Binder Question

  • Some of the links on this forum allow SMF, at no cost to you, to earn a small commission when you click through and make a purchase. Let me know if you have any questions about this.
SMF is reader-supported. When you buy through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission.

old poi dog

Master of the Pit
Original poster
OTBS Member
Aug 26, 2007
1,232
11
Maui, Hi.
Aloha All,

What is the purpose of a  "binder" in a sausage?  I think I have read somewhere that it is used when smoking sausages. These would be soy protein and or powdered milk yes?   Thank you for helping me along.
 
[h3]Water Binders[/h3]
Soy protein powders are added at around 2% as the larger amounts will affect the taste and flavor of the product. They bind water extremely well and cover fat particles with fine emulsion. This prevents fats from lumping together. Their ability to produce gel contributes to the increased firmness of the product. The sausage will be juicier, plumper and with less shrivelling but the amount of added soy protein concentrate should not exceed 3% otherwise it may impart a “beany” flavor to the product. 
Soy protein isolate  is a natural product that contains at least 90% protein and no other ingredients. Soy protein isolate is stronger and costlier of the two and can bind 5 parts of water. 
Soy protein concentrate, available from most online distributors of sausage making supplies is a natural product that contains 70% protein plus other ingredients, for example, ash and some fibres. It binds 4 parts of water and it improves the texture of the sausage. 
Non fat dry milk  powder can bind water and is often used in making sausages, including fermented types. Dry milk powder contains 50% lactose (sugar) and is used in fermented sausages as a source of food for lactic acid producing bacteria. It also contains around 35% of protein, about 0.6 - 1% fat and may be considered a healthy high energy product. Dry milk powder greatly improves the taste of low fat sausages. Non fat dry milk powder is a good natural product and it does not affect the flavor of the product. It is added at about 3% and effectively binds water and emulsifies fats. Its action is very similar to that of soy protein concentrate.
Carrageenan  is a natural extract from red seaweeds used in processed foods for stabilization, thickening, and gelation. Carrageenan can bind plenty of water and about 0.01% (1 g per kg of meat) can increase the yield of the finished product up to 8%. Carrageenan forms a solid gel during cooling.
great read, check out this whole website when you get a chance:

http://www.wedlinydomowe.com/sausage-making/additives
 
Last edited:
You have it correct Val, they help retain liquid's that would otherwise be lost during the long smoke process
 
Re: nonfat dry milk powder

The store-box product found in boxes in most supermarket aisles is quite a bit coarser in texture than the 'powder' one can order from several sausage-making vendors. In order to replicate the finer texture of the latter, I put the coarser NFDM into my processor and, after a few 'bursts,' the resulting texture is quite similar to the finer powdered product. I then store it in an air-tight container.

-Kevin
 
Many types of binders out there.

SPC

Soy powder

rice flour

buckwheat flour (found in mkts, health food in clear package)

whey powder (un flavored)

knox gelatin  clear

karo clear

cory syrup solids

fat trim from beef or pork
 
SmokinHusker, Josh, DanMcG, Kevin, and Nepas,

Ahh..Haa...Thank you my friends!  I will get some of that NFDM at the grocer's and pulse it in my food processor. So according to the read above, for 5 lbs of meat that is roughly 2.25 kilograms, I should add no more than 67.5 grams of nonfat dry milk. 

Thanks once more friends....
icon14.gif
 
SmokinHusker, Josh, DanMcG, Kevin, and Nepas,

Ahh..Haa...Thank you my friends!  I will get some of that NFDM at the grocer's and pulse it in my food processor. So according to the read above, for 5 lbs of meat that is roughly 2.25 kilograms, I should add no more than 67.5 grams of nonfat dry milk. 

Thanks once more friends....
icon14.gif


The finer NFDM for sausage making  is different than the stuff for making milk, not that it won't, work but the binding properties may not be the same, personally I like to use the soy protein as it is just plain better for you
 
I use a lot of store bought NFDM cause I'm always running out of the fancy sausage shop stuff. it works for me, but never have done a side by side comparison
 

Classification

Typical Processing Treatment

Undenatured Whey Protein Nitrogen* (mg/g)

Recommended Applications

Low-heat

Cumulative heat treatment of milk not more than 70ºC for 2 minutes

> 6.00

Fluid milk fortification, cottage cheese, cultured skim milk, starter culture, chocolate dairy drinks, ice cream

Medium-heat

Cumulative heat treatment of 70 -78ºC for 20 minutes

1.51 - 5.99

Prepared mixes, ice cream, confectionery, meat products

High-heat

Cumulative heat treatment of 88ºC for 30 minutes

< 1.50

Bakery, meat products, ice cream, prepared mixes
 
I never really studied it to much Harry, but I think it just comes down to proteins binding the water and fats. I'm sure the made for binding NFDM works better but how much better? One of us needs to do the side by side test. (not me
rolleyes.gif
)

Thanks for the link.
 
Last edited:
I use the soy protein concentrate.  The milk solids are not that much cheaper, are they? Although more readily available for many?

I would be interested to know the difference?

Good luck and good smoking.
 
I never really studied it to much Harry, but I think it just comes down to proteins binding the water and fats. I'm sure the made for binding NFDM works better but how much better? One of us needs to do the side by side test. (not me
rolleyes.gif
)

Thanks for the link.


Well I just bought a big bucket full of the NFDM from sausage maker so I probably wont  be trying it any time soon..

 Poi Dog if you add your ingredients for your sausage to water b4 you mix it in you don't have to  pulverize the NFDM it should dissolve in the water
 
Interesting info here. I too would like too know. Sounds like someone needs to do some experimenting, and post up the results. I would do it but I am not set up to do sausage yet.
 
I guess not all dried milk is created equal.. while looking for what the sausage maker suppliers NFDM had for protein percentage I happened across a manufactures site that offers dried milk products up to 85%

http://www.hoogwegtus.com/en/products/milk-products/milk-protein-concentrate-85/

I have used both store bought and Butchers & Packers product and don't remember any difference in the finished product, but I wasn't looking for any either so I may have missed it.

One thing that's different about the product is B&P's is ground ultra fine (like cornstarch ) where as store bought is flakes the size of kosher salt. But like Harry (Big Casino) said if you dissolve it in your liquid first size wouldn't matter.

hijack.gif
sort of :)
 
Hi Slownlow, (or anyone else that may know)

Do you think there would be a problem in using whole powdered milk instead of the ingredient "Non Fat Powd Milk" Seems like all the recipes call for NonFat and none ever say just powd milk... Just why the nonfat?

Leo
 
Hey Big Casino,

I currently have whole powdered milk (and not NFDM as what is called for in all these recipes) Does the whole milk not work in fermented sausages like salami of is it because NFDM is more available than W Milk?

Leo
 
SmokingMeatForums.com is reader supported and as an Amazon Associate, we may earn commissions from qualifying purchases.

Latest posts

Hot Threads

Clicky