First Canadian Bacon - A Newbie w/Kakorrhaphiophobia

[deanoaz]

Well, I went in to my first bacon (well Canadian, not belly) with the fear of failure (Kakorrhaphiophobia).  I guess I had good reason.  Put my cure on for 11 days, massaging all the time.  Took it out this morning, let it rest for awhile and hit the smoker.  But, before hitting the smoker, I cut off some from the end (after soaking in ice water for 30 minutes).  Three of us tried it to rave reviews....not too salty.

I put it on for a couple of hours with just the AMNPS.  I let it run out, then put charcoal in to start raising it to my target of 160 degrees, spraying with apple juice periodically.  First Hurdle:  I didn't get enough charcoal in and the smoker started dropping in temperature after a short time.  Finally got that cured.  Second Hurdle: I couldn't get the IT off 62 degrees.  Finally found out, through the use of a separate digital thermo that my remote thermometer had failed.  By the time I got that in it was up to 138 degrees.  Not too bad, but one of those OH SH_T's.  Finally pulled it at 160 degrees, let it rest and cut off a piece. Third Hurdle:  Salty!

Tell this relative newbie, on his first CB smoke, what did I do wrong?

The loin after pulling from cure, washing off and soaking in ice water for 30 minutes.  Tested it in a frying pan and it was  wonderful. Maybe taking an end cut was the problem with testing for saltiness.

Canadian Ready for Smoker.JPG

• deanoaz
• Oct 25, 2012

This is the cured loin just put on the smoker.

Canadian on Smoker.JPG

• deanoaz
• Oct 25, 2012

This are some cuts I saved for the fridge.  The rest went into the freezer.

Final Canadian.JPG

• deanoaz
• Oct 25, 2012

 

[daveomak]

deano, evening.....  Well, the meat dried out maybe 5-10% so it got saltier....  or the tasting end was not as salty... either way, a good mix of country gravy, (don't add salt when you make it) and diced up CB is always good on toast, or mashed taters or an old shoe....  Dave

 

[deanoaz]

deano, evening.....  Well, the meat dried out maybe 5-10% so it got saltier....  or the tasting end was not as salty... either way, a good mix of country gravy, (don't add salt when you make it) and diced up CB is always good on toast, or mashed taters or an old shoe....  Dave

Yeah, wife and I discussed it and came up with the same conclusions.....drying out and the end cut were both factors.  I had some in a sandwich last night and it was great.  My taster says it is like a little saltier, store-bought ham that you get once in awhile.  Well, its not a throw-away, but just a little salty.  Next time its 2 hours, ice water soaking (maybe with cut up potatoes as some suggested here) and cut from the center.  Just a little disappointing on my first try.  Thanks, Dave.

 

[jrod62]

Looks good.
Soaking it longer should take care of the salty taste

 

[pit 4 brains]

Soaking longer and resting will do it.

When you cured it, it took a good while for all the salts( actually the dissolved ions) to reach the center of the meat. The amount of salts on the outside wanted to equalize with the relative lack of salts on the inside (rush hour traffic). After you pulled it and rinsed it, the meat had a higher concentration than the soak water, and began to give the ions back. This starts at the surface of the meat, and slowly moves inward, like stopped traffic at a green light. When you gave it just one soak and sliced off the end, it was low in salt while the center was still high. The cure to this is to do two or three soaks changing the water on each one to keep the difference or "gradient" high, thus motivating the salt to move out and equalize. Now you can do a test fry.

The next step is to let it rest in the fridge to allow the salt in  center of the meat to equalize with the salt at the surface area, kinda like scattering cars throughout a parking lot. Now the taste will be constant all the way through..

 

[deanoaz]

Soaking longer and resting will do it.

When you cured it, it took a good while for all the salts( actually the dissolved ions) to reach the center of the meat. The amount of salts on the outside wanted to equalize with the relative lack of salts on the inside (rush hour traffic). After you pulled it and rinsed it, the meat had a higher concentration than the soak water, and began to give the ions back. This starts at the surface of the meat, and slowly moves inward, like stopped traffic at a green light. When you gave it just one soak and sliced off the end, it was low in salt while the center was still high. The cure to this is to do two or three soaks changing the water on each one to keep the difference or "gradient" high, thus motivating the salt to move out and equalize. Now you can do a test fry.

The next step is to let it rest in the fridge to allow the salt in  center of the meat to equalize with the salt at the surface area, kinda like scattering cars throughout a parking lot. Now the taste will be constant all the way through..

That is a wonderful explanation and gives me direction for my next Canadian bacon smoke.  Thanks much for you explanation.

 

[diggingdogfarm]

Using an equilibrium brine will eliminate all the fuss.

Cook it only once, in other words, if you plan to use it for sandwiches, cook it (better yet steam it) then cool and slice.

If you plan to slice it thick and fry it....cold smoke it, then slice it raw for frying.

That, along with gentle cooking, will eliminate much of the problems of drying out.


~Martin

 

[pit 4 brains]

Using an equilibrium brine will eliminate all the fuss.
Cook it only once, in other words, if you plan to use it for sandwiches, cook it (better yet steam it) then cool and slice.
If you plan to slice it thick and fry it....cold smoke it, then slice it raw for frying.
That, along with gentle cooking, will eliminate much of the problems of drying out.
~Martin

True about the eq brine, but I wouldn't suggest it for a second time attempt.

What did you use for cure Deano? I assume it was a dry cure since you massaged it. Was it Tenderquick or a mix of #1 and other salts/sugars? 

For your next one I would suggest using Pops simple brine.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/110799/pops6927s-wet-curing-brine

Do a few with this brine, you'll not only be amazed about the simplicity, but you'll really like the outcome of the CB. You may want to inject some down the center of the loin. If you don't have an injector, get one. I use mine all the time for brining whole cuts. Injecting knocks down the brining time considerably when the muscle meat is thicker than 2".

Cook it only once, in other words, if you plan to use it for sandwiches, cook it (better yet steam it) then cool and slice.

If you plan to slice it thick and fry it....cold smoke it, then slice it raw for frying.

That, along with gentle cooking, will eliminate much of the problems of drying out.


~Martin

Martin is correct here. I would heed every bit of advice he gives you.. 

Do a little if not a lot of research on cures and the curing process so you can gain some understanding and insight of what it is you are doing to the meat. There's a lot of bookwork and a lot of lab time (your kitchen and smoker) to do before you get it right.

 

[deanoaz]

What did you use for cure Deano? I assume it was a dry cure since you massaged it. Was it Tenderquick or a mix of #1 and other salts/sugars? 

It was a dry cure.  I used the Hi Country BBB Cure and followed their directions.  I did a lot of researching through the forum and that's why I started with the Canadian bacon.....decided it might be the easiest to begin with.  After reading all the input, I think those things I need to change are the initial smoke time (it was probably too long) and the soak time/taste process (next time:  2 hours and take taste sample from the center).  The smoke time contributed to its being drier, and that contributed to its being saltier (see DaveOmak's input above).  Most of the family think it was okay; only dissenter was the wife, but she thinks everything is too salty,  Ha! Ha!

  I think it turned out to be fairly good for my first try.  Thanks all for the input.

 

 

[pit 4 brains]

And BTW, this is the Grilling pork forum. You'll get more results in the Smoking Bacon  forum next time.

-Pete

 

[deanoaz]

And BTW, this is the Grilling pork forum. You'll get more results in the Smoking Bacon  forum next time.

-Pete

Thanks for the observation.  I got plenty of good feedback, even though I was in the wrong forum.  I don't know if it would have made much difference to my future plans by adding more input.

 

[diesel]

 Next time its 2 hours, ice water soaking (maybe with cut up potatoes as some suggested here) and cut from the center.  Just a little disappointing on my first try. 

Good job on the bacon..  and the attitude is my favorite part.. I love that you are already thinking about how to improve you results..  This forum rocks!

Aaron.

 

[chef jimmyj]

I can only add, if you want to have ready to eat CB your cold smoking than cooking is fine...But...NEVER take any Pork Loin to an IT higher than 145*F. Higher temps are not needed and in the case of loin anything higher is just drying the meat...JJ

 

[deanoaz]

I try to do my research before stepping into a smoke session that I haven't done before, but sometimes it gets to become a mixture of feedback.  Below is a line from this forum's article on Canadian Bacon Basic Technique:

"If you do this it will preserve some moisture but you must cook before eating.   Alternately you can smoke to 160 degrees F internal temp and your CB will be ready to eat as is."  (this one referred to 145 degrees IT in the first part of the quote).

I was aiming to have it ready to eat from the fridge.  I don't believe the major cause for the dryness was from taking it to 160 degrees, but from having it in a cold smoke cycle for too long (using the AMNPS pellet smoke tube and nothing else).  In my UECB, using the AMNPS makes the temperature run 100-120 and I know that's high, but I can't tune the vent to get any lower.

Thanks for the feedback.
 

 

[daveomak]

Deano, evening.... We try to follow federal guidelines on all temp cooking....  It wasn't too long ago, they approved 145 as an IT... The thread you saw that noted 160, may have been before the adjustment...  Stuff happens..... sorry for the dry pork.....   Dave

 

[deanoaz]

Deano, evening.... We try to follow federal guidelines on all temp cooking....  It wasn't too long ago, they approved 145 as an IT... The thread you saw that noted 160, may have been before the adjustment...  Stuff happens..... sorry for the dry pork.....   Dave

Please don't apologize, Dave,   My problem was that I got a post that said I should have NEVER taken my Canadian bacon to 160 degrees, even though the the article said I needed 160 degrees to get a ready product, from the fridge for use for colds cuts or bacon.  What I disagree with such a strong disagreement with my taking it to 160 degrees, even though I had followed a forum article about a Canadian bacon post.  We relative newbies usually try to find guidelines that help us through our learning process.  We are expected to do our research about how to follow some basic guidelines on smoking (and we are constantly reminded to do that), but feedback on our approach does not seem to take those research results into consideration.  Shouldn't our moderators have to follow those same requirements?

I'm sorry, but what I received from a moderator did not take all things into consideration.  I apologize for being a little upset.

 

[chef jimmyj]

 There are a full range of techniques and more opinions on how things should be prepared than I can count. In any event out of respect we don't rewrite other peoples posts, we only make additions to out dated information as we find them. I can understand that you or any inexperienced member will read that article and follow it's directions to the letter. When it was written it was based on the standards the author knew to be true. However information and standards change and while at one time a minimum of 160*F IT was the standard for Pork this is no longer necessary. I will add the updated information to that article.  The one thing you can trust is.... No Moderator including myself will ever knowingly post incorrect information. Furthermore, I am sorry you took offense to my providing conflicting information with a strong word like NEVER. Based on my training, years of experience and the most up to date information I have, there is no reason to take Pork Loin over 145*F and has been this way for several years, at least since 1995 when I attended Culinary School...

Your theory that Cold Smoking at 100-120*F is responsible for the dry meat is somewhat improbable.. While that temp is effective for dehydrating very thin pieces of meat as in making Jerky, it takes many hours to do so. A few hours, as you stated, at that temp would have had zero effect on the moisture retention of a piece of Pork the thickness of a Loin. It is still most likely the reason your meat was dry was based on smoking to 160*F IT and the result of carryover cooking, the cooking that occurs as the higher heat of the exterior continues to conduct toward the interior raising the IT as much as 10*F, your final IT was probably closer to 170*F. With any low fat cut of meat, cuts of Beef from the Round and Flank, Lamb Loin and Pork Loin, cooking to 160*F will result in varying degrees of Dry meat. This is not only taught to Culinary students but has been proven by twenty five years of having to choke down my mothers pork roast. She was old school and learned to cook when virtually all Pigs were fed Garbage which lead to Trichinae infection. While Pigs raised by reputable commercial producer has lead to near zero cases of Trichinosis, it has now become common to see Trichinae infection in Bears from foraging in trash dumps. It is well documented that the Trichinae Larvae are killed in under 1 minute when exposed to a Temperature of 131*F, as long as that temperature is uniform throughout the entire piece of meat. So you can see there is not only no reason to cook Pork beyond 145*F since the meat will be very juicy at this IT,  but with carryover taking it closer to 150-155*F, 145*F exceeds the effective temperature to eliminate any issues with food borne illness from today's Pork...JJ

 

[diggingdogfarm]

Keep in mind too, that modern ultra-lean pork is of such horrendous quality that you have to be very careful with it.
The directions for preparing are completely different than that of heritage pork, heritage pork is much more forgiving.
Good heritage loins are well marbled.
Get some good heritage pork if you can.

http://www.thepiggery.net/archives/43


~Martin

 

[deanoaz]

From what I have found on this forum, the articles (not posts) appear to be documented guidelines about standard processes we newbies can follow with some confidence.  As quoted there, "The purpose of this thread is to provide those new to curing Canadian bacon with a basic procedure that they can follow with confidence and safety."  This was updated in 2010, much later than 1995.  I guess what you are telling me is that what I have found in the articles are not valid guidelines for the forum.  if you had documented as strong a position with the invalid information in that article as you did with my post, it might have been corrected.
 

 

[chef jimmyj]

I had no idea that Article even existed and I updated it accordingly after you brought it to my attention. Additionally that information was most likely to the best of the original posters knowledge...I have apologized for my strong yet vague wording both here and in the PM you sent. As well as giving the reasons why. I will not argue this further and suggest you drop the issue and move on...JJ