custom electric smoker build

[P0PZ]

hi everyone

I'm planning to build a new smoker (my old wooden one burnt down lol)
Currently I'm thinking steel (mild or stainless not sure which at the moment) inner walls,
an inch or 2 thick insulation then 3/4 inch wooden cladding exterior.
I'll use an electric oven element for heating and a venturi smoke generator.
I'll be using 2 PIDs (which i have already) one for smoker temp and one for meat temp (alarm when internal temp is reached or maybe auto shut down of power to oven element)

I'm just stuck on what size smoker should i build, I've only smoked homemade sausages and bacon in my old smoker, but I'm planning on doing brisket and rib and pulled pork etc.
What size would you guys recommend?
What size heating element? (I'm on 240v) capable of bringing port butts and brisket up to temp (so hot smoking)

any ideas, any info would be great
P0PZ

 

[SonnyE]

Hi! Welcome to Smoking Meat Forums.com!
So, we've found out nothing lasts forever. Old smokers just go up in smoke sometimes. Damn shame that.
What would you gain by making the inner walls steel? (I ask because I'm not sure if there is a gain.)
I've never built a wooden smoker myself. I've always adapted something. Old electrical cabinets, Porcelain refrigerators, old BBQ's.
But always liked the idea of a wooden smoke house, because of the insulation value of wood.
I'd suppose it would boil down to what is the most readily available to you.
Sizing depends on what you do with your smoker. Sausages and bacon shouldn't take a lot of cubic feet (or meters), however I am curing bacon myself and imagineering how I'm going to smoke it in my Smallish electric smoker.
(I'm a great proponent of electric smokers for controllable reasons.)
240 Volts only means half the wattage to me. No problem.

Do you "cook" in your smoker? Sausages and Bacon don't strike me as something needing heat, per sey. Some of us Yanks do giant briskets which need a bit of heat for a lot of hours. (Me not included.)
Most of mine is Cold to Warm smoking. My current smoker is the first commercially built one I ever owned. Then I modified the peadoodely out of it to make it work my way.
But all of my smokers have been electric in nature. It's just easier for me. Sounds like probably for you too?
Most amounted to a hot plate, (heating element) with a chip burner over it. (Can, small cast iron skillet) to let chips burn in for smoke.
Lots of room for the smoke to drift around and permeate the meat being smoked. What that container consists of is up to you and what is easily and affordably available to you.
After all, we are on the other end of the Earth from you. But we all know what is needed, Food. And we strive to make it taste good to us.

 

[P0PZ]

Thanks for the reply
I was thinking of going a metal inner walls simply because of the heat that it would take to bring briskets and pork butt(shoulders) up to final temp without the need to move them to the kitchen to finish off, didnt think wood would handle those temps well.
So yes I guess I'll be "cooking" in the smoker although not a must it would be easier (things like xmas which is in the summer here, when the kitchen oven, bbq and smoker are used through out the day)

But yeah like I said I'm only in the planning stages so if there is any reason not to do something or to do something different I'm all ears

P0PZ

 

[SonnyE]

Hi again PopZ!
OK, we are seeing you do actually cook in your smoker. So it would be best for it to hold the heat well.
I agree that, in that case, a metal interior would be good. Stainless steel would, of course, have the greatest endurance against the moisture inherent to cooking. But also the most costly.
I don't know what is readily available in your area, but could you fashion around an available "box" to make your chamber from? Or would you be thinking of lining a chamber?

My thoughts are, or were, that I could just buy a smoker, then make it do what I wanted after the fact. Which is exactly what I wound up doing. I'm still not sure it was the best choice, because I did a lot of modifying to get the smoker I wanted. And my choice of smoker was a bit lofty for my down to earth needs. I could have actually just bought a lesser smoker (Analog), then made it what I've built anyway.

You already know what you want, how to do it, and what it is going to take to get there (I did as well). You are miles (or Kilometers ;)) ahead of many folks. You are just rebuilding with questions about your perimeters.
So it sounds like you just need to chew on a few lesser aspects to try and avoid burning down your next smoker.

What you need (it sounds like) is an outdoor oven, that you can put smoke into. Which is what these newer smokers have grown into. Outdoor ovens that can smoke the food being cooked in them.
Did you build your last one out of desire to build it? Or necessity because you couldn't find something already made in your location?

I've looked at those venturi smoke generators before. I like the idea behind them, even considered building one. But I found SMF and went the pellet fuel direction with an AMNPS .

Do you have an idea why the old one burned down? Did your element come in contact with the wood? Or just a bit too close?
I have used single element electric hotplates before as my heat source. They are made for the base to be in direct contact with counter tops or such. Then I'd use a large (#10, 1 gallon) can as my chip pan, or a small cast iron pan.
But elements can't come in contact with any structural wood of your smoker. They'll set it off. As you've experienced.

My home made smokers always incorporated metal. One was a very large electrical cabinet I stripped out to use the box. About 5'H X 2'W X 1' D. A very big steel box.
Another was an old Porcelain steel refrigerator. Which I think was the best I ever had.
Others were steel drums, and last one before the Masterbuilt 30 I have now, was a vertical barrel type BBQ with a Bradley Puck smoke generator grafted onto it.
All of them were what would be considered "Cold Smokers". Or low temperature smokers.
Because until I got my MES 30, I never used my smokers as ovens. I smoked in them, made jerky in them, but never "cooked" in them. Until now....

I suppose the bottom line is to make your smoker fireproof, well insulated, and with fail safe controls. If it doesn't have an over temperature device, you need to incorporate one. Typically, a thermo disc is used to shut off the electricity if the temperature goes too high.
This safety device should never be compromised, never bypassed.

 

[P0PZ]

Hi again SonnyE

Ive looked at the available smokers of a size that would fit a brisket or some ribs and for the same money (or less) i can get a custom made metal "box", i live in an oil/gas/construction/dairy farming driven economy so machine shops and fabricators are quit common.
i believe my old smoker burnt down from either just getting to hot and charring/ element being to close or from a possible flare up, i went inside after refilling the chip pan and within 5 mins there was tons of smoke, ran down and it was just a complete mess, smoke rolling out of any gap, wood was all bowed and warped the flames were 1-2 feet tall out of the air vents/gaps... but it was an impressive sight lol. I had to put it out with the garden hose so my little brother who is a fire fighter didn't get a call out and then hold it over me for the rest of my life lmao.

yeah i agree with the thermal shut down Ive already got 2 PIDs hopefully these will be enough.
one for the cook temp so it will cycle the element on and off as need to maintain the heat required, the other for the internal meat temp, and I'm thinking of setting this so it shuts off the power to the entire smoker once the meat is up to temp.
Ive also got an electrical emergency stop button, it will stop all power to the smoker/PIDs in the event of a power surge/spike, or if the power is cycled off then on (power cut then restored), The stop button has to be reset each time so the smoker cant accidentally become powered without my input (its from an old woodworking table saw) also the power cable ill be using has a short circuit/ fuse protector in it so it will also kill the power if something untoward were to happen. (I'm not taking any chances with the mains electricity, 240v hurts like a mother f**ker.... been there and touched that lol)

its really just the size of the chamber and the wattage of the element that I'm stuck on.
I don't want to get a smoker that's either way too big or too small, or get an element that can't bring the smoker up to temp

 

[SonnyE]

How big was your last one (R.I.P.) and was it big enough to do everything you wanted of it?
If I ever was to do another smoker, I would want it taller. Right now I'm planning on smoking some slabs of bacon, and stuck on hanging two, and putting two on racks. Or doing two smoking runs. :rolleyes:

Sounds like you can get a well built smoker box for the inside. Then insulate it well and build the outside any way you'd like. I find wooden smoke houses particularly appealing. They just look right.
But may be impractical if it rains a lot.

Power wise, I see them run from 500 watts, up to 1500 watts. So I would stay within that range if I was doing it. But stay within the ratings of your PID. I used an element for an electric stove for my first one. The element normally used 240 volts. But I fed it 120 VAC which is common in homes here. 120/240 VAC
Be that as it may, it got hot enough to smolder the wood chips, but not red hot. Very simple, but effective.

What do you have in mind for a safety device in the chamber itself? Commercial units use a device called a snap disc that is closed (as a switch goes) and opens if a set temperature is exceeded. This cutie explains them well, and is a damn-sight cuter than me. ;)
Normally one of these is in the wiring of the element that is connected to the Neutral (or grounded side) of the circuit. Opens on temperature rise is what you need it to do.
The ones here generally open at ~320°-325°, shutting off the heating element.
But if it's on fire, it is usually a bit late. :oops:

And yes, it is not nice at all to get bit by any part of an electrical circuit. Besides, it could kill you. Then who's going to do the smoking? Your Brother? LOL!

Yeah, probably a flare up in the chip pan set the house afire. But Mum's the word, we don't want to give your Brother any fuel to thrash you with. :eek:

 

[P0PZ]

hey

I can't remember how big my last smoker was, all I have left of it is a scorched patch on the concrete :)
You say you'd like a taller smoker for the bacon your doing, what is the rough height of your smoker?

I was toying with the idea of a Bradley smoker for a while but the smoker pucks are just so expensive $1.20 NZD each that's like 82c USD a pop, that's if I buy in bulk and without the price of shipping! doing briskets and bacon etc would get rather pricey rather quickly if i went that way. thats not including the $1000+ NZD price tag for one of there small smokers:eek:

I've spent a few hours today researching and thinking more about the internal space of the smoker, started thinking along the lines of internal measurements of 400w 300d 480h usable 600 total (16"w 12"d 19"h usable 23 3/4" total height) the extra height is for element and drip tray etc
Then go something like 1000 watt 240v oven element or equivalent wattage in smaller elements depending on the size and shape of the oven element.
Any thoughts on the size and/or the wattage of the element?
I'm yet to buy the solid state relays so i can pretty much change the wattage to what ever would work well and get the relays to match:cool:

Those thermal snapdisks look interesting, I had a quick look online at a local supplier and I can get 2 different ones for 85C and 95C (about 185f and 203f) those temps are not quite hot enough 110c (230f) or there abouts would be good, but its something to keep an eye out for.

no idea why "Bradley smoker" links to amazon but yeah it does

 

[SonnyE]

hey

I can't remember how big my last smoker was, all I have left of it is a scorched patch on the concrete :)
You say you'd like a taller smoker for the bacon your doing, what is the rough height of your smoker?

I was toying with the idea of a Bradley smoker for a while but the smoker pucks are just so expensive $1.20 NZD each that's like 82c USD a pop, that's if I buy in bulk and without the price of shipping! doing briskets and bacon etc would get rather pricey rather quickly if i went that way. thats not including the $1000+ NZD price tag for one of there small smokers:eek:

I've spent a few hours today researching and thinking more about the internal space of the smoker, started thinking along the lines of internal measurements of 400w 300d 480h usable 600 total (16"w 12"d 19"h usable 23 3/4" total height) the extra height is for element and drip tray etc
Then go something like 1000 watt 240v oven element or equivalent wattage in smaller elements depending on the size and shape of the oven element.
Any thoughts on the size and/or the wattage of the element?
I'm yet to buy the solid state relays so i can pretty much change the wattage to what ever would work well and get the relays to match:cool:

Those thermal snapdisks look interesting, I had a quick look online at a local supplier and I can get 2 different ones for 85C and 95C (about 185f and 203f) those temps are not quite hot enough 110c (230f) or there abouts would be good, but its something to keep an eye out for.

no idea why "Bradley smoker" links to amazon but yeah it does

OK, measure the scorched patch, then figure how much to add to completely cover it up. We mustn't have the Fireman seeing it. Hide the evidence!

Bradley has priced their pucks out of reach for many folks. I quit them myself because of the outrageous price for ashes.
They'll soon be gone from the smoking scene. Pellets have taken over, it's just picking your method of using them. That link to Betsy's showed pellets in her venturi smoke generator.
I burned a tray of deconstituted pellets yesterday to see how they'd work. All burned up good in my AMNPS. The tray can burn both pellets or dust.
Deconstituted = Pellets in a pan or tray, add clean water, wait until the pellets begin to swell and dissolve into sawdust, then dry the dust for smoking. Burns cooler than pellets do. I'm trying this out.

Published dimensions of my MES 30 is (From Amazon):
Product Dimensions 19.9 x 20.5 x 33.3 inches
Item Weight 39.3 pounds
Shipping Weight 45.6 pounds
Manufacturer Masterbuilt

But the internal dimensions of mine are:
26.25"T x 14.75"W x 12.5"D
(666.750mm x 374.650mm x 317.500mm)

So there are some numbers (I made them Metric as well for you) ;)
Like I said, I wish mine was taller for hanging meat in it. Or maybe just bigger all about it.
But for me and the way I use my smoker, it has been big enough as is.
If I was building from scratch, or rising up from the ashes as it were, Ahem, I'd probably want internal dimensions of 24" x 24" x 48" (Roughly 600mm x 600mm x 1200mm internal)
Or external those if your material works better that way and sacrifice some interior room. But the point being, a bigger box.

The wattage of my smoker is 800 or 1000 watts. Can't find it anywhere. But I think it is 800 watts. And it gets hot enough to burn your butt, or bake your brisket. :rolleyes:
What's odd is the Analog smoker is 1500 watts. Why the digital's are 1 horsepower, and the analog is 2 horsepower beats me. Unless China doesn't make 2 HP relays. o_O

I have to run, but I'll be back with you later. :)