Packaging stock for storage at room temperature

Discussion in 'Canning' started by wade, Sep 12, 2013.

  1. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    After being chastised regularly by my wife for throwing away the carcass remains of various cooked foods I have now started to turn the leftovers into stock on a more regular basis. Unfortunately this has meant that the limited freezer space is becoming increasingly full of vac packed frozen stock. When you go round the supermarkets these days you see vacuum packed stock displayed on the shelves at room temperature with long shelf lives that do not contain added preservatives. Does anyone here have any experience of preparing stock for storage in this way or can point me in the direction of a reliable information source.

    Preparing the stock in a clean environment goes without saying and i suspect that in order to ensure that the stock itself is sterile it would involve a period of time at elevated temperatures within a pressure cooker (?). I have a "Henkelman Boxer 42" chamber vacuum packer which will vac pack liquid filled pouches effectively.

    All advice and suggestions welcome.
  2. daveomak

    daveomak Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Wade, morning....  I don't know how they package stuff in "boxes" for long term shelf life.....   Pressure canning would be the way to go at home....  You have probably seen this....  It's worth repeating for others that may have not......   I find it interesting... the disclaimer about seafood, that I have highlighted in red....  There never seems to be an explanation as to "why"....  Maybe botulism is prevalent in seafood... I just don't know....     

    This should work for any stock that you wish to make...  Dave


    Vegetable, dried bean or pea, meat, poultry, or seafood soups can be canned.

    Caution: Do not add noodles or other pasta, rice, flour, cream, milk or other thickening agents to home canned soups. If dried beans or peas are used, they must  be fully rehydrated first.

    Please read Using Pressure Canners  before beginning. If this is your first time canning, it is recommended that you read Principles of Home Canning.

    Procedure:  Select, wash, and prepare vegetables, meat and seafoods as described for the specific foods. Cover meat with water and cook until tender. Cool meat and remove bones. Cook vegetables. For each cup of dried beans or peas, add 3 cups of water, boil 2 minutes, remove from heat, soak 1 hour, and heat to boil; drain.

    Combine solid ingredients with meat broth, tomatoes, or water to cover. Boil 5 minutes. 
    Caution:  Do not thicken. Salt to taste, if desired. Fill jars halfway with solid mixture. Add remaining liquid, leaving 1-inch headspace.

    Adjust lids and process following the recommendations in Table 1  or Table 2  according to the method of canning used.
    Table 1.  Recommended process time for Soups  in a dial-gauge pressure canner.
     Canner Pressure (PSI) at Altitudes
    Style of PackJar SizeProcess Time0 - 2,000 ft2,001 - 4,000 ft4,001 - 6,000 ft6,001 - 8,000 ft
    HotPints60* min11 lb12 lb13 lb14 lb
    * Caution: Process 100 minutes if soup contains seafoods.
    Table 2.  Recommended process time for Soups  in a weighted-gauge pressure canner
     Canner Pressure (PSI) at Altitudes of
    Style of PackJar SizeProcess Time0 - 1,000 ftAbove 1,000 ft
    HotPints60* min10 lb15 lb
    * Caution: Process 100 minutes if soup contains seafoods.

    This document was adapted from the "Complete Guide to Home Canning," Agriculture Information Bulletin No. 539, USDA, revised 2009.

    Reviewed November 2009
  3. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Thanks Dave.

    Yes I have been investigating pressure canning as an option but I had not come across the information being laid out is such a convenient format. Pressure Canners are like rocking horse poo here in the UK so I may have to import one from the USA - though there are a couple of promising ads on Ebay which I will follow up. I have also read that increasing the pressure to +15 PSI at sea level will reduce the pressure time from 60 minutes down to about 5 minutes. I guess this is due to the temperature reaching 238F (114C) at +10 PSI and 250F (121C) at +15 PSI.
  4. A pressure canner is definitely required.
    You could conceivably preserve the stock in properly pressure 'canned' retort pouches, but it'd be much more of a hassle than using reusable canning jars.

    Here are the guidelines for canning stock.

    Last edited: Sep 12, 2013
  5. daveomak

    daveomak Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    That may be true if you are cooking a roast and spuds in the pressure cooker.. tenderizes the meat faster.....

    NOT TRUE for pressure canning.....  The time is for the heat to get to the center of the pint or quart jar.... and kill botulism etc....

    NEVER change a recipe for pressure canning....  if it says 10 #'s for 30 minutes at 1000 feet elev. for pint jars..... That is what you do.....
  6. kathrynn

    kathrynn Smoking Guru OTBS Member

    I agree with what the guys have said earlier.  Also Mike Johnson does stock all the time.  Ask him what he does .....more research doesn't hurt.

  7. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    [if gte vml 1]><v:shapetype id="_x0000_t202" coordsize="21600,21600" o:spt="202" path="m,l,21600r21600,l21600,xe"> <v:stroke joinstyle="miter"/> <v:path gradientshapeok="t" o:connecttype="rect"/></v:shapetype><v:shape id="_x0000_s1033" type="#_x0000_t202" style='position:absolute; left:728.98pt;top:115.25pt;width:295.34pt;height:78.92pt;z-index:1; mso-wrap-distance-left:2.88pt;mso-wrap-distance-top:2.88pt; mso-wrap-distance-right:2.88pt;mso-wrap-distance-bottom:2.88pt' filled="f" fillcolor="white [7]" stroked="f" strokecolor="black [0]" strokeweight="2pt" o:cliptowrap="t"> <v:fill color2="white [7]"/> <v:stroke color2="white [7]"> <o:left v:ext="view" color="black [0]" color2="white [7]" weight="2pt" joinstyle="miter"/> <o:top v:ext="view" color="black [0]" color2="white [7]" weight="2pt" joinstyle="miter"/> <o:right v:ext="view" color="black [0]" color2="white [7]" weight="2pt" joinstyle="miter"/> <o:bottom v:ext="view" color="black [0]" color2="white [7]" weight="2pt" joinstyle="miter"/> <o:column v:ext="view" color="black [0]" color2="white [7]"/> </v:stroke> <v:shadow color="#e7dec9 [4]"/> <o:extrusion v:ext="view" backdepth="0" viewpoint="0,0" viewpointorigin="0,0"/> <v:textbox style='mso-column-margin:5.76pt' inset="2.88pt,2.88pt,2.88pt,2.88pt"/> <![if pub]><b:eek:tyEscherText type="OplPo" oty="1" oh="287"> <b:FUserChangedFmt priv="200">True</b:FUserChangedFmt> <b:FMoved priv="300">True</b:FMoved> <b:Txwp priv="402">0</b:Txwp> <b:Oid priv="C05">(```````````</b:Oid> <b:OidAssociated priv="D05">(```````````</b:OidAssociated> <b:Qsid priv="2704">9</b:Qsid> <b:Qva priv="3504">1</b:Qva> <b:DxlMax priv="AA04">2146041</b:DxlMax> <b:DylMax priv="AB04">1418253</b:DylMax> <b:ISptPictureShape priv="B704">0</b:ISptPictureShape> </b:eek:tyEscherText> <![endif]></v:shape><![endif][if !vml]

    Thanks you Dave and Martin for the references - my copy of the US DoA "Complete guide to Home Canning and Preserving" arrived last week. I have sourced sous vide bags for my vacuum packer that can be used up to 120C (248F). These should be fine in the pressure canner that I currently have on order from the US and is due to arrive next week.

    I met with the UK Environmental Health Agency last week to discuss pressure canning like this for both home use and for retail sale and they are going to work with me to get the appropriate shelf life lab testing done. Maybe a lengthy process but hopefully worthwhile.


  8. daveomak

    daveomak Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Wade, morning.....   Sound like you are thinking out of the box and it will work....  Cool..... Keep us in on the progress...    Dave
  9. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Hi Wade, I may be preaching to the choir here.

    There are two types of canners, dial gauge and weighted gauge.  Both use different pressures at different elevations.  Due to stock and broth being pure liquid which conducts heat quickly, the canning times are shorter than soups or other products.


    Chicken soup -  Elevation 0 - 1000 ft.  10 lbs. dial gauge, 10 lbs. weighted.

                                   "     1001- 2000 ft.  11 lbs.       "           15 lbs.       "

                              Can pints for 1 hour 15 minutes, quarts for 1 hour 30 minutes.

    Broth or stock -  Pressures same as above.

                               Can pints for 20 minutes, quarts 25 minutes.

    Of course always go by the manufactures operating instructions. Most will instruct you to vent for ten minutes prior to placing the weight on the weighted gauge canners.

      Hope this helps. Let us know how you do.

  10. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Thanks Tom

    No not preaching to the choir at all as all advice is welcome. There are a few interesting attempts on YouTube to pressure can in retort pouches and Mylar bags - some successful and others not so. We are near the coast and only at about 100ft +- so we can potentially use the additional pressure to raise the temperature even a few degrees higher. This would certainly help the sterilisation process however I think it will need several tests to see what effect, if any, this would have on the flavour of the stock. The liquid volumes in the pouches are likely to be between 350ml (0.75 US Pints) and 500ml (1.05 US Pints) so should fall into the ~20 minute mark. When I have the lab tests done I hope to not only check the generic recommended manufacturer times but also whether the times can be slightly reduced at the higher temperatures/pressures. The manufacturers recommendation are based upon the time taken to sterilise the centre of pint or quart jars - not the much thinner vacuum pouches. Obviously safely is paramount however if you don't test you don't find out.
  11. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Let us know what you find out.  The pouches could be space savers.

  12. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Forgot to ask. Do you have access to a retort ?

  13. daveomak

    daveomak Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Wade, morning......  The time temp thing is designed to kill "spores" from botulina "A,B,C,D...."   Unless you deliberately inject botulism into your packets, you won't know if they are killed during an altered methodology.... (lower temp/time type thing)   Time, temp test by the USDA, have been conducted using live cultures, as I understand it, and duplicating already proven loge reductions of live spores, would be a very expensive redundant test, in my opinion.....   

    That being said, a test to see if the bags retain their integrity, during pressure canning, would be a very valid exercise....  

    About the Sous-Vide bags.....  I've never heard of Sous-Vide being employed, at temps, in the range you are planning on using them.... 

    Do you have a manufacturer name, bag type etc. for me to look at ???   That would be really cool if I got a chamber vac machine and could pressure process food in bags and set them on the shelf....   great for emergency food, traveling, camping etc....   reheat in the pouch in water... what a convenience....     

  14. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Hi Tom

    What do you mean by Retort? I have access to retort pouches in all shapes and sizes from various manufacturers and I have a chamber vacuum packer (Heinkleman Boxer 42XL) that is capable of vac packing liquids and sealing retort pouches. The pouches I am expecting to use first though are sous vide pouches as they are rated for temperatures up to 120C (248F). 

  15. mike johnson

    mike johnson Master of the Pit Group Lead OTBS Member

    Hi all. I pressure can stock all the time. I always do it at 10 lbs. of pressure because im near sea level. I always throw the leftover carcass under the broiler to crisp up a bit and then boil till reduced by half and then fill up to top and boil back down to half again. This makes a very rich stock that I use all the time. I also pressure can for a total of 90 min since I dice up some of the chicken pieces left in the pot and add them into the jars. I don't add any salt into the stock because you can always add but you cant take it out. You can pressure cook in a pressure canner but you cannot pressure can in a pressure cooker. I would not process at a higher pressure to shorten the time though. Safety is the #1 concern when canning and I NEVER take short cuts. I wish you the best of luck and if you have any questions feel free to send my a p.m.   Oh yeah 1 more thing its addictive and you will be always needing more jars. I had to build a pantry to hold all my stuff.

    you can see the stock on the 2nd shelf. Smoke the turkey bones first for a smoked stock (delicious ).

  16. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    I am unfamiliar with your canner, but retorts are generally used by manufacturers and are able to can pallet loads of products.

  17. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Hi Dave

    I totally agree with your comments about reinventing wheels. Unfortunately, even though the testing may have been done many times before elsewhere, the UK Environmental Health Agency still require food produces like me to prove to them that the methods we are using are safe. Some wheels we cannot avoid reinventing to some degree but I do take your point that unless I actually inject Botulinum spores into the packaging it would be impossible to check whether the modified process is working. Maybe I will steer away from that nd stick with the already recommended times [​IMG]

    Sous vide is very popular in resturants and other commercial kitchens here in the UK and Europe. Bags are readily available from most of the vacuum bag suppliers. Here is a link to one of the UK bag suppliers that I use.
  18. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    For just the two of us, I'll stick to glass.  [​IMG]

    Good job Mike, everything looks good.

  19. daveomak

    daveomak Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Wade, Below is an article on Sous Vide plastics and in the links in it are notes on Bisphenol A (BPA) and EA's (Estrogen Activity) that are an extreme health concern, and the studies associated with them....    I'm sure there are more.....   What I did understand is, 195 deg F is about the maximum safe temp for some exotic plastics...
  20. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Hi Tom - Yes I know what you mean now. No I am not planning to manufacture in those quantities - to begin with at least. It will be manual vac packing and stove-top pressure canning to start - though I will be selling some (hopefully the majority) of them commercially.

Share This Page