First Time Brisket

[JBCWCHS06]

Might be a bit of a long post but just got a pellet smoker and got asked to try to smoke a 17 lb brisket for a party. Got as much of the fat as I could off along with the silver skin. Threw some rub on it Thursday night to sit overnight and threw it on my smoker Friday at 5 PM. Followed the cooking instructions from The Dawgfather BBQ through the first 4 to 5 hours. Then waited for it to get to around 170 before wrapping. Sprayed down the Reynolds Wrap with my beef broth that I was using as a spritz throughout but when I went to wrap it the paper didn't seem big enough so took it off and when I did some of the bark came with it. So on the fly decided to try the foil boat method from Chuds and it finally got to 205 around 5 AM. So I let it cool down and used Chuds method to cool it down by putting it a oven at 170 for about 6 hours and then let it cool down to 150 before cutting. It cut well at first but then started to shred the deeper I got into and the bottom seemed a bit tough and the bark seemed a bit tough to cut through as well. So with people with alot more knowledge then me what did I do wrong and what could I do differently next time because I've been asked to attempt another one next weekend for another party

 

[gmc2003]

Welcome aboard. I'm not familiar with Chud or his method - sorry. Since your brisket started to shred, it sounds like it may have been a little over done, or maybe it was shredding because of the thick bark. I don't spritz, but I think that may be causing your bark to get harder then normal. Also are you cutting against the grain or with it. Briskets aren't done by time or temp. They're just measuring tools to inform us where they are in the cooking stage. When they probe tender(like a knife going thru butter) then they're done.

Chris

 

[SmokinEdge]

Welcome aboard!

Chris makes some good points. I’ll add that pellet cookers are notoriously known for that hard bark on the bottom. This is because of the fire pot being in the center of the grate and it gets hot there. Solution is to cook on an elevated rack, get the low slow meat up off that lower grate. Also when I had one of the pellet machines built that way, I would smoke bare on the grate for about 5 hours then into a foil pan with some liquid and cover with foil. This and elevating to a second shelf makes a huge difference.

Most pellet grills are just that,,,,, a grill, it take some small modifications to make a good slow cooker. That’s why I bought a Yoder 640, most of the mods are already done for slow and low bbq.

 

[JBCWCHS06]

Chris the methods I borrowed from Chud was a foil boat when it hits the stale along with cooling it down in the foil boat on a pan in the oven after you pull it and it reaches around 170 and turning the oven down to 170. I was just scared that maybe putting it in the oven that the bottom kind of continued to cook because I couldn't get it below 170. I'll try to calm down on the spritzing I just wanted to prevent it from drying out. I could've been not cutting against the grain either didn't have a good method to see the way the grain was running. I also cooked it fat cap down so the fat cap was closer to the heat to render down but switched it meat side down when it went in the foil boat. What's the method to be able to really tell a brisket is done because I'm scared that it could feel soft and be probe tender because the fat cap being squishy but the meat maybe not being done. What do you suggest to do to add a rack thats a little higher then the grates in a somewhat small pellet smoker. Thanks for the help really enjoy smoking and wanna start nailing something

 

[Coreymacc]

I don't have a lot of brisket experience but did you probe in the thickest part of the flat for tender? It sounds like it may have needed a bit longer to get probe tender in the thick part.

My 2 cents
Corey

 

[JBCWCHS06]

I don't have a lot of brisket experience but did you probe in the thickest part of the flat for tender? It sounds like it may have needed a bit longer to get probe tender in the thick part.

My 2 cents
Corey

I actually probed in a couple of places. It seemed to me honestly that it could've been overcooked because it was shredding but then the bottom seemed chewy like it got dried out.

 

[912smoker]

Was it covered during the rest ?

Keith

 

[millerbuilds]

Chris and SmokinEdge make great points. While I don't use a pellet grill, I have never done a cool down in the oven. I always wrap mine with beach towels and let them set in a cooler for at least 2 hours. Once I pull from the cooler I let it sit on my cutting board for another 15 - 20 minutes before cutting. I quit cooking whole briskets a few years ago, I now always separate the point from the flat and cook, they tend to get done a different times and by separating them I can manage better consistency. The only time I check IT is when I am looking for the stall, after that the thermometer gets washed and put away and I bring the box of toothpicks out to the pit.

Good luck on your next one!

Smoke ON!
- Jason

 

[JBCWCHS06]

Was it covered during the rest ?

Keith

No I left the foil boat on it but that's all. Next time I'm going to try to a cooler or just let it cool at room temperature for an hour and cut it I'm cooking it a day before I need it next time anyway

 

[JBCWCHS06]

I'm

Chris and SmokinEdge make great points. While I don't use a pellet grill, I have never done a cool down in the oven. I always wrap mine with beach towels and let them set in a cooler for at least 2 hours. Once I pull from the cooler I let it sit on my cutting board for another 15 - 20 minutes before cutting. I quit cooking whole briskets a few years ago, I now always separate the point from the flat and cook, they tend to get done a different times and by separating them I can manage better consistency. The only time I check IT is when I am looking for the stall, after that the thermometer gets washed and put away and I bring the box of toothpicks out to the pit.

Good luck on your next one!

Smoke ON!
- Jason

I'm going to try to figure out some way to elevate the meat away farther from the cooking surface on my next cook and try that method to cool it down. I'm almost tempted to separate them as well that seems like it would make it a little easier. And I'm going to try to not rely on my thermometer next time only thing I'm worried about is the fat might feel soft but the meat not be done

 

[Coreymacc]

Maybe the boat method allowed too much steam around the meat and dried it a bit?

I have been reading lately about having loose wrap and causing issues.

As far as finding your flat grain, i had to truss up my brisket because it was thin in the flat, the butchers twine made it easy to find my direction. I think im gonna tie one piece around my briskets from now on to use as a cutting guide. Like i said, no expert so im gonna cheat where ever i can.

Corey

 

[JBCWCHS06]

Maybe the boat method allowed too much steam around the meat and dried it a bit?

I have been reading lately about having loose wrap and causing issues.

As far as finding your flat grain, i had to truss up my brisket because it was thin in the flat, the butchers twine made it easy to find my direction. I think im gonna tie one piece around my briskets from now on to use as a cutting guide. Like i said, no expert so im gonna cheat where ever i can.

Corey

Yeah I'm thinking the foil boat method along with keeping it in the oven for a while at 170 to keep it warm before I cut it dried it out. Think I'll use that trick to remember the way the grain goes or maybe I'll take a picture of it before I do anything to it. Got some tricks I'm going to try on my next brisket. The biggest thing I'm having trouble with is figuring out a way to get it a little higher off the heat my smoker is small and only has the burn pot then a plate to block the flame and then the grates.

 

[gmc2003]

Chris the methods I borrowed from Chud was a foil boat when it hits the stale along with cooling it down in the foil boat on a pan in the oven after you pull it and it reaches around 170 and turning the oven down to 170. I was just scared that maybe putting it in the oven that the bottom kind of continued to cook because I couldn't get it below 170. I'll try to calm down on the spritzing I just wanted to prevent it from drying out. I could've been not cutting against the grain either didn't have a good method to see the way the grain was running. I also cooked it fat cap down so the fat cap was closer to the heat to render down but switched it meat side down when it went in the foil boat. What's the method to be able to really tell a brisket is done because I'm scared that it could feel soft and be probe tender because the fat cap being squishy but the meat maybe not being done. What do you suggest to do to add a rack thats a little higher then the grates in a somewhat small pellet smoker. Thanks for the help really enjoy smoking and wanna start nailing something

Ok, lets see. I have my own thoughts on this one. Others may not agree with me, but hey there's more than one way to skin a cat(oh god flashbacks back to my anatomy and physiology class in college). First using a disposable aluminum foil pan is fine when wrapping. I used to do it myself. However when I did do it I put a smallish rack in the pan and set the brisket on the rack. That way the brisket wouldn't sit in any of its' juices. Wrapping with the pan was also quicker for me then wrapping in aluminum foil only. Meaning the brisket was back on the smoker quicker.

When you pulled your brisket and put it in the foil boat. I'm assuming that it's same as being fully wrapped. If that's the case then feel free to cook at a higher temp then 170*. I'd jump the temp up to 250 to 300*. Your not gaining anything by cooking it slow in the oven.

I'm not a believer in spritzing. I really don't think it's helping at all when it come to keeping the meat moist. The moisture comes from the collagen melting away. Spritzing will keep the outside moist which will allow for more smoke to adhere. Everytime you open your smokers door your adding time to the cook. With a pellet smoker that may not be much, but it's still there.

Fat cap up or fat cap done is an ongoing discussion that has no real answer. With your heat source under the brisket you did fine. That's how I would have done it.

When you probe for tenderness. Probe multiple times in multiple parts of the flat. A good temp to start probing is around 195*. The brisket probably won't be done but you'll have a good idea of where it's at.

i prefer to cook briskets whole. They just seem to be moister when I do them that way. When the flat is done. The point will basically separate itself from the flat or tell you where to separate them.

Cutting against the grain. You'll need to look at the brisket when it raw. You'll see the grains. Either make a mental note or put a toothpick or some type of mark that reminds you. Flat and point grains run differently from each other.

I'm not big on holding brisket unless it's traveling somewhere. I'll cook it until it's done and let it rest on the counter wrapped until it hit 170*. For us that's a good serving temp. It it's traveling that also a good temp to put it in a cooler surrounded by towels to keep it hot without overcooking.

I think I hit most of your questions.

Chris

 

[JBCWCHS06]

Ok, lets see. I have my own thoughts on this one. Others may not agree with me, but hey there's more than one way to skin a cat(oh god flashbacks back to my anatomy and physiology class in college). First using a disposable aluminum foil pan is fine when wrapping. I used to do it myself. However when I did do it I put a smallish rack in the pan and set the brisket on the rack. That way the brisket wouldn't sit in any of its' juices. Wrapping with the pan was also quicker for me then wrapping in aluminum foil only. Meaning the brisket was back on the smoker quicker.

When you pulled your brisket and put it in the foil boat. I'm assuming that it's same as being fully wrapped. If that's the case then feel free to cook at a higher temp then 170*. I'd jump the temp up to 250 to 300*. Your not gaining anything by cooking it slow in the oven.

I'm not a believer in spritzing. I really don't think it's helping at all when it come to keeping the meat moist. The moisture comes from the collagen melting away. Spritzing will keep the outside moist which will allow for more smoke to adhere. Everytime you open your smokers door your adding time to the cook. With a pellet smoker that may not be much, but it's still there.

Fat cap up or fat cap done is an ongoing discussion that has no real answer. With your heat source under the brisket you did fine. That's how I would have done it.

When you probe for tenderness. Probe multiple times in multiple parts of the flat. A good temp to start probing is around 195*. The brisket probably won't be done but you'll have a good idea of where it's at.

i prefer to cook briskets whole. They just seem to be moister when I do them that way. When the flat is done. The point will basically separate itself from the flat or tell you where to separate them.

Cutting against the grain. You'll need to look at the brisket when it raw. You'll see the grains. Either make a mental note or put a toothpick or some type of mark that reminds you. Flat and point grains run differently from each other.

I'm not big on holding brisket unless it's traveling somewhere. I'll cook it until it's done and let it rest on the counter wrapped until it hit 170*. For us that's a good serving temp. It it's traveling that also a good temp to put it in a cooler surrounded by towels to keep it hot without overcooking.

I think I hit most of your questions.

Chris

You did hit on some points that are very helpful. I'm starting to hone in on some stuff I want to try on my next cook definitely not spritzing it is one of the big things I will hold off on doing. I cooked it at 225 to 250 the whole time I actually kept it in the oven at 170 to try to keep it warm think they hurt my brisket alot. Yeah think I'm going to go fat cap down again but figure out some way to put a rack above my grates to lift it away from the heat a bit more. Going to definitely not check the temp until I think it's getting closer this time. Thinking of taking a picture of the brisket raw to see the grain. And just going to let it cool down to that temp and slice it this time as well instead of holding it

 

[912smoker]

I am certainly no expert but do cook a fair amount of brisket.
I've never used to boat method and wrap in paper now that it's available in my area. I also use beef fallow in the paper and a brisket mop.
The long hold @170 by Chud( or at least the one that I saw)was on a paper wrapped brisket. The paper allowed the top to retain all of the moisture produced from the cook.
Big difference vs an unwrapped being held .
I have a hard time to with the grain and now put a slice in the flat, while trimming, for reference . That's one of the MANY great tips I've learned here at SMF.
You can see it on the lower right.

I am with Chris and start checking for tenderness around 195 IT. Each piece of meat is different and each grade will cook differently. The last prime I cooked was probe tender at 197. Choice is usually 203-205 in my experience.
Good luck , keep cooking and take notes on each cook for reference !

Keith

 

[JBCWCHS06]

Thanks everyone for the help honestly it's greatly appreciated and I've taken notes and already have some different steps I'm going to try on my next cook which will be this weekend. Now I do have a question for everyone you guys talk about checking for probe tenderness around 195 is that just something you know from cooking alot of brisket or do you leave a thermometer in the brisket while it cooks

 

[Coreymacc]

I start probing at 195 but have also heard to start at 190. Personally i think 190 is a little low, i ive never heard of a brisket probe tender below 195. Plus i use butcher paper and if i start probing at 190 im gonna poke way to many holes. I do use the same prope hole more than once but it kind of mangles the meat at the probe point. Last weekends brisket probe tender at 203.

All my opinion
Corey

 

[RME]

Hi, just joined and don't make a lot of brisket as don't often have that many people by. My results have mostly been underwhelming - flat top dry and point too fatty. But the last two worked out really well. So much so that our neighbors's mum, visiting from St Louis and a big fan of Joe's brisket, said mine was not quite there but close.

This is what worked for me. One big change from previous briskets is using an indirect heat gravity charcoal grill, loaded with a mixture of charcoal and wood chunks. Previously had used cheap offset smoker (could never make it work very well) and a kettle grill with a Slow N Sear (worked much better than cheap offset but wanted fully automated temperature control).

I start with USDA prime full brisket trimmed to about 1/4" fat with salt and pepper rub 24 hours before. A fillet knife is useful for trimming. I also inject with beef bone stock but am not sure it's necessary. I have a Char-Griller 980 - which has its own annoyances - but it is indirect heat. Pellet grills are direct heat so you may want to use a pan full of water or sand under the brisket to deflect the heat (or under any other thing that is cooked at low temperature for a long time).

Render the trimmed fat by covering in water in a sauce pan and cooking at very low simmer until there are a few crispy bits, then strain into a jar and refrigerate.

I use a leave in Bluetooth thermometer. If you haven't bought a remote thermometer yet, consider a WiFi one. It costs more but will work anywhere and the maker can push firmware updates. Bluetooth was always meant for a short range and as it's not connected to internet no firmware updates. My Bluetooth thermometer drops if I go inside, which is not ideal when cooking outdoors during an upstate New York winter.

But to think of it, not sure what firmware updates a thermometer might need.

It smokes at 225F for maybe 6 to 8 hours until internal temperature reaches 150 to 160F. At about 140F start checking with a digital instant read thermometer. The leave-in thermometer may not reflect true temperature as the probe is inside cook chamber.

Melt the beef fat you rendered, baste the brisket with the fat, then wrap in butcher paper at 150 to 160F. I have been wrapping in tin foil and sometimes the brisket comes out tasting a bit like pot roast. A bit of research suggests that one cause of that may be that the brisket more or less braises in the sealed tin foil as opposed to having some airflow using the butcher paper. Butcher paper is also better at preserving the bark.

Am also not sure basting with beef fat is necessary, but it is a part of my current process and if something works I am reluctant to experiment.

Cook to 190 to 200F. I like the point and flat sliced, so don't want to cook the point until it's at a pulled pork consistentcy. I have only used prime so don't have experience with choice, but research suggests prime can come off the smoker at a bit lower temperature than choice.

People that make a lot of brisket will say they can tell it's done by poking or prodding it. I don't make enough brisket to be able to tell that way.

Then put it in a warmed cooler for an hour or four. First, people seem to agree it needs to rest for a good final result. Second, the brisket can then be served whenever people show up and are already eat. As BBQ is done when it's done and a brisket smoked at 225F may take 7 or 8 hours or it may take 12 or 14 hours. On more than one occasion I have had people drop by for slow cooked BBQ, hang out with drinks and appetizers until long after I said dinner would be done, and then finally leave without eating as dinner still wasn't done.

People who have been drinking for a few hours without eating tend to get cranky and a bit mean, and unsympathetic to statements like "BBQ is done when it's done! Have some more Cheetos..."

Finally unwrap. I put mine on a gas grill preheated to super high for a few minutes a side to crisp the bark, but I don't think it's necessary.

How it is sliced is important. I am not skilled enough to find and sperate flat and point. So I start with point - easy to identify - slicing thinly at right angles (could also say "orthogonal to" as I about never get a chance to use that word) to the brisket's long side centerline. At some point (pun intended...) you will notice the texture and directiction for the brisket's grain change. You have found the flat. Change slicing angle so you continue to slice across the grain.

For same slicing reason, turkey or chicken breasts are much better when removed from carcass and sliced against grain, as opposed to carving with the grain on the carcass.

Finally, note a lot of people like to smoke point and flat separately. If you are like me and have no butcher skills, just go to a real butcher shop to buy the brisket and ask the butcher to separate -grocery store butchers generally won't do that. I have not smoked them separately, but it is probably easier to get a reproducibly good result that way.

I hope this was helpful.