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Foil = Boil - Page 2  

post #21 of 97
Every TV show I have ever seen where they show people BBQ ribs at home or in competitions, show the ribs wrapped in tin foil being braised.

You need to have them out of the foil to get the smokyness, but after that, foiling does so much for a lot of cuts of meat.
post #22 of 97
Well I think you are ALL wrong!tongue.gif
post #23 of 97
ROF LMAO That's too funny.

No disrespect to the women here.
post #24 of 97
I agree and disagree with everyone's comments, now here's mine:

I recently spoke with "The Legend" Mike Mills of 17th Street BBQ and Award Winning Memphis BBQ with regards to this very topic. You can take it however you want, but I weigh his comments pretty heavily based on his accomplishments and accolades, if he didn't have an idea of what he was talking about, he wouldn't be where he is now. That said:

"....no need to foil them. Yes foil/braising does make them tender, and it's to the individual's liking. It's up to YOU, the cook, the person who's going to be eatting them in the end, how YOU like them, period.

He goes on in his book "Peace, Love and Barbecue", that one of the characteristics of the "perfect rib" is a rib that ISN'T fall off the bone, but rather has a slight tug to it but still pulls away from the bone cleanly. From his experience, and from the competitions he's competed in and won (64 of 69) fall off the bone ribs are ribs that are in fact, overcooked (by judging standards. No I don't know how accurate this is, but again, look at his track record). I'll re-iterate it again, It's up to YOU, the cook, the person who's going to be eatting them in the end, how YOU like them, period.

I'd tell your friend to compare his ribs to yours next time and find out who makes the better ribs and then you can tell him if you foiled or not.

Me personally, I no longer foil. I'm a Mike Mills follower all the way:

-210 for 6 hours, period
-NO foil
-No flipping, spinning or rotating
-Membrane removal is a MUST
post #25 of 97

Good fishing today, eh Grilla?
post #26 of 97
I can say that of the last 5 KCBS champs they all foil.A comp rib is way different then what is expected at home.The foiling allows them to layer on flavors-then sauce.Our team has done well when we didn't foil,but foiling properly-no juice-letting rib "BRAISE" in its own liquid is much different then the MUSH most folks think of as fall off bone.

Different strokes.The foil is also known as the TEXAS CRUTCH to certain BBQ folk i know of who have made a pile of money not FOILING-Taste and Tenderness win...anywhere.
post #27 of 97
i don't like foiling my ribs - tried it a few times a la 3/2/1 etc.; didn't like the fall-off-the-bone/pulled/pork texture and prefer the "slight-tug" texture of ribs that are done "traditionally." also, being an historian, i tend to settle in on traditional methods of doing things.

having said that - if that's what a person wants to do, then do it. my wife prefers CSRs to be not only boiled, but also not smoked. i can't stand it when she does that, but i can't change her mind and it is futile to try to change her mind.

traditionalists tend to be upfront and even gruff about their preferences, and that's to be expected as the old-timers are fading fast and there definitely need to be new old-timers coming up in their place who keep with the traditions. at the same time, the new-style folks tend to be condescending and a little smug with their thermometers, electric gadgets and, yes, tin foil. the ones who take the ebst of both are the ones who are going to come out ahead and set the new traditions; for instance, it wasn't that long ago that a scope on a rifle was a novelty; i can remember a story told by jack o'connor that he went on a hunt once with clark gable and another fellow who ahd a scoped rifle - the dude with the scoped rifle drew a bigger crowd than gable did - yet now, a rifle WITHOUT a scope is a little silly and/or worthy of curiosity (unless it is a lever-action cowboy-style rfile).

i like my ribs unfoiled and prefer not to braise any of my bbq, but i have done it in the past and will possibly do it in the future depending on my mood and on the folks who are coming over. the happy medium is something to be admired and i would suggest to those on both sides to get out of their comfort zone now and then so that both might know a little more about what they are talking about.
post #28 of 97
Seriously 210f for 6 hours? Do you not find that 210f takes forever?

I do them at 225f for however long it takes. I Sometimes foil, sometimes not.

Some claim Foil doesn't belong in BBQ not quite pure enough don't you know?

After all BBQ started with Oook the Caveman ( now in the employ of Geiko )One fine day Oook found a dead Mastodon Killed by a forest fire. It is still smoking from the intense heat and smoke. Oook being hungry at the time ate the meat. Wow thought OooK! Smoking meat taste good, Oook like.

Fast forward to The next forest fire. We find Oook dragging another Mastodon over to be near the heat and smoke. Mmmmmm good Oook like smoking meat. Oook think, hmmm I think I will call my new culinary method Barbecue. The first BBQ Chef cooking meat the only proper way is born.

But now we in the 21st century have strayed from the proper way to BBQ

We have foil, smokers, forks, knives grills, propane, charcoal et al. etc.

We need to toss out all of these evil things that have crept into our hobby.

Oook didn't use a rack to hold the meat on, so we should throw ours out just to be pure.

If you want to be even more pure you could throw out the water pan too. It promotes a higher humidity in the smoker....( thus steams the meat - bad bad )

Next we could eliminate the smoker itself and simply hang the meat over some coals and fan it with smoke.

Oops that's not pure either, using something to hang the meat up out of the dirt is not how Oook envisioned his invention. Get rid of all hangers and fans too for that matter.

No rock ring around a fire to direct the flames either not right you know.

I'm heading for California to do some Proper BBQing.

There are plenty of forest fires burning there , Now where the hell can I find a Mastodon. icon_mrgreen.gif

Folks, when you start calling other people names, your getting way to serious about this . smile.gif Its just food.
post #29 of 97
I'd like to know what kind of rub Oook would have used and if he brined in the sea water.
post #30 of 97
210 for 6 hours, period, per the book, straight from the horse's mouth, it works. It's no different then cooking 3-2-1 or 2-2-1. The only difference is the total amount of time that the smoker is opened and disturbed. But that's what works for him, and I've tried it myself and it works for me as well.
post #31 of 97
Smoke 'em the way you like 'em.

Pulling up "traditional/genuine" doesn't work. The first smokers weren't using offsets, or bullet smokers. I'm sure they used whatever wood was in the backyard. They had no access to meat or chamber thermos, so the temp was what it was. I have no doubt what we cook now tastes way better than what they were making then. So then why would anyone want traditonal or "genuine" smoked food? I'd love to see the look on some old time crackers' face if he could taste foiled ribs. Betcha it's way better than anything they made 100 yrs ago.

I just don't see how anyone using a modern cooker with modern fuel and tools has any business saying one way or another is traditional/genuine or not.

The day we smoke in holes in the ground with whatever wood we can find, will be the day we're smoking traditionally.
post #32 of 97
Good debate here.

To me it comes down to, if all I'm cooking is ribs - and I have 7-8 hours to get them done, then I CAN smoke them at 220 and get them tender with no foil. However, I usually do only 1-2 racks at a time, and always with something else on there (chicken, etc).

So I braise sometimes, only to get them done in 4 to 4 1/2 hours or so! Also, if you limit the time in the foil to 30 min. max, then by the time you're done - no one could really tell if they were foiled, after that last hour or so passes that firms them up again! Only giving them 30 min. in the foil also allows for some pull, and they won't taste like pulled pork. IMO...
post #33 of 97

I get mine from Sam's 500 ft. roll 22 dollars. I guess that makes me a poor man, cheap, and not respectable also.icon_confused.gif
post #34 of 97
Just this past weekend we had made up our usual ribs using the 3-2-1 method and they turned out great as usual. On Monday my brother called me up and said his friend had brought him some ribs from 17th street BBQ and asked if I wanted to try them, of course I said yes.

I will admit they were some good ribs but were they better than mine? (We did a side by side test) Well I think not, neither did my brother, his wife nor mine.

So when it is said do what works for you, I believe this to be true. I make my ribs EXACTLY to my taste so for me it's hard to find better when I tailor made mine to what I like.
post #35 of 97
I'm so far jealous now.
post #36 of 97


You nailed it my man, you nailed it.
post #37 of 97
Propane or Charcoal?
Chevy or Ford? (Thhhppt...loaded question..Dodge rocks!)

Vinegar or tomato?

I foil my ribs for long enough to start them cooking, then open the foil and drain most of the grease, leaving most of the stock...and then pour on the smoke..and I have never had a complaint about my ribs, nor have i ever taken any home..never had any left to take home..so that is good enough for me..I enjoy feeding people, and I am gratified when folks like my cooking..
I do what works and what keeps me from either wasting my expensive food, or wasting time i don't need to be fiddling with the process..repeatability is a must.

Now..if I had a big well insulated smoker that i could keep moist and smoky...I probab;y wouldn't bother..but i don't like rib jerky, so I do.
post #38 of 97
Red says ifn you want to use foil...... foil.
Ifn you don't...... don't.

Red is always right. Just ask her!
(PS.... that aint no broom she is carrying and she don't like the kitchen)
post #39 of 97
Boy am I glad I have my boots on because its getting deep around here.

GrillaInManilla I dont know what experience you have with a smoker but I bet there are a few gals around here that would give you a run for your money if not show you a thing or 2 around the smoker.
post #40 of 97
Well for it to be "boil" the liquid would have to be around 212*F, and I dont see it getting that high of a temp when the smoke box only gets around 225-250, with ribs which are colder(in respect to the smokebox) sitting in the liquid, I highly doubt the liquid boils. So technically its not getting boiled.PDT_Armataz_01_36.gif
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