Affixing an oven probe to MES 30 back wall?

  • Some of the links on this forum allow SMF, at no cost to you, to earn a small commission when you click through and make a purchase. Let me know if you have any questions about this.
SMF is reader-supported. When you buy through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission.

three2one

Fire Starter
Original poster
Sep 3, 2017
32
18
Kent, WA
I am brainstorming affixing an oven probe to the back wall of my MES 30 smoker. I want to attach it as close as possible to the built in thermometer.

My first thought was to staple gun it in place, but that brings up a concern of puncturing the wall as well as possibly nicking some wires behind the wall.

Also there is a concern that if the probe fails that I will have to rip it out and replace it with more punctures to install the replacement.

Maybe I am being to anal about the temp, but trying to compare apples to apples I think the probes should be in the same position to do a proper comparison. Also it would be nice to get the cord out of the way and in a fixed position.

Tell me I am nuts if you want, I can take it or offer a solution to my dilemma.

Thank you
 
Why would you want to know the temp at the built in probe???

The place you want to know the temp is right near the meat---Who cares what the temp is down 2 racks & on the back wall.
About 3" from the meat will tell you the Temp of the area the meat is in, without being so close as to be affected by the Cold meat in the beginning of the smoke.

Then you need the meat probe too, so you know when the meat is done.

I recommend something like a Maverick ET-732, or similar wireless Digital set.

Bear
 
Well no one has called me nuts yet, but it looks like someone should have.

I do have an iGrill 2 and use it every time with the oven probe and the meat probe. I did an ice test and a boil test. I am at sea level. Ice test between 29F and 34F, wouldn't hold a temp. Boil test - oven probe 208F - meat probe 210F. Don't know if that is good enough, just being close.

I am still a rookie at this stuff.

My problem is that the temp shown on the MES is lower by about 17 degrees as compared to the iGrill 2. I don't know what to trust, I guess. I am trying to get a comparison between the two at the source of the MES. As close to each other as possible.

And secondly I find the oven probe cable always in the way. I would like to affix it in a permanent location that is out of the way.

I do have a Thermapro TP20 on the way, should be here tomorrow.
 
My money would be on the iGrill 2 over the stock MES therm.
It doesn't sound like you've boil tested your iGrill 2. If you haven't done so yet just place the probe in boiling water. Water at sea level boils at 212 degrees. That boiling point will vary according to your location so just Google water boiling point your location. Then thats the temp you should get when you boil test the therm.
Gary
 
Well no one has called me nuts yet, but it looks like someone should have.

I do have an iGrill 2 and use it every time with the oven probe and the meat probe. I did an ice test and a boil test. I am at sea level. Ice test between 29F and 34F, wouldn't hold a temp. Boil test - oven probe 208F - meat probe 210F. Don't know if that is good enough, just being close.

I am still a rookie at this stuff.

My problem is that the temp shown on the MES is lower by about 17 degrees as compared to the iGrill 2. I don't know what to trust, I guess. I am trying to get a comparison between the two at the source of the MES. As close to each other as possible.

And secondly I find the oven probe cable always in the way. I would like to affix it in a permanent location that is out of the way.

I do have a Thermapro TP20 on the way, should be here tomorrow.


A couple degrees isn't a big deal on a boil test.
The point is: Put your digital iGrill smoker probe close to the Meat.
If you want the meat to be in 230° Smoker Temp, and your MES is set at 230°, and your iGrill temp is 247°, then you should adjust your MES to 213°. This should get your iGrill to read 230° which would mean your meat would be in 230°.

Affixing any Therm to the back wall will do no more than the useless MES Sensor on the back wall does.
It's only good for making adjustments, like I showed above.

And as far as the MES Meat probe goes---I haven't taken mine out of it's sheath in years.

Bear
 
Go the Thermopro TP20 in and did an ice test and a boil test. Ice test shows 36F - boil test dead on at 212F.

So I am now trying to find a starting temp to set on the MES for a cooking temp of 225F. The current temp setting is 205F. The MES is showing and holding steady around 209F.

The TP20 is ranging from 222F to 245F. I understand that there are heat up and cool down periods. So I guess to get and average of 225F I need to lower the temp to 195 or so, so that it ranges between 213 and 236. Does that make sense?
 
Yes , you're on the right track . Let it settle in for a bit , then see what the therm reads compared to the unit . I have a gen 1 30 , and the TP-20 . Do some testing , get an idea of the temp difference , and call it good . Don't become obsessed with the chamber temp . It will only drive you nuts . I only watch it when I do sausage , so I dont get to hot to fast . I dont set the alarm temp for the box . If you do , you are constantly shutting it off or raising it up . To much over run . So if you want to monitor chamber temp , just set it high , and keep an eye on it .
 
  • Like
Reactions: dr k
Yes , you're on the right track . Let it settle in for a bit , then see what the therm reads compared to the unit . I have a gen 1 30 , and the TP-20 . Do some testing , get an idea of the temp difference , and call it good . Don't become obsessed with the chamber temp . It will only drive you nuts . I only watch it when I do sausage , so I dont get to hot to fast . I dont set the alarm temp for the box . If you do , you are constantly shutting it off or raising it up . To much over run . So if you want to monitor chamber temp , just set it high , and keep an eye on it .


^^^Yes---Exactly like Chopsaw said.^^^
Plus if the big Temp swings in the beginning of your smoke bother you, check the link below:
Avoid Temp Swings in MES


Bear
 
Yes , you're on the right track . Let it settle in for a bit , then see what the therm reads compared to the unit . I have a gen 1 30 , and the TP-20 . Do some testing , get an idea of the temp difference , and call it good . Don't become obsessed with the chamber temp . It will only drive you nuts . I only watch it when I do sausage , so I dont get to hot to fast . I dont set the alarm temp for the box . If you do , you are constantly shutting it off or raising it up . To much over run . So if you want to monitor chamber temp , just set it high , and keep an eye on it .

Thank you - that helps alot.

^^^Yes---Exactly like Chopsaw said.^^^
Plus if the big Temp swings in the beginning of your smoke bother you, check the link below:
Avoid Temp Swings in MES


Bear

I read your post in the link. Very informative. Although I don't understand why it has to swing so much. Maybe the control panel just isn't starting and stopping the cycles at the correct temps. It might just be a programming thing.

Anyway the swings don't bother me so much as long as I can get an average temp I am good. Cook by meat temp anyway. The problem I was having was that cooking time on my last couple of smokes was almost two hours ahead of the expected time frame. Caught me by surprise on one as I left to do an errand with the expectation that I had three hours or so left. Returned an hour later and temp had been reached.

I think now I am a little better armed with knowledge on how to control things. Still much to learn and adjustments to make when ambient air temperatures swing wildly as well.
 
Thank you - that helps alot.



I read your post in the link. Very informative. Although I don't understand why it has to swing so much. Maybe the control panel just isn't starting and stopping the cycles at the correct temps. It might just be a programming thing.


No those Big swings happen mostly after the heating element is off.
Example:
You start a cold MES at 60°, and in a half hour it's up to 230° (your setting).
So the element shuts off at 230°, but since everything inside absorbed heat for that half hour, the temp continues to rise.
The heat it took to get it to 230° was a lot higher than 230°, so the big steel back wall & sides, were all heated far beyond 230°, and when the element stopped, the rest of the smoker continued to heat the air in the smoker.

That's why my method works to reduce the big swings, and it wasn't any problem with the functions of the unit.

Unless you have a control unit that will stop the heat before it gets to the target, you have to do that by yourself, but it's not hard to do, and you'll find out that after you get it settled down the swings will be negiigible in a very short time.

Bear
 
Bearcarver Bearcarver I keep seeing the temp sensor higher in the hybrid Gen 1 in pics, under the 2nd from the top rack. My classic all ss gen 1 40 20070311 has the sensor under/at the 2nd from the bottom rack. When the guts changed there isn't dialogue on sensor changes. If they moved the sensor higher I probably could have gotten to average 275 but didnt ever coast up to 275 in the classic.
 
OK, you're nuts. There, it needed said.
As stated, the stock MES temperature sensor can be all over the map.
And don't rack your brain at this. 100 probes can show 100 different temperatures.
They are never high precision at this level of temperature control. If you want accuracy, you need to go industrial.
And I guess you've never put a stapler to steel before. Chuckle. You learn real fast that won't work, hopefully without any embedded in you.
The repeat accuracy just does not exist at this price point. Not even at 10 times this price point.

The over-run of temperature is not unusual. What you see as the element is only a part of what is there. There is a Ni-chrome wire inside, surrounded by insulation.
I bought a separate temperature controller for below 100° use. With my MES 30 operating with the Inkbird external controller at a 1 degree differential range, there is still a drift below the set point of ~2 degrees after the controller turns on the element. Then, the controller shuts off the element at the set point as the temperature is rising.
You are expecting the rise to stop there, it does not. The current stops, but there is heat that needs to dissipate from the inside of the element. And that residual heat will push the temperature 6 degrees over the set point in my experience.

Observations of a Cold Smoke overnight session.
It looks like this, set point 65°: Oven has been operating for hours by this time, so the internal temperature is stable.
As the temperature is dropping and hits 65°, at 64° the power turns on to the element. But because it takes time for the heat to become apparent in the space of the smoker oven, the temperature reading continues to lower until the temperature is rising in the Smoker. In my tests, 2 degrees, or 62-63° at the turn around.
While the temperature rises there is electrical current still heating the element until it reaches the set point of 65°, at which point the current is shut off by the controller. But the heat is still emanating from the element internally. It takes time for the element to shed it's heat, so the temperature coasts above the set point (in this case, 65°).
For me, at my set point, and the ambient temperature at the time, I was observing about 9 degrees of swing Total. With a 1 degree controller differential setting. I was very pleased with the repeat accuracy of the controller.

Some things that might help you is to pre-heat your smoker. That allows the wide swings to stabilize before you begin "cooking". Just like pre-heating the oven in the house, you need to give the MES time to prepare itself.
Learn your Smoker. Because your smoker is going to operate a bit different than anybody else's on here. You will need to find where yours runs with external temperature monitors you find you can believe. And those are going to have tolerances as well. +/- a percentage of scale.
Often 2% is acceptable in industrial controllers or timers. 2% can be 2° above, or 2° below, the set point. So if looking at 275°, that could be 269.5°, or 280.5°, actual temperature and be within tolerance. (Using MES's controller as a temperature example.)
But these are not industrial devices, these are consumer grade devices. More of a hobbiest sort of accuracy.
To try and help you get a grip on this, Lets be generous and say the MES control has a 10% tolerance. 10% of 275° puts it +/- 27.5°. Whoa! That puts you at 247.5°, or at 302.5°
Starting to see why your MES and my MES won't be comparable in actual temperature comparison?
It's kind of like pointing a shotgun at a barn. You'll hit the barn, but kind of all over the place. :(;)

My example was with my Inkbird temperature probe mid-oven, near my meat being smoked (Flounder).
If I was to locate the Inkbird TP down nearer the element, it would probably tighten up the temperature swing considerably.

OK, your homework is to take your stapler out and try driving a staple in a steel fence post.
You will quickly find out that doesn't work either.
Keep your probes mobile. :)
 
Bearcarver Bearcarver I keep seeing the temp sensor higher in the hybrid Gen 1 in pics, under the 2nd from the top rack. My classic all ss gen 1 40 20070311 has the sensor under/at the 2nd from the bottom rack. When the guts changed there isn't dialogue on sensor changes. If they moved the sensor higher I probably could have gotten to average 275 but didnt ever coast up to 275 in the classic.

In my opinion, under the second rack from the top would be a better place for the sensor, as I would say when only one rack is used, it is most often the second rack, as it's also the one I use most.
All of my MES units have had them at the lower position.

Bear
 
  • Like
Reactions: SonnyE
In my opinion, under the second rack from the top would be a better place for the sensor, as I would say when only one rack is used, it is most often the second rack, as it's also the one I use most.
All of my MES units have had them at the lower position.

Bear
That's my go to rack as well. If MB ever tethers the controller sensor like the Mes stock meat probe so its only long enough to clip on the top three racks or just the middle two racks and can't dangle down by the heating element, that may solve sending out so many replacement controllers to replace one that is fine. Instead of saying try a level up or a level down to get your 275°max temp.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SonnyE
Same here.
Top rack holds the catch pan for my stack.
Second rack is for the item being sm00ked.
Third rack is for over flow from the second rack, or for items too tall.
4 rack is a spare for 1-3.
Any rack not in use gets set aside outside. Same with mesh sheets not in use.
No use in sm00king things that aren't going to be chewed on. ;)
 
I don't usually chuckle while getting spanked. o_O :)

You'll be fine. :p
How did the stapler and the steel fence post work out?

Don't over think it, and always eat the evidence.
If you eat the evidence of an Uhh-Ohh cook, next time anybody see's it, they won't recognize it. ;) (Except the corn...)
I always test with the dog. If he won't eat it, maybe I shouldn't neether.
(So far, he likes my cookin. I take that as a vote of confidence, and we are both alive, so good sign.)

Just put your BBQ probe (that's the dull one) near your food so you can have an idea of the heat near your food, and your meat probe (that's the sharp one) in your food at the thickest part.

100 years ago, there were no temperature probes. Great Grandma and Great Grandpa survived in spite of not knowing what the exact internal temperature was of Grannies roast. But you can bet it was well done.
And that was before we got so smart we couldn't fix a hamburger... ;):D
 
SmokingMeatForums.com is reader supported and as an Amazon Associate, we may earn commissions from qualifying purchases.

Latest posts

Hot Threads

Clicky