeping them away.

 

[TeeZee]

PC Farmer, this is an old post, I know, but I was wondering if you can recall where you read this.

Can you get cultured buttermilk? I read that works good.

 

[pc farmer]

PC Farmer, this is an old post, I know, but I was wondering if you can recall where you read this.

A good friend told me about it.

 

[TeeZee]

A good friend told me about it.

Thanks. Was hoping you had read this somewhere and could direct me. ;-)

 

[pc farmer]

Thanks. Was hoping you had read this somewhere and could direct me. ;-)

Sorry. Let me look

 

[crazzycajun]

As Ron white would say the drink or the astronaut jk

 

[BGKYSmoker]

Thanks. Was hoping you had read this somewhere and could direct me. ;-)

Go to the market in the baking section and look for Saco buttermilk powder.

Buttermilk powder and fermento will not produce the affect of bactoferm cultures.

 

[TeeZee]

Go to the market in the baking section and look for Saco buttermilk powder.

Buttermilk powder and fermento will not produce the affect of bactoferm cultures.

Thanks for your kind input, I'm familiar with this product. I'm experimenting with a Bulgarian buttermilk culture (used 1/2 cup of it instead of Fermento and chicken broth in a chicken sausage from the Taste of Artisan site).

But as you say, bactoferm cultures are one thing and powdered buttermilk is another. Wondering though if actual cultured buttermilk--composed of living bacteria, yeasts, enzymes, etc.--might be yet another entity altogether, perhaps with the ability to ferment meat. I don't think this is too far-fetched an idea--it's my understanding that in Italy, for example, unpasteurized wine is used in sausagemaking to the same effect.

The fact that these substances are alive gives me hope (and that, as you know, springs eternal. ;-)

My problem is I'm no scientist.

 

[zwiller]

Buttermilk powder and fermento will not produce the affect of bactoferm cultures.

+1. IMO bactoferm culture a must to get the results you expect. I personally would not bother with any of the hacks. FRM52 gave me totally pro just like Hickory Farm SS tang.

 

[zwiller]

But as you say, bactoferm cultures are one thing and powdered buttermilk is another. Wondering though if actual cultured buttermilk--composed of living bacteria, yeasts, enzymes, etc.--might be yet another entity altogether, perhaps with the ability to ferment meat. I don't think this is too far-fetched an idea--

Not far fetched at all. It works, I've done it BUT does not work as good a sausage culture. I also used live yogurt and probiotic pills. Same deal.

 

[TeeZee]

Not far fetched at all. It works, I've done it BUT does not work as good a sausage culture. I also used live yogurt and probiotic pills. Same deal.

No, it won't work the same or even as well. There are specialized meat cultures for the same reason as there are specialized dairy cultures--organisms that feast on one particular thing and starve on another. (Now it sounds like I'm torturing my buttermilk. ;-) Thanks.

 

[TeeZee]

Go to the market in the baking section and look for Saco buttermilk powder.

Buttermilk powder and fermento will not produce the affect of bactoferm cultures.

Ah, the pH's the thing!

Raw milk comes out of the cow already cultured--let it set on a kitchen counter and it will sour and thicken on its own, and unlike store-bought milk that merely rots at room temperature the taste becomes pleasantly tangy. (This is 'clabber' and our grandparents drank it on the farm.) There's a high proportion of liquid and it's easy for the culture to denature the proteins (coagulate) and get the pH down quickly.

Meat is a different story.

 

[indaswamp]

Also different sugars. Few meat cultures can utilize lactose.

 

[DougE]

There are some work arounds like ECA and buttermilk powder to get a "tang", but none really replace fermentation using a culture made for the purpose of sausage making.

I use ECA or buttermilk powder in some of my recipes, so I'm not dissing these additives.

 

[TeeZee]

There are some work arounds like ECA and buttermilk powder to get a "tang", but none really replace fermentation using a culture made for the purpose of sausage making.

I use ECA or buttermilk powder in some of my recipes, so I'm not dissing these additives.

Not sure where to drop this link, but a post on TANG! seems the most likely place.

On the use of vinegar and wine (really, anything acidic) in sausage: https://en.wedlinydomowe.pl/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7337&p=29195&hilit=*Linguica#p29195

Naturally buttermilk and sauerkraut are highly acidic.

The more I read, the further away the goal line appears; at this point it's positively receding. ;-)