MES 30 wont get to temp!

[husker3in4]

Thanks for your fast reply!

The images in your post didnt show up, but I get the gist of what you mean.

So where would I get new wires? Would my local ACE have them? Im not very electrical, since the red wire that burned runs directly between the rollout thermostat switch and the heating element, I can replace that one easily. The rest seem to be coming from the circuit board underneath the unit, and I wouldnt have a clue how to replace any of those.

The gray wire with the frayed insulation is the ground wire itself. It doesnt appear anything is exposed in that wire, I have inspected it before. But even if it is, I am under the assumption that if it did get exposed and touched metal, its the ground wire so that would be fine, right?

I can replace that one red wire, but if it needed more I would be totally stuck. Who might you suggest I check to see who could do a complete rewire of this smoker (besides the controller wire and heat sensor wire that look brand new) and how much do you think that might cost me? Ballpark?

 

[tallbm]

Thanks for your fast reply!

The images in your post didnt show up, but I get the gist of what you mean.

So where would I get new wires? Would my local ACE have them? Im not very electrical, since the red wire that burned runs directly between the rollout thermostat switch and the heating element, I can replace that one easily. The rest seem to be coming from the circuit board underneath the unit, and I wouldnt have a clue how to replace any of those.

The gray wire with the frayed insulation is the ground wire itself. It doesnt appear anything is exposed in that wire, I have inspected it before. But even if it is, I am under the assumption that if it did get exposed and touched metal, its the ground wire so that would be fine, right?

I can replace that one red wire, but if it needed more I would be totally stuck. Who might you suggest I check to see who could do a complete rewire of this smoker (besides the controller wire and heat sensor wire that look brand new) and how much do you think that might cost me? Ballpark?

You should be able to get new wire at a hardware store like ACE but it just depends about what they have on the shelf. Fry's electronics would be an even better option.
The MES uses 16 gauge wire. You will want Hi Temp if you can get it. If you just want to order on amazon you can get 10ft of black for $5 here (a little pricey but very convenient):


Don't worry about replacing any of the other wires just yet. They are likely fine unless they are burning up or are loose.

You may as well get some 1/4" female spade stainless steel 14-16AWG connectors for the wire(s) that will connect to your heating element.

If the ground is exposed and doesn't have good contact with the medal than you may not get a good ground so it's best to just throw some electrical tape (not duct) around any frayed areas :)

For a complete rewire job you might be able to get a local handy man or electrical person for the main wiring but it really is quite simple. You are looking at all the wires that exist int he system already. The little thin ones are all controller related and the thicker braided ones are the main power wires. A rewire job would likely include any/all of the existing braided wires you can currently see. So that mystery is solved. The next thing would be to crimp on electrical connectors and then pop them on where you see they already go right now.
That's it for the electrical rewire... that and don't break any of the tabs that the connectors pop onto :)

If you ever want to do a rewire to bypass the MES controller so you can use something like an Auber PID controller you can follow this post: https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/mes-rewire-simple-guide-no-back-removal-needed.267069/
People usually only do this when their MES controller dies, they can't hit max temp with their controller, or they want much tighter temp control without the temp swings from the MES. They wouldn't this kind of rewire to fix your problem.
Your problem is just worn out or failing wires/electrical connectors so you gotta fix that no matter what :)

FYI, I have never seen an MES (in person or a posted pic) with a Red wire like yours. That to me shows that someone has already replaced that wire in the past so there seems to have been an issue with the wiring or connectors that they may not have properly fixed to begin with. It's no big issue now that you found it but you want to fix it so things run safely and your smoker behaves like it should :)

 

[husker3in4]

Thanks again for the quick response. I checked my local Ace and they have 12g wire for .69 a foot, but its not hi temp. They asked if I wanted single or stranded wire, which one do I want?

I also found 12g THHN wire at a local home store. Is that the high heat stuff I want? He also asked if I wanted single wire or stranded.

12g is better than 16g right?

As far as rewiring, I will probably try replacing that red wire first. Hopefully there isnt anything else wrong, as Im wondering if the red wire was good but something else caused it to burn?

You are correct, that red wire isnt factory. My buddy put it on, saying it is he same gauge as the other wires, it just doenst have the insulation so thats why it isn't as thick. In any case, I need to replace it for sure.

It seems all the wires (except for that red wire) come off the circuit board under the smoker, how would I even get to them if I wanted to rewire it?

 

[jimmyinsd]

Single strand wire, not braided. I am guessing your buddies wire job was loose and was arcing and that caused it to burn.

 

[husker3in4]

It seems my only options are single or stranded. Is it safe to assume that "stranded" wire is a single strand and not braided?

 

[tallbm]

Thanks again for the quick response. I checked my local Ace and they have 12g wire for .69 a foot, but its not hi temp. They asked if I wanted single or stranded wire, which one do I want?

I also found 12g THHN wire at a local home store. Is that the high heat stuff I want? He also asked if I wanted single wire or stranded.

12g is better than 16g right?

As far as rewiring, I will probably try replacing that red wire first. Hopefully there isnt anything else wrong, as Im wondering if the red wire was good but something else caused it to burn?

You are correct, that red wire isnt factory. My buddy put it on, saying it is he same gauge as the other wires, it just doenst have the insulation so thats why it isn't as thick. In any case, I need to replace it for sure.

It seems all the wires (except for that red wire) come off the circuit board under the smoker, how would I even get to them if I wanted to rewire it?

I don't know that single vs stranded makes much difference but just to go with the flow i would use stranded wire. You will want to make sure that the wire insulation can stand up to temps of 300F or higher or it may melt on you and you might end up with a fire situation.

Well 12g can handle more difficult situations than 16g wire so it won't be an issue going that direction. Just understand that 12g is a fatter wire so you will need to use 10-12g connectors now rather than 14-16g connectors because the "barrel" portion of a 14-16g connector is generally not fat enough for a 12g wire to go into. So you gotta keep this in mind if you decide to move away from 16g wiring.

I would just expose (not unhook just expose) the connectors from any insulation wrappers that go to the heating element and the rollout limit switch. Then I would give a gentle tugging/wiggling on the wire near the connector to see if the wire is firmly crimped to the connector. You'd be surprised how often or easily it may just pull out.
If there is any wiggle with the wire crimped to the connector or the connector to the tabs of the heating element (or rollout limit switch) then you have a situation where the connection may be causing resistance which means the piece will usually heat up until something melts/burns up and fails or even catches fire. If this happens at the rollout limit switch it will heat up and trip this switch to cut off power and you will never hit your set temp because this will repeat over and over.

Let me know if this info helps or if you have any other questions :)

 

[mosparky]

Braided in this case I think refers to the fiberglass braided covering on the insulation. Stranded refers to the multitude os smaller wire that make up the conductor. Single strand (often called solid) would be like the wiring used for your house. I really would not recommend using solid wire. Great care would have to taken to get the position and twist just right to avoid straining the connection and parts. Speaking of the connections, or connectors, they will need to be soldered in the case of solid wire. The stranded wire will compress in the crimp process but solid will not and therefore will not stay tight. Solder will fix this on solid wire.

 

[husker3in4]

So I think I found what I want online, on ebay actually. I found similar things on amazon but they wanted too much + shipping. The wire is 12 AWG and listed as TGGT High tempurature.

Here are the links:
Wire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/10-FEET-12...027513&hash=item3f662287f9:g:pWQAAOSw44BYP4UI

Connectors: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Supco-T111...379491&hash=item33d888d2bf:g:YRsAAOSw70xZ321b

Tallbm had said masterbuilt uses 16-14 AWG but that 12-10 AWG would be better. Then he also said I should keep all the wiring the same as to not introduce differences. Since I am going to just replace this one wire, should I get 16-14 AWG instead? Or stay with this 12 AWG thats in the link?

I should be able to just cut the wire to length, strip it back and crimp on the connectors and be all set to go.

Do I need to wrap the crimped area of the connector with electrical tape once Im done?

Wish I could have found these in town, but in any case, please look over these links and tell if if these will work.

 

[tallbm]

So I think I found what I want online, on ebay actually. I found similar things on amazon but they wanted too much + shipping. The wire is 12 AWG and listed as TGGT High tempurature.

Here are the links:
Wire: https://www.ebay.com/itm/10-FEET-12...027513&hash=item3f662287f9:g:pWQAAOSw44BYP4UI

Connectors: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Supco-T111...379491&hash=item33d888d2bf:g:YRsAAOSw70xZ321b

Tallbm had said masterbuilt uses 16-14 AWG but that 12-10 AWG would be better. Then he also said I should keep all the wiring the same as to not introduce differences. Since I am going to just replace this one wire, should I get 16-14 AWG instead? Or stay with this 12 AWG thats in the link?

I should be able to just cut the wire to length, strip it back and crimp on the connectors and be all set to go.

Do I need to wrap the crimped area of the connector with electrical tape once Im done?

Wish I could have found these in town, but in any case, please look over these links and tell if if these will work.

There is an electrical term (can't think of it right now) that refers to keeping the system/circuit equal like the sense of the same gauge wiring, etc. to ensure that everything is consistent to avoid situations where one area is too weak, or one area is so strong it introduces issues to another area etc.
This is why I personally prefer to keep things the same.
HOWEVER, with as simple as that one wire replacement is I don't really see an issue with moving up to 12ga wire.
You really won't get any of the benefits of using 12ga wire at this scale so no biggy.
You just gotta make sure to use the proper connector with it is all.

The wire and connector you link to on ebay would do the trick.
If you can get cheaper 16ga and connectors for 16ga wire then I would go that route to save the cost :)

If you go 16ga (25ft, no 10ft option) and Supco t1111 (for 16ga wire) you can save about $2+ total over your linked to 12ga options, see the 16ga links here:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/16-ga-GAUG...004646?hash=item465498b4e6:g:730AAOSwi0RX0pKb
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Supco-T111...959634&hash=item41d5ed3c9a:g:SSAAAOSwXrdaJ6vm

Go either route but I figure you may get more reuse and benefit from an 25ft of wire vs 10ft AND you get extra 16ga hi temp connectors you can use with the stock MES 16ga wiring in case other wiring or connectors go bad :)

I hope this helps :)

 

[husker3in4]

Here is an update: I got my new 12g hi temp wire and connectors last week. I cut the wire and got the connectors on and put the wire on and fired it up, it worked! I let it run at 275 for a bit, then shut it off and let it cool. Then I actually screwed in the temp shut off switch and fired it up (holding my breath). this is where is didnt work in the past. I checked 20 mins later an it was working! I let it run for 2 hours and shut it off and let it cool. Then I got a nylon brush and knocked off the gunk on the inside of the smoker (and mold). Today I am going to spray some vinegar/water mix on the walls and door and wipe off any remaining gunk/mold as it sat for 3 yrs or so. I wont scrub, just wipe.

Then comes test#2. I will screw in the little metal box cover over the back of the round temp shutoff switch. Doesn't sound like much, but in the past, it would work outside the smoker u but once I screwed everything in, nada.

If all goes well I will reseason it, and hope to get its first smoke after 3 years going this weekend.

 

[tallbm]

Here is an update: I got my new 12g hi temp wire and connectors last week. I cut the wire and got the connectors on and put the wire on and fired it up, it worked! I let it run at 275 for a bit, then shut it off and let it cool. Then I actually screwed in the temp shut off switch and fired it up (holding my breath). this is where is didnt work in the past. I checked 20 mins later an it was working! I let it run for 2 hours and shut it off and let it cool. Then I got a nylon brush and knocked off the gunk on the inside of the smoker (and mold). Today I am going to spray some vinegar/water mix on the walls and door and wipe off any remaining gunk/mold as it sat for 3 yrs or so. I wont scrub, just wipe.

Then comes test#2. I will screw in the little metal box cover over the back of the round temp shutoff switch. Doesn't sound like much, but in the past, it would work outside the smoker u but once I screwed everything in, nada.

If all goes well I will reseason it, and hope to get its first smoke after 3 years going this weekend.

Thing sound promising!
Let us know how it turns out, my fingers are crossed for you :)

 

[husker3in4]

Tallbm, can you do me a favor and measure where you put your hole in your back panel for the round temp shut off switch? I know ours may be different as far as where it is, but I want to use your measurements as a reference.

 

[jimmyinsd]

Here is an update: I got my new 12g hi temp wire and connectors last week. I cut the wire and got the connectors on and put the wire on and fired it up, it worked! I let it run at 275 for a bit, then shut it off and let it cool. Then I actually screwed in the temp shut off switch and fired it up (holding my breath). this is where is didnt work in the past. I checked 20 mins later an it was working! I let it run for 2 hours and shut it off and let it cool. Then I got a nylon brush and knocked off the gunk on the inside of the smoker (and mold). Today I am going to spray some vinegar/water mix on the walls and door and wipe off any remaining gunk/mold as it sat for 3 yrs or so. I wont scrub, just wipe.

Then comes test#2. I will screw in the little metal box cover over the back of the round temp shutoff switch. Doesn't sound like much, but in the past, it would work outside the smoker u but once I screwed everything in, nada.

If all goes well I will reseason it, and hope to get its first smoke after 3 years going this weekend.

glad to hear you got it going. I would say you should likely just use white vinegar straight instead of diluting it.

 

[tallbm]

Tallbm, can you do me a favor and measure where you put your hole in your back panel for the round temp shut off switch? I know ours may be different as far as where it is, but I want to use your measurements as a reference.

When I get home I will do so. Just know that my panel is quite large compared to what is needed. I will try and give you a more "streamlined" set of measurements on top of what my panel measurements are. Also know that my MES is a Gen 1 so if you have a different version there is a chance that we may not be talking apples to apples with rollout switch positioning but I think we'll be close :)

 

[husker3in4]

Thanks! I know the serial on my MES is 20070910, its an early version i know that.

 

[dr k]

Thanks! I know the serial on my MES is 20070910, its an early version i know that.

20070910 is the Mes gen 1 30" all black no window.

 

[husker3in4]

That is correct! That is exactly the one I have.

 

[tallbm]

Well I have bad news for you, I run an MES 40 so I know for sure our measurements will be off lol
If you can borrow your wife's/lady's lipstick or something equally messy you can always install the metal box that covers the rollout limit switch and mark up the edges of it with the lipstick.
Then kind of press the back of the MES in place and against the lipstick to get an idea of where the metal box will be.
Then just cut out a panel bigger than the marked up area.

I also cut out a rectangle on the metal box that covers the rollout limit switch since I replaced mine with a manual reset rollout limit switch and if I ever need to reset it then I can get to it :)

 

[husker3in4]

I got it going for a few hours and ran 3 loads of chips in it to re-season it. Boy did it smell good!
Im going to try to put the back on it tonight and screw everything in. I am going to smoke a brisket this weekend and dont want to mess with cutting a hole in the back of it just yet. I can cut the hole, but dont have another slab of sheet metal to screw over it, so I think Ill just leave it be for now. Ill post a couple pics tonight.