MES 30 Temperature fluctuations and using a floor tile

[danbury]

I know that it's the nature of the beast for the temperature to fluctuate on these electric smokers when the heat kicks on and off. My temperature seems to go up a good 15+ degrees when the element starts heating up. I'm trying to maintain a 175 temperature and it will shoot up to 185 -190. I have read dozens and dozens of threads and have noticed where some are putting a "tile" in the smoker and I'm assuming it is to help a little bit. There are ceramic, marble, glass, etc.... tile. If I choose to try this, what kind of tile should I use and I assume unglazed would be the what I would go with. Those of you that have done this, what is your opinion on where the tile should be placed? High or Low? Any information on this as well as anything else to try and reduce the amount of fluctuation would greatly be appreciated.

I'm using a Therm Pro thermometer and it has been tested for accuracy. I have a mailbox mod set up.

 

[daveomak]

Do NOT put a tile in your MES 30.... It will cause the lower portion to overheat... There are essential electronics below the floor of the smoker.... You could "smoke" those electronics as they overheat....

 

[chopsaw]

I've used a piece of aluminum foil on the bottom rack just over the element ( not the whole rack ) to deflect the heat to the left side of the smoker .

 

[Jonok]

Not to be contentious, but I have been putting things on the bottom rack of all the Masterbuilts I have owned for the last 10 years, (full-sized aluminum steam table pans, cookie sheets, cookie sheets full of sand, 1/4” stainless plates cut to replace the bottom rack etc, and the only thing I ever “smoked” that I didn’t intend to, was the left side power wire to the element. (3 times and counting). The other failure that was common to all of them was the inside wall around the chip loader hole rusting to various degrees. With my current mod, I have 40 or so 12hr+ cooks, and no rust to be seen. With added thermal mass, the temp stability is much better, as is the recovery time.

As many of the MES guys here have no doubt experienced, loading chips every 20-30 minutes into the stock tray will often result in an actual fire starting down around the element (due to the charred chips being knocked out of the tray when loading fresh ones) which has to be a heck of a lot more deleterious to any electronics than sticking a 12x12 ceramic floor tile, or a couple of bricks on the bottom rack, and using an alternative smoke generator such as I have, or an Amazen tray.

 

[daveomak]

Not to be contentious, but I have been putting things on the bottom rack of all the Masterbuilts I have owned for the last 10 years, (full-sized aluminum steam table pans, cookie sheets, cookie sheets full of sand, 1/4” stainless plates cut to replace the bottom rack etc, and the only thing I ever “smoked” that I didn’t intend to, was the left side power wire to the element. (3 times and counting). The other failure that was common to all of them was the inside wall around the chip loader hole rusting to various degrees. With my current mod, I have 40 or so 12hr+ cooks, and no rust to be seen. With added thermal mass, the temp stability is much better, as is the recovery time.

As many of the MES guys here have no doubt experienced, loading chips every 20-30 minutes into the stock tray will often result in an actual fire starting down around the element (due to the charred chips being knocked out of the tray when loading fresh ones) which has to be a heck of a lot more deleterious to any electronics than sticking a 12x12 ceramic floor tile, or a couple of bricks on the bottom rack, and using an alternative smoke generator such as I have, or an Amazen tray.

You could just say, "You don't know what you are talking about" ...

 

[chopsaw]

You could just say, "You don't know what you are talking about" ..

Most would know , that's not true .

 

[Jonok]

Hey, I’m new around here, and if I’m going to opine differently than guys that have been contributing a lot longer than I have, I’m going to do my best to explain why.
It wasn’t my intention to come across as a jerk, please don’t take it as such.

 

[daveomak]

Read this....

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/30-mes-burned-up-my-fault.241141/
..

 

[Jonok]

I appreciate the response and the link.

All of the MESs that I have owned have had (stock) a hood covering the chip tray, as well as the tray itself directly over the heating element. The bottom rack is a couple inches above all of that.
Searching this forum, as well as the internet in general, there are many reports of insulation melting, but they are maddeningly inconsistent.
I would agree that completely isolating the element from the rest of the cabinet would create a potential for local overheating. That being said, I wonder if what happened in these cases was not related to either a primary failure of the overheat protection device, or to a situation where the (inadequate) drip/water pan overflowed, and, rather than just exiting the bottom tray through the drain into the externally removable drip container, it actually made its way through the joint between the inner liner and the floor of the smoker and caught fire there.
As you are no doubt aware, there were a couple of recalls related to issues with the chip loader overflowing and catching fire causing the door to blow open, but the insulation primarily failing seems fairly sporadic.

 

[daveomak]

The overheat protection device is well up on the wall.... It won't do anything if you "partially" cover the heating element.... You should investigate your assumptions prior to submitting your thesis..
(Thesis definition, a proposition stated or put forward for consideration, especially one to be discussed and proved or to be maintained against objections: He vigorously defended his thesis ....)
I like the way you are trying to cover your butt for being 'informative"... Soon, if you continue covering, we won't be able to see or hear you...

 

[danbury]

Well I appreciate all the information here and didn't mean for this to apparently go downhill. I gleaned enough info. Thanks all for the input. I'm out.

 

[Jonok]

I know exactly where the overheat protection device is, as well as the cabinet temp sensor.
I’m not trying to “cover my butt”, rather, I am trying to determine just how, exactly, someone would burn down his smoker by putting something on the bottom rack that did not impede airflow to either the OPD or the temp sensor.
I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve heard: “I’ve been doing that my whole life, and this never happened before”, so I take what you say seriously. I am in no way attempting to discredit what you’ve brought to the discussion, rather, I am trying to figure out just what resulted in a poor outcome when someone did something that, in my experience, (admittedly a small N, but more than just a single anecdote) resulted in an improvement.

 

[chopsaw]

Well I appreciate all the information here and didn't mean for this to apparently go downhill. I gleaned enough info. Thanks all for the input. I'm out.

Well , hang on a minute . I just want to make sure you got an answer or idea at least from what you had asked .
Not sure what smoker you have ( maybe I missed it ) but for a MES that temp swing really isn't to bad in my opinion .
What are you trying to smoke at that temp SS ? When people start blocking heat flow or " tricking " sensors , it can be dangerous . One time it might get hot enough to start just a small corner of the foam to turn black . Next time a little more . Then one day , fire . You think It's related to that last cook , but has been coming on for awhile .
Anyway ,, if you have more questions please ask .

 

[tom987]

Dave I have found several of your comments to be arrogant and cocky. If anyone contradicts you you take it personal, as if your word is straight from the Bible its self. You may be a wealth of knowledge but most of the time I’d rather not read it due to your delivery.

 

[danbury]

I'm an old UDS user that can't use one any more due to the restrictions where we live now. I'm learning the ropes on this MES 30 and although I personally think it does not even come close to a UDS in results, it's what I have to use. At this point I do not know what is an acceptable/unacceptable temperature swing.
I found an article from Bear that will help a lot.
My set up is a mailbox mod with an AMZN tray using dust. That part is working out good. Like I said, I've gleaned enough info for now to be aware of certain things. Thanks.

 

[dr k]

I flipped the element to get the heating part of the element in open air so it doesn't roast the right rear corner. The whole element is safe from drips and the PID controller sensor is up next to the food so I'm not blocking air to it. I make sure grease on the back wall stays off the non heating element legs that go into the back of the smoker. The outer element jacket has a seam on the underside so water and grease can get in and short to ground. There's plenty of space around the 11x15 aluminum baking sheet for heat to rise to the sensor more so than the slant tray with the hanging water pan in the Mes Gen 2s. Kinda like my kitchen oven. Sliding the baking sheet left or right a rung or so gets even temps left to right. If i still had the stcck setup/contoller in my Gen 1 I wouldn't block the right rear corner to move heat left (way too hot for the insulation.) The Gen 1 has a sloped bottom drip tray so there's a decent air space between it and the floor of the smoker so that's a little insulation that other Mes don't have on the bottom. Not much grease misses the smaller baking sheet/drip pan so I foil over the hole in the bottom tray to the rear drain and put it in backwards so the grease if any moves towards the door away from under the element. The rear outside drain to the grease catch is capped so all air comes in through the mailbox mod. The newly released 400 series Mes has an open element that is more centered plus the top two vents to even the heat left or right. It takes 20 minutes or so to preheat the smoker to 275 everytime I use it to sterilize it and when you open It up to put in food you may have to set your controller to 165 so it shuts off and coasts to 175 and reset the controller to 175 when it gets there with using the OEM controller/sensor.

 

[chopsaw]

t takes 20 minutes or so to preheat the smoker to 275 everytime I use it to sterilize it and when you open It up to put in food you may have to set your controller to 165 so it shuts off and coasts to 175 and rest the controller to 175 when it gets there .

danbury , Thats good info from Dr. K

 

[dr k]

Since mine is a Gen 1 40 and not the 30 as in this thread I need to do more work for even heating left to right which is not really needed in the 30. I've never tried sand, brick, heat sink objects to avoid drastic over/under swings from the hysteresis of basic on/off controllers but over time they naturally shorten. With a 30 I'd try heat sinks without blocking heat to see what it does or nothing or modding the Oem control like daveomak Rheostat or getting a PID.

 

[danbury]

I'm going to put my drip pan on the right side. There's already the shield and water pan (I don't use water) over the element. Will just adjust my routine accordingly.

 

[daveomak]

Masterbuilt Manual

Page 23
23• Pre-heat smoker for 30 to 45 minutes at desired cooking temperature before loading food.• DO NOT cover racks with aluminum foil as this will not allow heat to circulate properly. • Do not overload smoker with food. Extra large amounts of food may trap heat, extend cooking time and cause uneven cooking. Leave space between food on racks and smoker sides to ensure proper heat circulation. If utilizing cooking pans, place pans on center of rack to ensure even cooking.• Do not open smoker door unless necessary. Opening smoker door causes heat to escape, may extend cooking time, and may cause wood chips to flare up. Closing the door will re-stabilize the temperature and stop flare up.• There will be a lot of smoke produced when using wood chips. Smoke will escape through seams and turn the inside of smoker black. This is normal. To minimize smoke loss around door, the door latch can be adjusted to further tighten the door seal against the body.• To adjust door latch, loosen hex nut on door latch. Turn hook clockwise to tighten as shown. Secure hex nut firmly against door latch (see diagram).• Check grease tray often during cooking. Empty grease tray before it gets full. Grease tray may need to be emptied periodically during cooking.