ELECTRICAL QUESTION

[Slow42]

I found some dryer heaters for cheap but they are 240 volts and about 5000 watts. I only have 120 volts, 15 amps, available. Can I install this and run at 120 volts? Would it be half the 5000 watts or 2500 watts at 120 volts. Want to use element to build a small smoker. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

 

[mosparky]

Without running you thru a bunch of ohms law equations, the short answer is it will be about 1250 watts and pull about 10.5 amps at 120 volts. (if I did the math right, been a long time since school)

 

[tx smoker]

No, you CANNOT run this on a 120 volt circuit. It is designed to run On 220 and you'll constantly have the breaker trip to the point that it will not reset. The element is going to pull whatever power it's designed to run on, which is 220 volts and 30 amps. My suggestion is to look for a heating element for something like an MES smoker that is designed to run on 120 (it's actually 110) and implement that into whatever you're trying to do. Additionally if you try running a device that requires 2x the power that you have available, you are at a high risk of causing an electrical fire. To run a 220 volt heating element you need a minimum of 30 amps as well as the designated voltage. In the infamous words of Robin Williams: Not a good idea baby!!

Don't do it!!
Robert

 

[eddiememphis]

It depends on how the heater is wired internally. There are likely two elements in it and at different wattages so that you can have different heat levels- Low, Medium and High.

Regardless, running a 240 volt circuit on half the voltage will use a lot of power and likely still not get up to its running temp. The maximum on a 15 amp breaker for a long time (longer than an hour or so) is about 1500 watts. This may still be too much for your wiring, outlets and breakers.

There are easier and much safer ways to build a smoker.

 

[Slow42]

Thanks all, I understand the limitations of 120 volts and 15 amps of power to an outlet, at best 1500 watts under ideal circumstances. But the element is only going to operate at the amount of energy its feed. I’m thinking. So will to work? Don’t know. I will be using a PID controller in whatever method I chose. My first choice is still the hot plate, 1200 watts.

 

[atomicsmoke]

Assuming they are pure resistive elements (power factor 1) they would have an impedance of 11.52ohm. Which means they will draw 10.41A at 120V so you are good on a 15A circuit. Power will be 1250W.

Show my work like high school: impedance is =V2/P=240*240/5000=11.52ohm. Current with a 120V supply is V/Z=120/11.52=10.41A. Power at 120V supply is V*I=120*10.41=1250W.

 

[atomicsmoke]

No, you CANNOT run this on a 120 volt circuit. It is designed to run On 220 and you'll constantly have the breaker trip to the point that it will not reset. The element is going to pull whatever power it's designed to run on, which is 220 volts and 30 amps. My suggestion is to look for a heating element for something like an MES smoker that is designed to run on 120 (it's actually 110) and implement that into whatever you're trying to do. Additionally if you try running a device that requires 2x the power that you have available, you are at a high risk of causing an electrical fire. To run a 220 volt heating element you need a minimum of 30 amps as well as the designated voltage. In the infamous words of Robin Williams: Not a good idea baby!!

Don't do it!!
Robert

Thats not how electricity works.

 

[daveomak]

Get an element from a toaster oven or dish washer... Something that runs on 120V... a counter top single burner works too...

 

[Steve H]

I haven't seen a dual wattage element on a dryer in a long time. But if it has more then 2 wires going to it. Then some resistance readings will be needed to determine how you'll hook it up. If it just has two connections. Then you should see around 1200 watts.

 

[Slow42]

This was the dryer type element I was referring to. Its a 240 volt 5400 watt. It has the two tabs for attaching power wires like the other smoker elements I’ve seen. These are only about $15.00 and quite small. This would be simple to install. So will something like this work?

 

[atomicsmoke]

This was the dryer type element I was referring to. Its a 240 volt 5400 watt. It has the two tabs for attaching power wires like the other smoker elements I’ve seen. These are only about $15.00 and quite small. This would be simple to install. So will something like this work?


View attachment 408766

I dont see why not. Pay close attention to mating connectors to ensure proper connection and the mount/insulation to prevent shock hazards. I am assuming this is for an outdoor rig. Don't forget sbout moisture, rain and snow.

 

[daveomak]

Those elements are installed in the duct from the fan... They require tons of air flow, to keep them cool, so they won't burn up... A Calrod heating element has a coating to keep it from burning up in air... If you may have noticed, elements in your oven and small smokers all use Calrod heating elements...

 

[Slow42]

Thanks daveomak never considered the air flow thing and I didn’t know what oven etc. heating elements are made from. Regardless what element I use I need some high temperature wire to lead from element out of the smoker to a cord. Any idea what type wire/gauge that would be? I found a lot of 200c wire but that’s not high enough temperature. I would think the minimum would to around 1000c.

 

[daveomak]

As long as the wire is rated for the amp draw, no problem.... The wire doesn't get hot from the element... The heat start an inch or 2 from the connection as it starts passing through the element... The farther from the connection, the hotter the element gets until there's a balance of amps and resistance... If you look at a heating element on your stove, it's never hot where it connects....

 

[Steve H]

Those elements are installed in the duct from the fan... They require tons of air flow, to keep them cool, so they won't burn up... A Calrod heating element has a coating to keep it from burning up in air... If you may have noticed, elements in your oven and small smokers all use Calrod heating elements...

I didn't think about that. You are correct.

 

[Slow42]

Daveomak I was more concerned about the wires in the smoking chamber itself. Most smokers have the element installed in the wall so the wires are on the outside. I was just going to place the element in the chamber not through the wall. When people use a hot plate, still an option, wires must be exposed to the inner temperatures of the smoke correct? Don’t want burning wire smoke in my meats

 

[daveomak]

I installed the element on the inside... See pictures in the article below...

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/a...ent-for-colder-climates-and-hot-smoking.9579/

 

[nchapelheel]

here is another way....search the web for some Nichrome wire. This is the same
stuff used in old toasters. Get a small auto-transformer so that the voltage can
be adjusted to control the actual heat from the wire. It is essential that the wire
and connections to it be isolated from anything around the wires.
Recap: destroy an old toaster or buy some 20 gauge nichrome wire.
I used to make wire cutters for styrofoam this way. Worked well.

 

[Steve H]

Daveomak I was more concerned about the wires in the smoking chamber itself. Most smokers have the element installed in the wall so the wires are on the outside. I was just going to place the element in the chamber not through the wall. When people use a hot plate, still an option, wires must be exposed to the inner temperatures of the smoke correct? Don’t want burning wire smoke in my meats

Any wires inside the chamber should be high temp. wire. daveomak brought up a larger, and correct issue. Those elements won't last long at all unless there is airflow going through them.

 

[Slow42]

Thanks for all the information everyone. The plan now is to use a calrod type element from whatever I can find cheap, thanks Daveomak. My next issue is the wiring. Can I wire the element directly to a on/off switch, fuse, ssr, PID controller setup? From what I have read the PID will control the temperature in the smoker. I gather the element must be running at high all the time and will shut off when it reaches the temperature set on the PID? Is there anything wrong with this scenario?