Mr T's "Smoked Cheese From Go To Show" w/ Q- View

Discussion in 'Cheese' started by mr t 59874, Jun 11, 2012.

  1. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

                   1                  1 [​IMG]              ​
                          A piece and slices of three-year-old smoked cheddar
         Mr.T’s
           “Smoked Cheese, From Go to Show”

        Those of us who smoke cheese enjoy that little something extra, and smoking cheese is fun and easy to do.  Hard cheeses are the easiest and with the proper equipment smoked soft cheeses can add that something spectacular to any meal.

      While going to the extra effort to smoke that favorite cheese.  Why not add another dimension and age your own cheese and save some really big bucks at the same time.

      The youngest cheese that I smoke is a minimum of two years old, the oldest and best cheese I have ever eaten is, my 12 year old hickory smoked Limburger, sadly not much of that is left.

      There is a ton of controversy when it comes to aging, smoking and preserving cheese.  The following are the techniques that I have used for many years; you are welcome to glean from it what you like.


     Hopefully this will encourage someone to age, smoke and preserve their own cheese.

    Mr. T
     

    FAQ’s

    Question: Can I age store bought cheese?

    Answer: Yes, I normally will buy cheese in the cryovac package, 2 to 5 Lbs. the larger the better.   

                                                            60 Lbs. Aging Cheese
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    [​IMG]

    Question: Will it age in the package?

    Answer:  Yes it will.  Make sure there are no leaks that would allow liquids to escape and contaminates to enter. Waxed cheeses although will age better. A very dry cheese can age for years, while moist cheeses will simply get old.

    Question:  At what temperature should I store the cheese?

    Answer:  Store hard cheeses at temperatures between 70°F - 21°C & 35°F - 2°C. The ideal aging temp is 52°F - 11°C  to 56°f - 13°C.   My hard cheeses are kept at a minimum of 45°F - 7°C.  The closer to 70°F - 21°C, the faster it will age. Softer cheeses should be stored in the cooler range of 50°F - 10°C to 35°F - 2°C.

    Question:  How long can I age my cheese?

    Answer:  I don’t know of any limits in time.  The longest I have aged a cheese is the 12-year-old Limburger.  I have read that some have aged Cheddar for 25 years and more.  Cheddar’s flavor becomes increasingly sharp; its firm texture becomes more granular and crumbly with age.  Cheese never stops aging.  Left long enough, mild cheddar will turn into extra sharp.  A semi – hard/hard cheese will never spoil as long as it is vacuum packed and refrigerated.  It gets better with age also.
    Ready to be Smoked
    3   
    [​IMG]

    Question:  How much should I smoke at one time?

    Answer:   Smoke according to the size of the block.  I smoke cheese as we need it.    Cut your blocks into sections approximately the size of a quarter pound stick of butter for better smoke penetration. A one pound block may be cut in half, while a two or five pound block will need to be sectioned for good smoke absorption.
    4​
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    Question: What temperature should cheese be prior to smoking?

    Answer: It depends on how much smoke you want your cheese to take on. The cooler the cheese the more smoke it will take on in a time period, this is desired when smoking cream type cheese and helps in avoiding melting. If a more mild smoke is desired, allow the harder cheese to come to ambient temperature prior to smoking.

    Bring it to ambient temperature in it's original packaging before cutting into desired blocks. This will avoid a skin from developing on the surface, and allow the smoke to better penetrate the cheese.

    Question:  At what Temperatures should I smoke?
    Answer:  Consider that cheese will begin to change its texture at 80°F - 27°C so; a true cold smoke will be needed.   The definition of a true cold smoke is 90°F - 32°C or less.    To preserve the quality of the cheese, mine is pulled from the smoker if the internal smoker temperature reaches 70°F -to 75° then, if needed, continue when the elements are cooler.   The smoking time is continued from when it was pulled from the smoker.  Do not smoke below 35°F - 2°C. Hard, semi-hard, soft and cream cheeses may be smoked at 55°F - 13°C.


    Note: You can take the cheese on up to the melting point if you like and it may still be desirable to your taste, but the quality of the cheese will be lost.
     

    Question:  How long should I smoke the cheese?

    Answer:  Only experience will determine this as it really depends on your taste.

      I usually will smoke the hard cheeses for two hours depending on the density of the smoke and type of wood used. The harder the cheese the more dense smoke it can take.  If it is a caramel color you are looking for, a dense smoke for 5 hours may be required.  Depending on the type and texture of your cheese, monitor the smoke as a lighter smoke will sometimes infuse a more desirable flavor than a heavy dense smoke will.  Cream or blues will take a much shorter smoking time than the harder cheeses. Some softer cheeses may be done in half an hour.

       Learn to keep good records.  In your records note the type of cheese, ambient temperature, internal smoker temperature, type and amount of wood, the density of the smoke and, of course, the time, color and taste.
    Ready for Smoker
    5​
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    Question: What woods should I use?

    Answer:   Hickory, apple, cherry and alder among others work very well.

    Question:  Okay it’s smoked. Now what?

    Answer:  Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day.  If it is going to be consumed soon, wrap in a cling type wrap and put in fridge or store at previously discussed temperatures. It is best to let hard cheese rest at room temperature for two to three weeks to allow the smoke to permeate the cheese. Depending on the type of cheese, if it is going to be kept for a few months, coat it with olive or vegetable oil and place on a rack in a container and refrigerate.  Reapply oil every two weeks.  A damp paper towel may be kept in the container to provide added moisture.  After slicing some for use, reapply oil.  The oil will help keep mold from forming on the outside.  If the cheese is going to be aged further, it is waxed and stored as usual.  Of course, it can be vacuum sealed also.

    Question:   Can I freeze my cheese before or after smoking?

    Answer:    It’s my opinion that, the quality of the cheese is seriously compromised by freezing.

    Question:  What cheeses can be waxed?


    Answer:  Only the hard cheeses should be waxed, Cheddar, Swiss, Colby, etc. The less moisture you have in your cheese the better for waxing.

    Question:  Can I use paraffin to wax cheese?

    Answer:  No.  Paraffin is not pliable and will crack and break in time allowing contaminates in and molds to form. Use only wax designated as cheese wax. It will remain pliable and allow your cheese to breathe which aids in aging. It will also take a much higher heat when melting which when applied, helps in preventing mold.

    Question:  At what temperature should I heat the wax?


    Answer:  Germs are killed at 180°F - 82°C. To prevent mold, heat wax to 225°F - 107°C - 240°F - 116°C or the wax manufacturer's suggested temperature.  BE CAREFUL if taken too high, the waxes flash point may be reached.  To prevent pinholes, apply three coats by dipping or brushing the wax on.  To prevent melting the first coat of wax, apply the additional coats at a lower temp, 160°F - 71°C.

    Note:  1 - Use a designated pan to melt wax in, not a good one. 

                2 - Suggest using a hot plate rather than a gas stove for obvious reasons.

    Question:   Can I use a double boiler to melt the wax?

    Answer:   Not for the first coating. Water boils at 212°F - 100°C at sea level and generally decreases 2°F - -17°C per 1000 ft as elevation increases.  Therefore, the desirable temperatures cannot be reached. 
    Waxed Cheddar
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    Question:  Where can I get Cheese wax?

    Answer:  Cheese making suppliers will have it or, it may be purchased on line.
    Vacuum Packed
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    [​IMG]

    The below cheeses are what is kept on the kitchen counter for short time use.  Note the aged 4-year-old cheddar has been on the counter for three months, no mold.
    8​


    Question: How is cheese properly served?

    Answer:   Number one rule: Do not eat cheese cold or straight from the refrigerator. The cold temperature hinders the natural flavors and fragrance  of the cheese. The aromatic and complex flavors of cheese don't really begin to appear until the cheese is at room temperature.

    To enjoy all the flavors and aromas of any cheese it is important that it be served at room temperature (72°) or its proximity.

    Cheese is composed largely of fat.  Since fat means flavor, the goal is to amplify it as much as possible. When fat molecules are cold, they contract, when they warm, they relax, allowing a greater perception of flavor.

    Pull your cheese out of the refrigerator at least an hour to a hour and a half before serving.  To keep your cheese from drying out, never unwrap your cheese when you bring it out of the refrigerator.  If serving waxed cheese at room temperature, wait until ready to serve before removing wax or if wrapped, unwrapping.

    Be careful, though, especially in the summer months, if you warm up the cheese too much, it'll start to sweat and melt in unappetizing ways. Try to keep it at or around 72°.

    To cut any cheese properly—hard or soft —use a good chef's knife or a good all-purpose utility knife. To cut very soft, cheese such as chevre cleanly, use a length of stretched dental floss.

     Serving cheese after the main course, prior to or in place of dessert, adds an elegant touch to casual dinners.  If served before dinner, with cocktails, remember that cheeses can be filling.  Serve in limited quantities and variety. 

    If serving more than one type of cheese, provide separate knives for each cheese. Do not overcrowd the serving tray, as guest will need room to slice the cheeses.
     

    Question:   What do I do if I find mold on my cheese?

    Answer:    The mold on hard or semi-soft cheeses may be washed with a scrub brush or, cut away and re-waxed or oiled.

     

    Soft cheeses, such as cottage cheese, cream cheese, and ricotta cheese, that have mold  should be discarded. The same goes for any kind of cheese that's shredded, crumbled or sliced.

    With these cheeses, the mold can send threads throughout the cheese. In addition, harmful bacteria, such as listeria, brucella, salmonella and E. coli, can grow along with the mold.

    Mold generally can't penetrate far into hard and semisoft cheeses, such as cheddar, colby, Parmesan and Swiss. So you can cut away the moldy part and eat the rest of the cheese. Cut off at least 1 inch (2.5 centimeters) around and below the moldy spot. Be sure to keep the knife out of the mold so it doesn't contaminate other parts of the cheese.

    Of course, not all molds pose a risk. In fact, some types of mold are used to make cheeses, such as Brie, Camembert and Blue's. These molds are safe to eat.

    Note: Store blue-veined and other intentionally moldy cheeses away from other cheeses as the mold spores can contaminate other cheeses.

    If you're not sure what type of cheese you have or what to do if it grows mold, the safe course is to discard it.

    Question: Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?

    Answer:   
    It could be as simple as applying too much smoke. It's imperative that you monitor the color and density of your smoke as there are many outside influences that can change both. Take the time that others smoke with a grain of salt, use it possibly as a guide but, not knowing the color and density of their smoke, their info is mostly useless.  And they may have a bitter taste out of the smoker themselves.

    Remember, regardless the smoke generator you are using, the whiter the smoke, the more unforgiving it is as shorter smoking times are required.

     Many tend to over smoke their cheese making it inedible when it comes out of the smoker, thereby they vac-seal it and let it set sometimes for months before they can consume it. You don’t deliberately over smoke a chicken then let it rest for weeks before eating it, so why would you do it to cheese?

    For an example as to learn how to smoke cheese that is edible right after being smoked, take a block of cheddar and cut it into bite sizes. While taking good notes, place the pieces into your smoker/product chamber and begin applying smoke. At 20 or 30-minute intervals take a taste test of one of your samples. When you get to your desired taste, pull the cheese, you are done. This can be done using many different smoke applications.

    The heavier and more dense the smoke the sooner it will be done, possibly in as little as a few minutes. A lighter, thin smoke applied from a distant fire box may take hours. This is something you have to take into consideration when being advised as to how long to smoke a product without knowing the kind of smoke used.

    When done, note the color of your cheese, this is what you want to shoot for in future smokes. The color of the cheese will depend on the type of smoke being used along with the wood.

    Creosote = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the ones pictured below. Using an smoke generator inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. 

    An attempt was made in the following threads to demonstrate how to significantly prevent a bitter taste on a product from occurring. You will notice a great difference between placing a smoke generator inside the product chamber/smoker and placing it in an external firebox and piping the smoke to the chamber. Piping the smoke to a chamber produces a much cleaner smoke. The longer the run from the firebox to the chamber, the cleaner the smoke will be, meaning less creosote deposits. AMNPS & Smoke Daddy Myths?  -  Cleaning up your act - clean smoke is delicious smoke!

    Now, how do we replicate the smokers of old in today’s environment? We start by using a remote firebox and pipe the smoke produced by your smoke generator of choice to the product chamber, which could be your smoker or a cardboard box, whatever you want to use. To cool the smoke as much as possible, the firebox is also being used as a heat sink, the more mass the better. The pipe used (preferably single wall stovepipe) to transport the smoke will also act as a heat sink so the longer it is, the better the results.

     Examples:



    The above is an example using an Smoke Daddy Big Kahuna smoke generator in conjunction with a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber. 


    The above is example using a tray type pellet smoke generator inside a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber.


    The above example uses a tray type smoke generator inside a mailbox feeding an MES.


    The above example is using a MES cold smoke attachment feeding an MES.

    Question:   Can I get this type of cheese on-line?

    Answer:   Yes and here is a link to get you started.

                       https://www.wisconsincheesemart.com/cheese/

                 Mr. T's  Christmas 2015 Gift Cheese - Aged - Smoked - Waxed

                                                          03 / 27 / 2015


                                                     3.5-year-old Cheddar


    It took 20 hours of light white smoke to reach the desired color. Used Pitmaster pellets with AMNPS 

    in a remote iron stove 8 feet away.  Highest temperature reached during smoke, 68.5°.


    20 hours of smoke compared to non-smoked.  The streaks in the cheese were caused by the

    1/4 cup of whey that escaped from the aging cheese while inside the original packaging for 3.5 years.


    Pie pan used for dipping.


    First coat of wax applied at 240° to deter mold growth.  Additional coats applied at 160°.


    Info tags applied to still wet second coat.


    After three coats of wax, it is now ready for further aging or until the Holidays.

    Note:   The cheese rested overnight before waxing.  A taste test revealed a very mild non-bitter taste.

                I cannot over-emphasize the importance of using a remote smoke generator in order to cool and clean the

                smoke prior to coming into contact with the cheese. It eliminates much if not all of any bitter taste.

    2016 Christmas Gift Cheese - Aged - Smoked - Waxed  - 6 and 9 year old cheese

    Mr. T’s 2016 Christmas Gift Cheese - Aged – Smoked - Waxed

    Included in this year’s gift cheeses are five pounds of 6-year-old Tillamook Medium Cheddar and two pounds of 9-year-old Tillamook Extra Sharp Cheddar.

    Some left unsmoked the rest received 18 hours of a very light cob smoke before waxing. The following was the process.


    Selected cheese



    The corn cob pellets used in a tray type smoke generator were a combination of whole and broken pellets. An earlier test made on fresh cheese determined the color/taste desired which took 20 hours of smoke.


    6-year-old Tillamook Medium Cheddar


    9 - year- old Tillamook Extra Sharp Cheddar


    Residual liquid from each package, 7 tsp. from the 5 # of medium cheddar, 4 tsp. from the 2 # of extra sharp. Note the extra oil/fat in the whey of the extra sharp. This is a natural occurrence especially when aging cheddar cheese and nothing to be concerned over.


    Six hours into the smoke, could not help the reflections.


    Sixteen hours into the smoke, note the color and density of the smoke.


    Wax used


    Cheese ready for dipping. You can see the difference between the non-smoked and smoked cheese. The cheese went directly from smoker to the waxing table.


    First dip in 220° - 225° wax to kill bacteria and prevent molding. The subsequent two dips are at 160° for secure seal.


    After second dip, identifiers are applied to still hot wax.


    After third dip, the cheese is ready for continued aging.

    Note:  Test results after removing from smoker were the Medium was now Extra Sharp with a good smoke flavor. The Extra Sharp was sharp yet surprisingly mellow with a good smoke flavor. The extra sharp had to be cut carefully as it was brittle and wanted to break, it will be good used as grated or chunked cheese.

    Related Threads:   My Cold Smoking Options w/Q - View  -  Mr T's "Smoked Cheese From Go To Show" w/ Q- View

    Tom

    Additional Information:

    Understanding Smoke Management

    http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/139474/understanding-smoke-management

    My Cold Smoking Options

    http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123840/my-cold-smoking-options-w-q-

    Moldy Cheese

    http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/food-and-nutrition/AN01024

    Listeria in soft cheese made with unpasteurized milk such as queso fresco, Feta, Brie and Camembert.

    http://www.foodsafety.gov/poisoning/causes/bacteriaviruses/listeria/

    view

                                                                Tillamook Cheese

                  Type                                              Aged                                             Uses

    Medium Sharp Cheddar                           60 days                        snack, sandwich, main dish

    Sharp Cheddar                                    Nine + months                        appetizer or main dish

    Reserve Extra Sharp                                2 years                                    gourmet side dishes

                                                                                    compliments smoked salmon and  sauces

    Vintage White Extra sharp Cheddar        2 + years                      companion to fruit and wine

    Vintage Medium White Cheddar            100 + days                             well with fruit and wine

    Monterey Jack                                                                                           topping on any dish

    Pepper Jack                                                                 southwest recipes, snack with crackers

    Swiss                                                                                                                       burgers and soup

    Colby                                                                         sandwiches appetizer with crackers or bread
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
  2. dls1

    dls1 Smoking Fanatic

    Another very impressive tutorial Mr T. As with your ones on salmon and kraut , this pretty much gives me, as well as others, a solid foundation. In other words, how much more do I really need to know to produce an outstanding product. Nice pics and the BV looks like it would make a great partner with aged and smoked cheddar.

    My only problem is my lack of patience with the aging. I guess I need to seek out well aged cheese.

    Thanks again for your effort and sharing.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2012
  3. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    dls. My pleasure.  Thank you very much for the kind words.  
     
  4. Great!!! To the point and very informative. Thank you!
     
  5. thoseguys26

    thoseguys26 Master of the Pit

    Great info, thank you. I've only aged provolone for six months before smoking. It was delicious.
     
  6. uechikid

    uechikid Fire Starter

    One of the moderators should make this thread a sticky.  So much great information in one thread.
     
  7. driedstick

    driedstick Smoking Guru OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    very good info i will bookmark this page if you dont mind
     
  8. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Glad you found the info helpful.  Of course you may bookmark.  If I can help in anyway, post in this thread or you may PM me.

    Mr. T
     
  9. MrT, This great info is outstanding!  My son in Tacoma loves smoked cheese, and I am going to visit next month.  I will be using your tips to smoke some for him.  Thank you so much for sharing.  Keep on keeping on.  Steve
     
  10. Very cool...  Because of this post, I'm going to attempt my first cheese smoke this weekend.  I've got some extra sharp cheddar, some colby, and some Colby-Jack cheeses.  How long do you usually let the cheeses rest after a smoke before you cut into them?  I'll probably not be able to wait that long. [​IMG]
     
  11. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    HiTechRed Neck,

      Congratulations on your first cheese smoke.  To answer your question, a week’s rest will give the cheese some time to mellow out.  As this will be your first smoke with cheese go ahead and take some samples as the cheese is curing.  It will give you an idea on the importance of curing.  The longer it cures, the better it will be.  Take very good notes on everything (ambient temperature, smoker temperature, type of cheese and wood along with the amounts, smoke density, time and flavor) as they will be valuable in the future.

      One word of caution though.  I see you live in the San Antonio area.  The temperature at night is in the seventies and pushing one hundred during the day.  As the cheese’s texture will begin to change at 80°, I pull mine when the smoker temperature reaches 70 -  75°.  Unless you have a way of keeping your temperature down, I would recommend waiting until cooler weather arrives.  Your cheese will keep just fine and even get better in the fridge.  Patience now means quality later.  While you are waiting for cooler weather, it is a good time to stock up.

    Maybe this will help a little further. 

    My Cold Smoking Options

    http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/forum/newestpost/123840

    Good luck and keep us posted.  If I can help any further, please ask.

    Mr. T
     
  12. scarbelly

    scarbelly Smoking Guru OTBS Member

    First - Thanks to Mr T for a great post on smoking cheese

    Most of us who have been smoking cheese for a while let it rest in the fridge for a minimum of two weeks. I personally like 4-6 weeks. I have some that is 14 months old and Nepas just opened some that was aged 20 months.

    Here is a link to the cheese section which has lots of posts on this subject 

    http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/f/2166/cheese

    If you want instant gratification try some fresh mozzarella - here is a link to some I have done 

    http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/101771/smoked-mozzarella
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2012
  13. backwoods bbq

    backwoods bbq Meat Mopper

    so you age your cheese First? then smoke? do you age after you smoke it also?
     
  14. Yup check out post #12  [​IMG]
     
  15. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Backwoods,

    Yes most of my cheese begins aging in the package it was purchased in, plastic or wax.  It is then smoked and depending on when it is intended for use it is either vacuum packed and held for up to another three months or  for the prime cheese, I  wax it after smoking and keep it for an indefinite amount of time. This allows the smoke to mellow throughout the whole block and continue to age at a faster rate.
     
  16. hoity toit

    hoity toit Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    thankx for the good post!!!
     
  17. sidpost

    sidpost Fire Starter

    Thank you Mr. T!  That is an impressive post for a newbie like myself looking to smoke cheese.
     
  18. mr t 59874

    mr t 59874 Master of the Pit SMF Premier Member

    Your welcome, have fun and enjoy.  Any questions, please ask.

    Tom
     
  19. forluvofsmoke

    forluvofsmoke Smoking Guru OTBS Member

    Nice thread! Bumping this up so others can catch what I missed.

    That settles it for me...my cheeses are getting smoke in the AM! No point in waiting when the cheese can only get better over time!

    Eric
     
  20. bamajon

    bamajon Smoke Blower

    Great thread.  I've been wanting to start smoking cheese for a long time now.  Pinneywoods gave me an amaz-n-smoker to use so now i have no excuse.  thanks to him and this thread i think i got what i need.  I'll let you guys know how it goes.  Thanks again.
     

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