Help me get some knives

  • Some of the links on this forum allow SMF, at no cost to you, to earn a small commission when you click through and make a purchase. Let me know if you have any questions about this.
SMF is reader-supported. When you buy through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission.
As a custom knife maker, you have to pay to play. A good carbon steel knife will last hundreds of years. Great grandkids will be using my knives long after I'm gone. Large knives are $320-350. Have 9-14 hours labor and at least an hour in an annealing furnace, and about 60$ in steel and belts. Small is $120 about 1\2 the resources so half the price. And I'm cheap. FYI. But the head chef of Nakato is using my knives (hibachi grill). These are 6-10 years old

View attachment 709645
Very cool and I'm glad you pointed out to cost of a custom blade........ you do pay but....as you said it will last for generations. We have had our Henkels for more than 30 years now.....I also make knives but can't afford them for personal use.....LOL
 
Last edited:
I think I should stop reading this thread... might enable myself into thinking I need a new knife lol!

Ryan
Enabling......
TD-KnifePrize.jpg
 
When it comes to cutlery, there are two kinds of cooks: cooks who love making good food, and cooks who love, and feel validated by, their knives. If you're the second kind of cook, you will spend a ton of money on knives that are actually more aggravation without functioning any better.

I have had pricey Japanese knives. Avoid them. Avoid Sabatier, Wusthof...all the expensive stuff. These knives are for knife hobbyists who think they're cooks. You know. The guys who think it's impossible to fix a decent hot dog without a Big Green Egg.

Japanese knives break in the dishwasher. If you're about to type, "You're not supposed to put knives in the dishwasher!", you're part of the problem. You're a knife-lover, not a cook. You ARE supposed to put knives in the dishwasher. Knives are supposed to serve you, not the other way around.

Knives with fancy handles don't last. You want NSF plastic, and it's a good idea to get different colors in order to avoid using the same knife on raw meat and salad.

If you think all professional cooks use $400 knives, you're wrong. Pro kitchens pay companies to collect and sharpen their plastic-and-stainless knives and bring them back. They don't want to pay their line cooks to sit around sharpening nakiris that cost as much as big-screen TV's.

If you think expensive knives hold their edges better, you're wrong when it comes to European knives. Japanese knives are hard, and they do hold an edge longer, but they're so fragile they're not worth it. European kitchen knives are softer than good-quality pocket knives. People who buy them are expected to be able to sharpen them repeatedly.

Forschner knives get top marks from America's Test Kitchen. They're tough. They're cheap. They take a razor edge in 5 seconds if you know how to use a diamond hone (you should). Mundial makes pretty much the same knives. There are other companies, too.

I gave away Shuns. They were atrocious. I still have a few Japanese knives I never use. I also have some fantastic cheap Chinese knives from Wok Shop. My $9 cleavers get so sharp, I can hold a paper towel out and pass one through it. They rust, though, so they don't see much use.

In addition to knives with smooth edges, you should get some serrated knives. Anthony Bourdain was an idiot, but he was right about this. A good serrated knife will do a lot of things better than a non-serrated knife, and you won't have to sharpen it. If it gets dull, spend $20 and get a new one. I'll post a link. These knives are wonderful for slicing onions and sandwiches and cutting bread.

Don't fall for the Gucci knife bug. It's like high-end audio. Intelligent, gullible people are out there paying thousands for silver cables to listen to music recorded with cheap copper. A knife is just a sharp piece of metal that cuts things. It's not an F1 car. It doesn't have to cost a lot.

I like good knives. I have a $200 knife in my pocket right now. In the kitchen, however, cheap knives rule.


 
  • Like
Reactions: luvcatchingbass
When it comes to cutlery, there are two kinds of cooks: cooks who love making good food, and cooks who love, and feel validated by, their knives. If you're the second kind of cook, you will spend a ton of money on knives that are actually more aggravation without functioning any better.

I have had pricey Japanese knives. Avoid them. Avoid Sabatier, Wusthof...all the expensive stuff. These knives are for knife hobbyists who think they're cooks. You know. The guys who think it's impossible to fix a decent hot dog without a Big Green Egg.

Japanese knives break in the dishwasher. If you're about to type, "You're not supposed to put knives in the dishwasher!", you're part of the problem. You're a knife-lover, not a cook. You ARE supposed to put knives in the dishwasher. Knives are supposed to serve you, not the other way around.

Knives with fancy handles don't last. You want NSF plastic, and it's a good idea to get different colors in order to avoid using the same knife on raw meat and salad.

If you think all professional cooks use $400 knives, you're wrong. Pro kitchens pay companies to collect and sharpen their plastic-and-stainless knives and bring them back. They don't want to pay their line cooks to sit around sharpening nakiris that cost as much as big-screen TV's.

If you think expensive knives hold their edges better, you're wrong when it comes to European knives. Japanese knives are hard, and they do hold an edge longer, but they're so fragile they're not worth it. European kitchen knives are softer than good-quality pocket knives. People who buy them are expected to be able to sharpen them repeatedly.

Forschner knives get top marks from America's Test Kitchen. They're tough. They're cheap. They take a razor edge in 5 seconds if you know how to use a diamond hone (you should). Mundial makes pretty much the same knives. There are other companies, too.

I gave away Shuns. They were atrocious. I still have a few Japanese knives I never use. I also have some fantastic cheap Chinese knives from Wok Shop. My $9 cleavers get so sharp, I can hold a paper towel out and pass one through it. They rust, though, so they don't see much use.

In addition to knives with smooth edges, you should get some serrated knives. Anthony Bourdain was an idiot, but he was right about this. A good serrated knife will do a lot of things better than a non-serrated knife, and you won't have to sharpen it. If it gets dull, spend $20 and get a new one. I'll post a link. These knives are wonderful for slicing onions and sandwiches and cutting bread.

Don't fall for the Gucci knife bug. It's like high-end audio. Intelligent, gullible people are out there paying thousands for silver cables to listen to music recorded with cheap copper. A knife is just a sharp piece of metal that cuts things. It's not an F1 car. It doesn't have to cost a lot.

I like good knives. I have a $200 knife in my pocket right now. In the kitchen, however, cheap knives rule.


Respectfully....... You are dead wrong. And I find your super judgemental attitude disrespectful and distasteful. I have no problem disagreeing with someone but degrading them because they don't agree with you is not acceptable.
 
If you feel degraded because I say things you disagree with, it's on you. It's unhealthy to be threatened by disagreement.

You will notice I didn't get angry at anyone who posted here, but you did.

I'm trying to save people from expensive mistakes I made. Forschners and the like are used in Michelin-starred restaurants. If there were anything at all--at all--wrong with them, this would not be true.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nodak21
For viewing a good assortment, check out agrussell.com . I have many knives I bought there, his brand, and they are nicely balanced and well designed IMHO. I also have some Old HIckory knives that have been around my kitchen for over 50 years - still sharpen easily and handle and cut well. My wife brought her father's butcher knives to the marriage 40 some odd years ago - carbon steel and look like hell but cut like it too! ( best to keep the carbon steel away from lettuce ...).
I hand wash & dry all my knives except for the few serrated ones I've been gifted over the years. A.G. Russell often remarks that he prefers a knife that cuts to one that saws ...

I have a 3 stone Norton similar to the one currently available on amazon

Norton IM313 Knife Sharpener​

Three grits of stone and a built in oil bath - I've spent a lot of hours with it. I have some diamond stones now I bought from Russell and they are excellent too, both desktop and more portable sizes.

Sharpening knives is therapeutic, kind of like reloading ammunition or sanding wood or watching the smoke curl up from your grill or smoker!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Brokenhandle
I just dug out my high-end Japanese cleaver. I had to take newspaper off the blade because I wrapped it up when I moved here. The date doesn't appear on the newspaper, but it has a story about a Dolphins player who had recently been cut, and that was in 2017. The cleaver is useless to me, so I left it wrapped up for 7 years, and it would still be wrapped up if it hadn't been for this thread.

I believe I paid about $250 in maybe 2010, so it would be more like $450 now. I don't recall the brand, and there are no Roman letters on it to tell me.

Wooden handle, so not designed to go in the dishwasher or repel bacteria. Porous, to absorb kitchen filth. Not nonslip. Has to be oiled. Will come apart eventually if washed like a normal knife.

Narrow, fragile edge so it can't be used on anything hard. Forget meat. And the edge has little rust spots on it even though it was stored dry.

I don't know what to do with it. I should put it on Ebay, if I can figure out which brand it is.

I have a Wok Shop cleaver I paid around $14 for. Very heavy. Takes a very sharp edge. Goes through bones like they're fortune cookies. No edge damage. Unfortunately, it's carbon steel, so I quit using it. Much better than the Japanese job, though.

I got a Mundial meat cleaver to replace it. Cheap. Never has a spot of rust. Goes through bones. Takes a sharp edge. Nonslip NSF handle. Goes into the dishwasher and comes out smiling. Sells for $28.

What can you get for the $420 you save by buying a Mundial cleaver? Bunch of briskets. Wifi thermometers. Cart for your smoker. Almost 4 bottles of Lagavulin. Most of the cost of a nice deep fryer. A nice box of Cubans, if you're not too picky.

What do you get if you spend the $420 on the expensive knife? The need for another cleaver for meat. Lots of hand-washing. The chore of oiling and drying the handle. And it's harder to sharpen because it's something like RC 62.

I have a Tojiro honesuki, which is a boning knife. Not that expensive at $86. I don't know where it is.

For boneless turkey, I use two Forschner birds beak knives which cost $4.95 each. They're tough and flexible. The handles aren't slick like the Tojiro's. They sharpen in a few seconds. They get into joints much better. I don't have to worry about the tips breaking off if I hit the counter or the sink.

I made my own stainless boning knives and had them hardened and cryo-treated by a well-known shop, and I never put handles on them because the Forschners work so well, it doesn't seem worth the trouble to finish them.

I have a Tojiro nakiri. I have never been able to find a use for it. My cheap knives do it all. I should have given it away with my embarrassing Shuns.

One of the Shuns was a cleaver. Tiny. Badly balanced. The blade was too curved to do its job. Another Shun was a santoku. Heavy. Kershaw said I could put it in the dishwasher, so I did, and big pieces fell out of the edge.

I complained to Kershaw because their knives couldn't stand ordinary use, as promised, and suddenly their ad copy changed. No mention of dishwashers. Coincidence, I guess.

I gave both knives to a professional chef who has no common sense and carries her Globals around in a roll. Like most culinary school grads, she can't sharpen a knife, so she sends hers off when they get dull. Weird.

As for the cheap versions of pricey knives, I had two Spanish Henckels knives, and they were garbage. Wouldn't take an edge. They went to Goodwill.
 
I just dug out my high-end Japanese cleaver. I had to take newspaper off the blade because I wrapped it up when I moved here. The date doesn't appear on the newspaper, but it has a story about a Dolphins player who had recently been cut, and that was in 2017. The cleaver is useless to me, so I left it wrapped up for 7 years, and it would still be wrapped up if it hadn't been for this thread.

I believe I paid about $250 in maybe 2010, so it would be more like $450 now. I don't recall the brand, and there are no Roman letters on it to tell me.

Wooden handle, so not designed to go in the dishwasher or repel bacteria. Porous, to absorb kitchen filth. Not nonslip. Has to be oiled. Will come apart eventually if washed like a normal knife.

Narrow, fragile edge so it can't be used on anything hard. Forget meat. And the edge has little rust spots on it even though it was stored dry.

I don't know what to do with it. I should put it on Ebay, if I can figure out which brand it is.

I have a Wok Shop cleaver I paid around $14 for. Very heavy. Takes a very sharp edge. Goes through bones like they're fortune cookies. No edge damage. Unfortunately, it's carbon steel, so I quit using it. Much better than the Japanese job, though.

I got a Mundial meat cleaver to replace it. Cheap. Never has a spot of rust. Goes through bones. Takes a sharp edge. Nonslip NSF handle. Goes into the dishwasher and comes out smiling. Sells for $28.

What can you get for the $420 you save by buying a Mundial cleaver? Bunch of briskets. Wifi thermometers. Cart for your smoker. Almost 4 bottles of Lagavulin. Most of the cost of a nice deep fryer. A nice box of Cubans, if you're not too picky.

What do you get if you spend the $420 on the expensive knife? The need for another cleaver for meat. Lots of hand-washing. The chore of oiling and drying the handle. And it's harder to sharpen because it's something like RC 62.

I have a Tojiro honesuki, which is a boning knife. Not that expensive at $86. I don't know where it is.

For boneless turkey, I use two Forschner birds beak knives which cost $4.95 each. They're tough and flexible. The handles aren't slick like the Tojiro's. They sharpen in a few seconds. They get into joints much better. I don't have to worry about the tips breaking off if I hit the counter or the sink.

I made my own stainless boning knives and had them hardened and cryo-treated by a well-known shop, and I never put handles on them because the Forschners work so well, it doesn't seem worth the trouble to finish them.

I have a Tojiro nakiri. I have never been able to find a use for it. My cheap knives do it all. I should have given it away with my embarrassing Shuns.

One of the Shuns was a cleaver. Tiny. Badly balanced. The blade was too curved to do its job. Another Shun was a santoku. Heavy. Kershaw said I could put it in the dishwasher, so I did, and big pieces fell out of the edge.

I complained to Kershaw because their knives couldn't stand ordinary use, as promised, and suddenly their ad copy changed. No mention of dishwashers. Coincidence, I guess.

I gave both knives to a professional chef who has no common sense and carries her Globals around in a roll. Like most culinary school grads, she can't sharpen a knife, so she sends hers off when they get dull. Weird.

As for the cheap versions of pricey knives, I had two Spanish Henckels knives, and they were garbage. Wouldn't take an edge. They went to Goodwill.
Sounds like you have all kinds of knives .
 
  • Like
Reactions: civilsmoker
I made expensive mistakes. Nothing to be proud of.
I really enjoy your perspective and opinion on this topic. You obviously have a passion for knives and cooking. I appreciate the honest review and didn’t feel threatened even though I would happily try Miyabi if I could afford. Good read and thanks for the info, perspective, and opinion!! Might have saved me some $$$
 
When it comes to cutlery, there are two kinds of cooks: cooks who love making good food, and cooks who love, and feel validated by, their knives. If you're the second kind of cook, you will spend a ton of money on knives that are actually more aggravation without functioning any better………
Just saying one can be a good cook and can cook with love and also have a love of fine cutlery….. pricey cutlery can cut equal to inexpensive…….and inexpensive can cut equal to pricey….. many knifes of all price points struggle to perform……..

……If I can paraphrase Dr Larrin Thomas, PhD in knife steel and creator of Magcut….. edge geometry is the most important feature in knife performance……..

I will end with this, the debate of the best knife will go on forever, but the best knife in the whole wide world is the one that gets used the way the owner wants to use it…….
 
Last edited:
For boneless turkey, I use two Forschner birds beak knives which cost $4.95 each. They're tough and flexible. The handles aren't slick like the Tojiro's. They sharpen in a few seconds. They get into joints much better. I don't have to worry about the tips breaking off if I hit the counter or the sink.
I have the victoronix version of the beak knife and I love it, use it all the time.
 
Really there's a PhD in knife steel
Yes Sir! I believe it falls under mechanics of materials because it’s all about molecule structure development along with design/knife engineering…..his research has revolutionized modern knife making……

The other interesting fact is that the legendary heat treater Paul Boss who eventually merged with Buck Knifes and a contributing reason why Buck Knives is now headquartered in Idaho developed a patented heat treatment process that is used on all Buck knifes……the enabling knife pic I posted above was heat treated by the Paul Boss shop……
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: gmc2003
Ok did a little testing with 2 of my boning knives this weekend cutting up part of my recent buck that has been aging for about a week, trimmed, portioned and packaged both backstraps and one one hind quarter. The 8in Victorinox I went through and did a full sharpening and strop job, it did all the work on the backstraps for trimming and removing silver skin and afterwards all I really needing to do was touch it up with a steel but beings I got a cheap course one I touched it up lightly with my super fine (think its 1000 grit) Lanskey stone then leather strop for a little bit watching TV and it slide right through newspaper. The next day I touched up my Dexter and stopped it for a little bit watching TV then went to work with both on a hind quarter, the Dexter I used for most of the shaving off the outer rind, muscle breakdown and major work, the Victorinox I used for most of the final product trimming and removing the fine silver skin. I get pretty particular on removing silver skin so much so that some people think I am wasting meat but hey the farm cats nee treats in the cold winter too.
In the end I don't think I have $50 into both knives plus shipping and probably another $50 into the Lanskey kit and $20 into a good leather strop. These knives are easy to sharpen and touch up quick, I have a custom knife that a friend made years ago and it is a beautiful knife and great quality but in some ways it is not practical, it holds an edge awesome but its a P.I.T.A to sharpen because its is so hard.
In the end I say get what you want, (#1) get a good sharpening system and learn how to sharpen your own, I am really eye'in up one of the new Work Sharp Precision setups to take my sharpening game to the next level. Trust me I have wanted to get some of these fancy nicer "high end" knives and over time some of them it is questionable if it is worth it for some of what I do, and I do kind of consider myself a knife coinsure or sorts and love experimenting with different types and styles for various tasks.
I will add as well the Victorinox is a thinner flexible blade and the Dexter is a little more stout and not very flexible
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Brokenhandle
This thread took an interesting turn.

Personally, I feel a knife is only as good as your ability to keep it sharp. Knives are tools, and I like having a choice of tools to use when preparing vegetables, fruit, fish, and meat. My knives cost from a few dollars each to $150 (one knife). I hand wash 6 to 10 knives a day because I quit using the dishwasher when the 4th one broke since we moved into our house.

I have a 40 year old set of made-in-Japan, shiny stainless knives that cost maybe $40 for the set when new. After 2 to 3 sessions of stone sharpening to reset the edges, they perform as razor sharp as my two Zwilling knives. They are steeled before each use and were last sharpened in June 2022. One of them gets used almost daily (6" gyuto-like shape).

My wife uses a J.A. Henckels International set I bought her many years ago. I have stoned sharpened her knives but she breaks every rule when she uses them: never steels, and cuts on glass and ceramic. She was struggling to cut cherry tomatoes in half recently when I handed her the 6" knife mentioned above. One swipe and she said, "You need to sharpen my knives!" I bit my tongue not to repeat what I've said too many times to her about her knife usage.

I've got cheap Chinese knives that stoned beautifully, and just received two Japanese Tojiro knives for Christmas that didn't make a sound when I sliced the gift paper. Even my son-in-law's jaw dropped.

Kitchen knives, when combined with zero sharpening skills, is like putting a toddler in the driver's seat or cockpit. Think of it this way: before learning to drive or fly, one has to spend hours learning the basics before ever getting behind the wheel or the stick. Learning to sharpen a knife should be first, and will save money and frustration in one's lifetime.

Ray
 
  • Like
Reactions: luvcatchingbass
Check out the Brewin or Enowo knives on Amazon. They are cheap, razor sharp and gold and edge for a long time. Just keep them dry, hand wash no dishwasher and use steel after each use. I have a lot of much higher end knives in my knife roll but after putting a set of these out in the kitchen I rarely have to get out my knife roll unless I want a particular blade. Many folks on here have these knives. Pay attention to coupons on these and check the box. EDIT Looks like Enowo is no longer available on Amazon but the Brewin still are. I'm using Enowo in my kitchen but neighbors love the Brewin set I gave them for Christmas last year. They use them daily and are still very sharp. I say a fill set for around $50 and a 3 knife set with sharpener for $25 looking quickly. If you want more recognizable brands costing a bit more the Mercer are great too.
+1 on the Brewin. I have a good Wusthof chef knife that I use on "Special occasions". the Brewin does what it should as I steel it every use. I have yet to sharpen it a year later.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jcam222
SmokingMeatForums.com is reader supported and as an Amazon Associate, we may earn commissions from qualifying purchases.

Latest posts

Hot Threads

Clicky