DIY solar and wind power

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Yes, storage is a concern,  but you can pick up used car batteries from most any salvage yard at a fraction of the cost.  It's not like you'll need "cranking power" or anything -- just something that will hold a charge.

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I think you need to read up a bit more on batteries.  the battery is the most important part of your whole system.  while you don't need cranking amps they do need to have capacity and they need to be able to hold that capacity.  a normal car battery is about the worst choice you can make as they realy have no capacity.  they have an ability to do a real high discharge for a short time, then they need to be charged up again.  also a normal starting battery is not ment to be discharged below 60% in normal situations and can only handle a relitivly short amount of discharges down to 30% befor the batery is useless.  and finaly a starting battery is not measured in AH for storage but rather reserves.  so a normal starting battery will be rated in reserve capacity and cca.  CCA means nothing and RC is how many min it will hold at a 25 amp draw befor it is at 10.5V.  problem is if you discharge a starting battery over 50% a few time it will lose 1/2 its storage capacity.  12.2V on a battery is about 50% so a rating that goes down to 10.5 V is useless to us. 

now a true deep cycle battery is maed with thicker/larger plates and is designed to discharge over a long time.  and don't confuse the marine deep cycle batterys as real ones.  they are kind of a compromise built better than a car battery but not as good as a true deep cycle.  True deep cycle batteries are designed to be able to discharge 80% of there capacity, where this would kill a regular battery with in a few times. 

so lets compare

most large car batteries when you work it out from the Reserve capacity have about a 65 AH rating (and thats a good one) where as the smaller Deep cycles have a minimum of 80ish.  so lets compare apples to apples, the 65AH of the starting is on a rating down to 10.5V so we have to shift this to get a rating that with in the working area of the battery as we don't want to destroy it the first time we use it so being optimistic and not wanting to do the math this early in the morning, I will give this a useable rating of 20AH (remember we don't want to discharge more than 40 to 50% of the totaly capicity.  now our Deep cyclem is 80 AH but is designed to be able to discharge 80% of that so we are looking a usable 64AH.

I have been playing with solar pannels and batteries for a while now in RV aplications and as power for boats.  the theories are all the same, so you want to get a good battery.  and not a cheep deep cycle either, well they will work good but the length of there life is shorter.  a normal T125 (trojan) deep cycle will last 5 to 10 years depending on how they are treated.  a rolls-surett (didn't spell it right) will easily last 20 years or longer and are the most common batteries for high end off the grid systems.

there are a few things you should look at for wind power also, the most important being what is the average wind speed where you are?  wind generators are kinda weird as lets say you buy a 400 watt one.  it will put out 400 watt at say 16MPH wind speed, and it will put out nothing if the wind speed is below 10mph.  now different ones are rated at different speeds but that is something you have to make sure it suited to your area, if your average wind speed is 12MPH it might not be worth the money you spent.

for solar hot water heating there are several systems that work well even in well below zero temps.  8000.00 is pretty pricey especialy for you guys down here.  I can put the top of the line system in for about 5000.00 up here and we are usaly about 20% more expensive than you guys.

Steve
 
Hope your dreams come through for ya Bret! 

I've got the acreage, garden, cattle, pigs, poultry, dogs, shrimp, etc..... The farm used to be wind powered until the electric company talked the owners at the time (1960's) to switch to their power.

I still have the battery house and would love to convert back.
 
Thanks, Steve!

Like I said, I've just begun research, and this kind of information about batteries is extremely useful.

Thank you, too, cowgirl!

You can rest assured knowing that I will realize these things.  I've got 3 different business plans on the back burner: one of which is sure-fire bread-and-butter, and the other two are basically hobbies that I can profit from.  So, money isn't going to be an issue.  I will actually do this no matter what.

I'll post some info on building wind turbines when I find it, because that's really our best bet for those of us in Oklahoma.
 
X2 on the fusion. It's the only thing that makes any real sense as a true long term solution. That is if you are at all acquainted with the laws of thermodynamics along with some fundamental knowledge of economics. 

It's also helpful to note that the only problem on the road to attain the reality of commercial fusion power are engineering in nature and not those of theoretical physics.

As a country we have taken on larger challenges with much less to go on from the start and attained both inside of a 10 year time frame. One was the fission bomb and the other was putting men on the moon. 

We can do it if we really want to and if all the special interests and Flem-flam artists would all STFU for a change and the even dumber or rather self interested politicians would quit listening to them and acting on what they say. It's all just so much wasted motion.    
 
Great link!  Thanks, cliff.

Yeah, I'd run it underground, for sure, and check local regulations before even planning a build.  Good advice.  I'd also find a good electrician to tell me what a transformer does.
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Actually, from what I've seen on Ed Begley's show, you generate DC power to an inverter that converts it to AC, then it goes into the grid, either powering your home or is purchased back by the power company and you don't need to store it. (or it's used by your home so you don't have to purchase electricity from the power company, effectively lowering your bill; when you combine electricity generated by both solar and wind power you can bring your bill down to zero; then anything additional is put into the grid and you get a check instead of writing one).  I'll investigate it further.  T Boone Pitkins has the right idea tho, we can produce our own and reduce our oil dependence!
 
 from what I've seen on Ed Begley's show, you generate DC power to an inverter that converts it to AC, then it goes into the grid, either powering your home or is purchased back by the power company and you don't need to store it. (or it's used by your home so you don't have to purchase electricity from the power company, effectively lowering your bill;
yup that is one way of doing it.  the other which can, if set up right, remove you from the grid and actualy make money selling excess power back to the utility.  by incorperating a storage bank you don't start using grid electricity the moment the sun isn't powerfull enough to make the pannels work. 

so in a set up with no storage all night you use grid power, for some of the morning then the pannels start to produce.  some of your grid is now offset by the pannels when use is low all is supplied by pannels but if you start up the microwave or the fridge starts up the grid makes up the differance again.  then the sun intensity drops and you are back on the grid totaly again for the night.

in a system with storage the batteries act as a reserve, so when you start the microwave or what ever the batteries make up the difference effectivly elimination grid use during peak times when hydro is more expensive.  when the batteries are topped off the charge controler sends it to the grid lowering your consumption.  at night normal people would have no grid usage unless your pretty power hungry. 

with a properly sized storage bank and enough pannels, you could be paid by the hydro company every month instead of paying them, but this would be expensive to do.    Now for people who are interested and have a river or good flowing year round creek, with an elivation change of at least 3 feet, close to there house.  micro-hydro is the absolute best way to go.  produces 24/7 as long as that river is flowing.  simple systems produce more than 700KWh/month. there is also a solution for people with low elivation changes but a good flow (6-9mph)  http://www.nooutage.com/aquair-uw.htm

Steve
 
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Thanks to Pops, Bear, and stircrazy for the good info and inks!

Should I ask Jeff for an "Alternate Energy Sources" sub-forum so we can expand on these ideas?  Let me know.
 
As mentioned in several posts the problem is storage.  We need a way to save the energy in a stable, transportable form.  Do we use solar and wind to make hydrogen.  There was some research where the hydrogen was not stored as a pure gas but attached to zinc I believe.  When the hydrogen was needed for combustion a small electric charge was used to release the bound hydrogen from the zinc.  I remember reading something about this quite a bit ago so the elements and methods are probable wrong.  At home you have the luxury of gravity.  Use solar and wind to pump the water up grade and release the water through a small turbine when power is needed.  Not very practical at this point but a possibility.  This is where the dedication and funding of pure research is so important, the storage side of the problem.
 
In Turin, NY (skiing resort area) when I was an insurance agent in the '70's I kept passing by a house with no siding on the back of the garage and it intrigued me, so one day I stopped and knocked (I did a lot of cold calling anyways, so it was natural).  The house owner was gracious and asked me in to show off his system.  He built the attached garage after he'd built the house and designed his own idea of thermal mass heat.  He had the foundation dug 10' down and buried 3" metal pipe in layers with large rock see-sawing all through it, then poured the garage floor on top.  He had the pipe come up into the back (south) wall of the garage, which the inner panels were painted black, the stud chambers hollow and the outside this new stuff called 'plexiglass'.  The chambers were interconnected with pipe and attached was a blower.  The back wall was a solar collector and would force the air down into the rock chamber under the floor where it would heat the rock during the day, then expel into the house to keep the house warm during the winter.  During the summer he did the opposite and drew the warm air from the house down into the rock and then outside, cooling the house.  This is in NNY and it can get -40 below in the winter, but he said his total heat bill for each winter since he put it in averaged under $100 for kerosene for a kerosene heater he'd run when it was really cold, only a few days a month.  His room air conditioner rarely ran, his house staying 75° ave. in the summer.  Now I like the idea of $100 a year in utility bills!  And all it cost him was some piping and some rock and a bathroom exhaust vent blower!
 
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A fried of mine has been getting free electricity for the pat 2-3 years.  He has over 100% coverage with solar panels and they paid for themselves 2-3 years ago.  Another friend has a helix turbine and a "conventional" one as well.  My brother just got an estimate for his house (for solar) and is going with an 80% option.  I'm trying to talk him into 100% but he doesn't want to shell out that much money (he's looking at around $20K after all rebates and credits).
 
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This is my dream (other than having sex with a whole plethora of women at the same time while I'm on Viagra after serving them a Kobe Prime Rib that I've smoked
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I had that dream last night 
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