CHASING THIN BLUE SMOKE , AVOIDING CRESOTE

[denny]

Max frustration. Need to reset what I think I know about smoking pellets or plain burning wood. I have an outside wood burning furnace since retirement in 1991. Good seasoned wood burns hot and clean, but if you damper down the air mix, you get smoldering wood, strong acrid stench and CREOSOTE! My experience tells me this, but today's backward world, eg--parents having no say in what their kids are taught, has me confused! Seriously, I have read every post I can find about getting THIN BLUE SMOKE in electric smokers (and my trusted stick burners I set aside mostly because of convenience). Some of the key words I see are, blow out the flame, smoldering, white smoke, grey smoke, black smoke, thick or thin smoke, mail box mod, copper/SS pot scrubber to filter smoke, drill more air holes, restrict air more, use Amazn tray or cylinder, use crumbled pellets with/without corn cob dust packed and unpacked, change pellet brand, leave exhaust vent fully open, maybe add a chimney stack, know the requirements of cold smoking vs hot, and read, read, read everything by trustworthy contributors in SMF. I am doing or have done all the above except use corn cobs (haven't gotten to that yet) and today ordered a new brand of pellets
.
I have a heavily modified MES 40 with 1500W element, Auber WSD-1510 H, added external insulation, mail box, Amnps tray and cylinder, pot scrubber filter--you get the idea. I've had this smoker maybe 2 years and while I have done some good smokes, I have spent so much time trying different everythings that most are failures--I cannot honestly say I have seen a true thin blue smoke emit!! Certainly not like I used to get from my beloved stick burner, THE GOOD ONE. I know it sounds like I'm rejecting everything so many of you have generously shared from your hard-won knowledge but that isn't the case at all. I think I'm being overcome with frustration by the fact that there are so many ways of doing things, complicated by the truth of practices we should and should not do, and sometimes mutually in opposition to each other, and finally that there is no one totally correct way!

If my problem is mainly getting TBS, and I think it is, I simply have to concentrate on that. I'm trying but the smoke is at best a light gray NOT BLUE. I adjust the air intake but my method is kinda clunky and non reproducible so OK, work on it!! I keep thinking the pellets should flame; maybe not. Air intake must be the main cause.

I really don't know how you can advise me more; it's up to me. I just have to work it out and so far it really sucks! I won't give up so maybe if there is anyone out there unfortunate enough to fall into this trap, they will at least know they are not alone! If all fails, I'll just crank up The Good One and adapt my Auber to control a fan to the firebox! Have a cold one and thank God for our blessings!

NOTE TO SELF--read again in the morning, PRN

 

[bauchjw]

Sir, I hate to say it, but I think that you have to accept that there is no reproducing stick burner flavor, or TBS, in your cooks on electric smokers. You are trading off the real wood burner taste and feel for time, effort, and convenience. I do not believe that any amount of MODs or different techniques will ever get the same smoke or flavor that you remember or get from your stick burner. I think it's probably better to reframe your desired results, in smoke and cooks, to fit the realities of your MES. Life forced me to stop the offset for a few years and I went the MES, then Traeger route. My family and friends like the results, and my wife likes having me available to help around the house, but every now and then she says "It was better on your other smoker," and of course I know she is right. To reduce your frustrations, I think it's better to ID a realistic goal for the results you want in the MES and use that as the standard. Your MES (or any electric smoker) will never replace the stick burner, but that is OK, you can still get good results and have fun!

 

[clifish]

I am at a similar cross road, I have a Smokey Hollow (older MES type) with a pid and use pellets. While it does decent work I know it is not the same as using real wood. I don't have the time now to start and learn on a real stick burner. I am mulling over a Weber kettle as I some really great cooks shown on here. It might take a little more time to tend even with a PID but I think it might be worth it?

 

[BurntWeenie]

Geek out

A Material Perspective of Wood, Smoke, and BBQ

For those of us who have attempted to barbecue (BBQ), wood matters. Smoking delicious meats is effectively a chemical process that involves control ov…

www.sciencedirect.com

 

[Nefarious]

I'm in a similar but different situation. I cannot have a stick burner in my neighborhood. The city restricts potentially sparking grills to 25ft from any tree or house. I'm not walking out 25ft from the house to grill. So, I have a gas smoker, and gas grill.

I'm in the process of adding a mailbox mod and trying to get the smoke correct, and I'm not sure what I'm looking for. I don't know if I have ever seen TBS. I asked an administrator if we can see the images from the members that were awarded OTBS, the rules say they have to submit them, but they don't seem to be available for some reason.

What would be really good is a thread on TBS and have people post their pictures so we have a reference. Also we could understand what people have done to get closer. Maybe it should be a complete forum, all we do here depends on this smoke.

 

[bauchjw]

I am at a similar cross road, I have a Smokey Hollow (older MES type) with a pid and use pellets. While it does decent work I know it is not the same as using real wood. I don't have the time now to start and learn on a real stick burner. I am mulling over a Weber kettle as I some really great cooks shown on here. It might take a little more time to tend even with a PID but I think it might be worth it?

I highly recommend the Kettle. I've always had one, at least one, and you can't beat the results. That being said, I still don't think it replicates a good stick burner. It has its own unique flavor and texture results, just like each cooking technique/kit, and I personally think it's better for cooking may things better than an electric. It is absolutely my primary go to for any bird with skin and wings or direct like steaks, burgers, etc. I use the MES (mailbox mod) for cold smoke and Traeger for whole muscle hunks that will take longer than a few hours. I think that the kettle is a pretty invaluable capability to have and a few mods that improve are relatively cheap (vortex, gourmet grate, etc).

 

[RCAlan]

Max frustration. Need to reset what I think I know about smoking pellets or plain burning wood. I have an outside wood burning furnace since retirement in 1991. Good seasoned wood burns hot and clean, but if you damper down the air mix, you get smoldering wood, strong acrid stench and CREOSOTE! My experience tells me this, but today's backward world, eg--parents having no say in what their kids are taught, has me confused! Seriously, I have read every post I can find about getting THIN BLUE SMOKE in electric smokers (and my trusted stick burners I set aside mostly because of convenience). Some of the key words I see are, blow out the flame, smoldering, white smoke, grey smoke, black smoke, thick or thin smoke, mail box mod, copper/SS pot scrubber to filter smoke, drill more air holes, restrict air more, use Amazn tray or cylinder, use crumbled pellets with/without corn cob dust packed and unpacked, change pellet brand, leave exhaust vent fully open, maybe add a chimney stack, know the requirements of cold smoking vs hot, and read, read, read everything by trustworthy contributors in SMF. I am doing or have done all the above except use corn cobs (haven't gotten to that yet) and today ordered a new brand of pellets
.
I have a heavily modified MES 40 with 1500W element, Auber WSD-1510 H, added external insulation, mail box, Amnps tray and cylinder, pot scrubber filter--you get the idea. I've had this smoker maybe 2 years and while I have done some good smokes, I have spent so much time trying different everythings that most are failures--I cannot honestly say I have seen a true thin blue smoke emit!! Certainly not like I used to get from my beloved stick burner, THE GOOD ONE. I know it sounds like I'm rejecting everything so many of you have generously shared from your hard-won knowledge but that isn't the case at all. I think I'm being overcome with frustration by the fact that there are so many ways of doing things, complicated by the truth of practices we should and should not do, and sometimes mutually in opposition to each other, and finally that there is no one totally correct way!

If my problem is mainly getting TBS, and I think it is, I simply have to concentrate on that. I'm trying but the smoke is at best a light gray NOT BLUE. I adjust the air intake but my method is kinda clunky and non reproducible so OK, work on it!! I keep thinking the pellets should flame; maybe not. Air intake must be the main cause.

I really don't know how you can advise me more; it's up to me. I just have to work it out and so far it really sucks! I won't give up so maybe if there is anyone out there unfortunate enough to fall into this trap, they will at least know they are not alone! If all fails, I'll just crank up The Good One and adapt my Auber to control a fan to the firebox! Have a cold one and thank God for our blessings!

NOTE TO SELF--read again in the morning, PRN

I know it can be very frustrating trying to obtain tbs smoke… and not every bbq cooking equipment makes the task easy. Also, the production of creosote is never a good thing and usually the result of a badly managed fire… FYI. Some types of Smokers don’t help in making smoke and fire management easy either and can be a great waste of invested time and money… No one like chasing tbs nor cleaning a smoker covered in creosote.

Here’s 3 tips for you that I know will help to obtain the tbs you’re looking for.

1. Understanding Smoke Management: https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/understanding-smoke-management-updated-12-08-14.139474/. Give this thread a good reading. It has a wealth of great info on smoke management.

2. If you desire tbs smoke and enjoy true hardwood and charcoal smoke flavor profile on your food, a stand alone pellet smoker will never accomplish that task…. Unless you’re willing to invest and modify it to burn hardwood and charcoal. It can be done at an extra cost.$. Some Electric smokers can also be difficult in obtaining tbs, due to their lack of good airflow management. I think the best Set it and Forget it Smokers that burns true hardwood and charcoal as well as producing tbs smoke are the Gravity Feed Smokers. You don’t have to spend a fortune on one and results are fantastic. I spent $540.00 for my CG 980 GF..

Since I gotten my CG 980 last year, I’ve hardly touched my pellet smoker.. The CG 980 comes with a PID type controller and a ash bin fan, so there’s no need for opening and closing air vents or chasing a desired temp setting.

3. Lastly, it’s important to learn your bbqing equipment, so that you’ll know what it’s strengths and weaknesses are. Some are more frustrating and less effective then others. IMHO, a Gravity Feed Smoker just may be the direction you should look into. With mine, I get tbs smoke all the time, no production of creosote at all, it as Set it and Forget it as any pellet smoker and it produces tbs hardwood and charcoal smoke that’s very close to a true Offset stick burner. I hope the tips and info helps. Good luck


__________________

Char-Griller 980 GF… Pellet Pro Austin XL and a few more mods... In SoCal and Always... Semper Fi

 

[clifish]

I know it can be very frustrating trying to obtain tbs smoke… and not every bbq cooking equipment makes the task easy. Also, the production of creosote is never a good thing and usually the result of a badly managed fire… FYI. Some types of Smokers don’t help in making smoke and fire management easy either and can be a great waste of invested time and money… No one like chasing tbs nor cleaning a smoker covered in creosote.

Here’s 3 tips for you that I know will help to obtain the tbs you’re looking for.

1. Understanding Smoke Management: https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/understanding-smoke-management-updated-12-08-14.139474/. Give this thread a good reading. It has a wealth of great info on smoke management.

2. If you desire tbs smoke and enjoy true hardwood and charcoal smoke flavor profile on your food, a stand alone pellet smoker will never accomplish that task…. Unless you’re willing to invest and modify it to burn hardwood and charcoal. It can be done at an extra cost.$. Some Electric smokers can also be difficult in obtaining tbs, due to their lack of good airflow management. I think the best Set it and Forget it Smokers that burns true hardwood and charcoal as well as producing tbs smoke are the Gravity Feed Smokers. You don’t have to spend a fortune on one and results are fantastic. I spent $540.00 for my CG 980 GF..
View attachment 527268

Since I gotten my CG 980 last year, I’ve hardly touched my pellet smoker.. The CG 980 comes with a PID type controller and a ash bin fan, so there’s no need for opening and closing air vents or chasing a desired temp setting.

3. Lastly, it’s important to learn your bbqing equipment, so that you’ll know what it’s strengths and weaknesses are. Some are more frustrating and less effective then other. IMHO, a Gravity Feed Smoker just may be the direction you should look into. With mine, I get tbs smoke all the time, no production of creosote at all, it as Set it and Forget it as any pellet smoker and it produces tbs hardwood and charcoal smoke that’s very close to a true Offset stick burner. I hope the tips and info helps. Good luck


__________________

Char-Griller 980 GF… Pellet Pro Austin XL and a few more mods... In SoCal and Always... Semper Fi

What is on the left side? Is that a sear station? Or can you do a good sear inside?

That must have been pre covid pricing as I see Lowes is at $749

 

[RCAlan]

What is on the left side? Is that a sear station? Or can you do a good sear inside?

That must have been pre covid pricing as I see Lowes is at $749

On the left side of the cooking barrel is the side shelf and PID Controller. The grilling and searing is all done inside of the cooking barrel. Can you do a good grill and sear? Yes you can, but I primarily use mine for low and slow bbqing. I usually run mines from 225*-400* degrees. If I want to do a quick sear, I have a separate cheap charcoal grill for that. I usually already have it ready when I’m ready to do a quick sear. FYI. The CG 980 will go from 200*-700* degrees for searing, so yes, you can grill and sear on it as well. Wow.. You are correct.. The price did jump up.. I guess due to inflation, the Winter holidays being over and everyone trying to get back to normal life, pre-Covid. Smh.. The Lowes where I bought mines from even through in a free grill cover. If you’re thinking is the CG 980 worth $750.00?? My honest answer is yes. If theses were available 4-5 years ago, I would have never bought a pellet smoker. They’re that good. FYI. Lowes will assemble them for free and deliver them to your home. I also believe, if you are a Military Veteran, they will discount the CG 980 as well. Funny, thinking back, I think the Salesman did give me a Military Vets discount. .02.. Never hurts to take a look at one in person , kick the wheels and talk to a knowledgeable Sales person. Good luck.



__________________

Char-Griller 980 GF… Pellet Pro Austin XL and a few more mods... In SoCal and Always... Semper Fi

 

[BrianGSDTexoma]

I just did the Auber mod on my MES40 and using the mailbox. My thing is I really miss the smoke ring. I know not suppose to change taste but I cant get by it. I have several other smokers so not an issue for me but I like the idea of a kettle with that low and sear thing.

 

[Winterrider]

Considered to be TBS
MES 40 Exhaust fully opened.
Mailbox Mod is copycat of daveomak with the vent holes. Can tape up if needed in windy conditions. Usually use dust as the smoke isn't as pronounced.

 

[denny]

Sir, I hate to say it, but I think that you have to accept that there is no reproducing stick burner flavor, or TBS, in your cooks on electric smokers. You are trading off the real wood burner taste and feel for time, effort, and convenience. I do not believe that any amount of MODs or different techniques will ever get the same smoke or flavor that you remember or get from your stick burner. I think it's probably better to reframe your desired results, in smoke and cooks, to fit the realities of your MES. Life forced me to stop the offset for a few years and I went the MES, then Traeger route. My family and friends like the results, and my wife likes having me available to help around the house, but every now and then she says "It was better on your other smoker," and of course I know she is right. To reduce your frustrations, I think it's better to ID a realistic goal for the results you want in the MES and use that as the standard. Your MES (or any electric smoker) will never replace the stick burner, but that is OK, you can still get good results and have fun!

Thank you for taking the time to reply--I appreciate it

 

[denny]

Geek out

A Material Perspective of Wood, Smoke, and BBQ

For those of us who have attempted to barbecue (BBQ), wood matters. Smoking delicious meats is effectively a chemical process that involves control ov…

www.sciencedirect.com

Thank you for the detailed report--a welcome addition to my collection. I like that it points out the effects of high vs low temps--naming 650 to 750* as more ideal. We are faced everywhere with choices of variabilities and without the luxury of an anointed path!

 

[denny]

I am at a similar cross road, I have a Smokey Hollow (older MES type) with a pid and use pellets. While it does decent work I know it is not the same as using real wood. I don't have the time now to start and learn on a real stick burner. I am mulling over a Weber kettle as I some really great cooks shown on here. It might take a little more time to tend even with a PID but I think it might be worth it?

I know what you mean very well. If I don't make enough advancement at least I can go back to charcoal/wood. I know nothing about kettles but I am firmly with you on the PID! Wood and pellet smoke definitely aren't equal--we simply need to make up our minds when we've had enough and make our change!

 

[normanaj]

If you want tbs with your MES use dust in an Amazen tray/tube. All you need is a quality bag of pellets like Lumberjack and a blender.

 

[BurntWeenie]

" A good pitmaster thus controls the inefficiency of combustion, and inefficiency tastes delicious. "

Also our brains our programmed from years of eating fire cooked food etc. So what is a good smoke flavor is all relative

 

[denny]

I'm in a similar but different situation. I cannot have a stick burner in my neighborhood. The city restricts potentially sparking grills to 25ft from any tree or house. I'm not walking out 25ft from the house to grill. So, I have a gas smoker, and gas grill.

I'm in the process of adding a mailbox mod and trying to get the smoke correct, and I'm not sure what I'm looking for. I don't know if I have ever seen TBS. I asked an administrator if we can see the images from the members that were awarded OTBS, the rules say they have to submit them, but they don't seem to be available for some reason.

What would be really good is a thread on TBS and have people post their pictures so we have a reference. Also we could understand what people have done to get closer. Maybe it should be a complete forum, all we do here depends on this smoke.

I have sympathy for you because of city ordinances. Yeah, TBS has the stuff of gold at the rainbow's end. There are so many pro's on here with sustained excellent results that it seems the technique could be documented and reproducible. Maybe we are getting it at least part of the time? I'm all for your idea of something like a complete forum. And now that's mentioned, I would benefit from FAQs about how to do things on here since I've never found such help! Hope springs eternal!

 

[denny]

I highly recommend the Kettle. I've always had one, at least one, and you can't beat the results. That being said, I still don't think it replicates a good stick burner. It has its own unique flavor and texture results, just like each cooking technique/kit, and I personally think it's better for cooking may things better than an electric. It is absolutely my primary go to for any bird with skin and wings or direct like steaks, burgers, etc. I use the MES (mailbox mod) for cold smoke and Traeger for whole muscle hunks that will take longer than a few hours. I think that the kettle is a pretty invaluable capability to have and a few mods that improve are relatively cheap (vortex, gourmet grate, etc).

I don't know anything about kettles other than they have an impeccable reputation and enormous following in the BBQ community. I guess I feel somewhat similar about my Good Ones (charcoal/wood burning). Different strokes for different folks!

 

[denny]

Considered to be TBS
MES 40 Exhaust fully opened.
Mailbox Mod is copycat of daveomak with the vent holes. Can tape up if needed in windy conditions. Usually use dust as the smoke isn't as pronounced.
View attachment 527306

Sorry to be so late in acknowledging, but this week has been disorganized, beginning with my wife's retirement on Monday. Adjustment has only just begun!.
That is a beautiful property and smoker. I'm envious! You say you usually use dust as the smoke isn't as pronounced; to confirm, do you mean the smoke flavor isn't as pronounced with dust as with pellets? I have yet to use dust but am definitely going to check it out. I feel I may be getting TBS more often than I think because I'm simply not sure of how it SHOULD appear. I'm trying to narrow down the variables, such as changing brands and burning dust. Thanks for your comments!

 

[BrianGSDTexoma]

wife's retirement

Congrats for her. Been a year and have no time for that job stuff now. To much other stuff to do.