Heating Element replacement--but which one??

[denny]

I have an MES 30 and want to replace the element. But first, I am doing extensive mods (seems like I want all of them!), including PID control (already programmed and tested on a breadboard), complete re-wiring, etc.

I have read many posts regarding element replacing. I really liked the one about flipping over the element to be more centrally located, but still I find that higher wattage, e.g. 1500, would be of real value with heat recovery. In none of those posts have I come across one that lists a specific model! No doubt this is the result of poor search technique on my part but it leaves my question unanswered. Can anyone out there tell me of their experience? If I have to drill more holes, ok--but I think the element must have male spade terminals and of course not be too expensive; under about $40. My smoker will operate at 110vac. I'm not an electrician but those for 220v could work but the wattage would be reduced by 50%--correct?

A hot plate is an option but I'd rather not go that way. Also I could use 2 lesser wattage units, say 700 to 800 w. each, wired in parallel, and stay within safety and heat requirements. Yeah, a bit Rube Goldberg-ien but I think feasible!

Please share your past efforts. Any comments, suggestions and criticisms are welcomed. Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[GaryHibbert]

I'm interested in the answer too.
Gary

 

[DIYerDave]

Just Google "universal 1500 watt smoker element". Most are in your price range.

 

[dr k]

The Mes 30 800 watt element is much more centered being a smaller smoker so I don't think flipping the element is necessary like for the Mes 40. I have the gen 1 40 so the flat element mounting plate i used a dremel cut off wheel to cut that bracket in half so it's symmetrical and I could flip it and use the same smoker access holes for the element legs and just screw the other half back on to seal the top and hold the silicone gasket. I had to use a longer ground bolt with an additional nut inside the access to secure the element since the two bolts only secures the top half of the mounting bracket. First carefully bend the male element spades 180 ° to attach the flipped element to the lugs. May have to zoom in to see the moded element bracket.

 

[dr k]

As far as a bigger element, hopefully it won't destroy the foam insulation, being closer in proximity to the walls. With a PID controller and the flipped element in the Gen 1 40 I can butt a 15×11 disposable alum baking sheet against the back wall since the PID sensor is up by the food so your not blocking heat to it like you would with the Mes sensor on the back wall. Move the baking sheet left/right a rung or two to even heat and no drips on the element or down back wall to short the non heating legs of the element going into the wall. Now it doesn't matter what side the top vent is on. I sandwiched two baking sheets for an air insulation barrier ( cut the bead off of one sheet leaving the flashing it was attached to so it sits on the top beaded one) to keep the top third drip sheet from vaporizing so much grease.

 

[Bearcarver]

View attachment 402451 The Mes 30 800 watt element is much more centered being a smaller smoker so I don't think flipping the element is necessary like for the Mes 40. I have the gen 1 40 so the flat element mounting plate i used a dremel cut off wheel to cut that bracket in half so it's symmetrical and I could flip it and use the same smoker access holes for the element legs and just screw the other half back on to seal the top and hold the silicone gasket. I had to use a longer ground bolt with an additional nut inside the access to secure the element since the two bolts only secures the top half of the mounting bracket. First carefully bend the male element spades 180 ° to attach the flipped element to the lugs. May have to zoom in to see the moded element bracket.

I agree with the above.

Bear

 

[denny]

Just Google "universal 1500 watt smoker element". Most are in your price range.

I did but no eureka shouts. Problem is so many come with a corded heat control or are immersion heaters which self-destruct in an air environment. The corded ones are problematic simply because I don't know how I would attach my AC wires to the element ends (almost certainly do not have male spade terminals). Maybe some 1/4" SS cable clamps might work....?? Thank you for your response.

 

[denny]

View attachment 402451 The Mes 30 800 watt element is much more centered being a smaller smoker so I don't think flipping the element is necessary like for the Mes 40. I have the gen 1 40 so the flat element mounting plate i used a dremel cut off wheel to cut that bracket in half so it's symmetrical and I could flip it and use the same smoker access holes for the element legs and just screw the other half back on to seal the top and hold the silicone gasket. I had to use a longer ground bolt with an additional nut inside the access to secure the element since the two bolts only secures the top half of the mounting bracket. First carefully bend the male element spades 180 ° to attach the flipped element to the lugs. May have to zoom in to see the moded element bracket.

Thank you dr k! I read your post about flipping the element but somehow the fact that I have the MES 30, which is more centered, did not nudge my conscious! Regardless, your post is a standout in practicality and clearness, even though it removes part of the support for my idea to upgrade.

 

[fivetricks]

I did but no eureka shouts. Problem is so many come with a corded heat control or are immersion heaters which self-destruct in an air environment. The corded ones are problematic simply because I don't know how I would attach my AC wires to the element ends (almost certainly do not have male spade terminals). Maybe some 1/4" SS cable clamps might work....?? Thank you for your response.

I also was curious about making the conversion from the rheostat controlled universal to the digitally controlled stock unit or more likely pid controller

 

[denny]

View attachment 402451 The Mes 30 800 watt element is much more centered being a smaller smoker so I don't think flipping the element is necessary like for the Mes 40. I have the gen 1 40 so the flat element mounting plate i used a dremel cut off wheel to cut that bracket in half so it's symmetrical and I could flip it and use the same smoker access holes for the element legs and just screw the other half back on to seal the top and hold the silicone gasket. I had to use a longer ground bolt with an additional nut inside the access to secure the element since the two bolts only secures the top half of the mounting bracket. First carefully bend the male element spades 180 ° to attach the flipped element to the lugs. May have to zoom in to see the moded element bracket.

Thank you dr k! I read your post about flipping the element but somehow the fact that I have the MES 30, which is more centered, did not nudge my conscious! Regardless, your post is a standout in practicality and clearness, even though it removes part of the support for my idea to upgrade.

I was curious about making the conversion from the rheostat controlled universal to the digitally controlled stock unit or more likely pid controller

fivetricks--Yes, I really wrestle with that point. It will be PID controlled. Hate to invest ca $50 in a part only to tear it open and find there is no practical way to make it work, if I should get the rheostat element. Thank you for your interest--do you have any ideas to make it work?

 

[fivetricks]

No, I'm watching your project for a future possible project of my own! I googled "Universal 1500w smoker element" as suggested above and was finding all rheostat controlled elements. So it made me curious as to how that conversion would take place.

 

[denny]

As far as a bigger element, hopefully it won't destroy the foam insulation, being closer in proximity to the walls. With a PID controller and the flipped element in the Gen 1 40 I can butt a 15×11 disposable alum baking sheet against the back wall since the PID sensor is up by the food so your not blocking heat to it like you would with the Mes sensor on the back wall. Move the baking sheet left/right a rung or two to even heat and no drips on the element or down back wall to short the non heating legs of the element going into the wall. Now it doesn't matter what side the top vent is on. I sandwiched two baking sheets for an air insulation barrier ( cut the bead off of one sheet leaving the flashing it was attached to so it sits on the top beaded one) to keep the top third drip sheet from vaporizing so much grease.
View attachment 402453

Yes, that is a factor I must either face or back away from. The existing element is 1200 w so it's a fair question to ask 'is 300 w more worth all this effort'? I had thought of using 2 800w elements but it is apparently a little tricky to find them, altho I'm sure the're out there. I'm very stubborn and don't give up easily and sometimes come out a little like Don Quixote tilting at a windmill! I am afflicted by a curse to always try to 'make something a little better'--often with mixed results. Still, that's the way I am. We'll see how it develops!

dr k, your insulation barrier is ingenious! I'll put it to use and thank you very much!

 

[Bearcarver]

Thank you dr k! I read your post about flipping the element but somehow the fact that I have the MES 30, which is more centered, did not nudge my conscious! Regardless, your post is a standout in practicality and clearness, even though it removes part of the support for my idea to upgrade.

Kurt means that since the MES 40 is so much wider, the Heating element is a lot farther from the center than it is in the MES 30.
Therefore the heating element in the MES 30 isn't as far from the center of the 30 as it is in the 40.

I saw the same thing with my heat deflector being needed a lot more in my MES 40 than it was needed in my MES 30, to get the heat to go up the middle, instead of up the Right side.

Bear

 

[wild west]

I have an insulated food warming cabinet that i use a 2 burner 1500 watt hot plate as the heat source. I've stripped the controls and any non metel parts from the hot plate and used high temp wire to get outside the cabinet and then wired it to a short extention cord. I plug that into my auberins ws-1510 elpm. Has worked flawlessly since i built it early this year. Im know very little on the matter but i think any rheostat controlled element should be able to be controlled by a pid.

 

[cmayna]

Since my MES40 Gen 1 is dedicated to fish (low temps), I felt no need to consider finding a higher watt element. Did flip the element and hard wired the element directly to an AC cord, which now plugs into the Auber PID. This bypasses all of the smoker's original circuitry. Run's like a dream.

 

[JckDanls 07]

here's one I found and it's square...looks like it was made for the MES... thinking it will bolt right in... 18 1/4"W x 16" deep... make sure you pick the 120V before ordering...

https://pro-smoker.com/products/heat-element?variant=21942474691

you know what... that might be for the 40 ...

 

[denny]

As far as a bigger element, hopefully it won't destroy the foam insulation, being closer in proximity to the walls. With a PID controller and the flipped element in the Gen 1 40 I can butt a 15×11 disposable alum baking sheet against the back wall since the PID sensor is up by the food so your not blocking heat to it like you would with the Mes sensor on the back wall. Move the baking sheet left/right a rung or two to even heat and no drips on the element or down back wall to short the non heating legs of the element going into the wall. Now it doesn't matter what side the top vent is on. I sandwiched two baking sheets for an air insulation barrier ( cut the bead off of one sheet leaving the flashing it was attached to so it sits on the top beaded one) to keep the top third drip sheet from vaporizing so much grease.
View attachment 402453

Yes, that is a factor I must either face or back away from. The existing element is 1200 w so it's a fair question to ask 'is 300 w more worth all this effort'? I had thought of using 2 800w elements but it is apparently a little tricky to find them, altho I'm sure the're out there. I'm very stubborn and don't give up easily and sometimes come out a little like Don Quixote tilting at a windmill! I am afflicted by a curse to always try to 'make something a little better'--often with mixed results. Still, that's the way I am. We'll see how it develops!

dr k, your insulation barrier is ingenious! I'll put it to use and thank you very much!

Kurt means that since the MES 40 is so much wider, the Heating element is a lot farther from the center than it is in the MES 30.
Therefore the heating element in the MES 30 isn't as far from the center of the 30 as it is in the 40.

I saw the same thing with my heat deflector being needed a lot more in my MES 40 than it was needed in my MES 30, to get the heat to go up the middle, instead of up the Right side.

Bear

Thanks again Bear! I understand what you and Kurt are saying, even though my reply may not so indicate. Sorry for any confusion. BTW, I really like your step by step offerings!

 

[denny]

I have an insulated food warming cabinet that i use a 2 burner 1500 watt hot plate as the heat source. I've stripped the controls and any non metel parts from the hot plate and used high temp wire to get outside the cabinet and then wired it to a short extention cord. I plug that into my auberins ws-1510 elpm. Has worked flawlessly since i built it early this year. Im know very little on the matter but i think any rheostat controlled element should be able to be controlled by a pid.

Wow! I never even thought of that! I suppose the hot plate heater must be set at it's max temp in order to not interfere with the PID actions--correct? Thank you for pointing out this new (to me) approach! Would involve revising my wiring approach but that's ok!

EDIT: On re-read, I just noticed you said you "stripped the controls...." so if that means eliminating the control housing, how did you connect AC to the element i.e., what was the physical shape of the element ends where you made the connection? That has been my main argument against using rheostat type elements.

 

[denny]

here's one I found and it's square...looks like it was made for the MES... thinking it will bolt right in... 18 1/4"W x 16" deep... make sure you pick the 120V before ordering...

https://pro-smoker.com/products/heat-element?variant=21942474691

you know what... that might be for the 40 ...

Yeah, it's quite a bit too big for the 30, which is only about 12 x 18.5. Other than that, it is everything I'm looking for, especially the male tabs on the wire ends. I appreciate your taking the time to show me.

 

[denny]

Since my MES40 Gen 1 is dedicated to fish (low temps), I felt no need to consider finding a higher watt element. Did flip the element and hard wired the element directly to an AC cord, which now plugs into the Auber PID. This bypasses all of the smoker's original circuitry. Run's like a dream.

Thanks cmayna! That's exactly what I want to do, but no, I have to think about complicating it by using a bigger heater!!